Is it bad for you?

[Arlecchino]

Glad to see this (kinda-sorta) got back on track.

[Arlecchino]

Originally Posted by Massg

I've read things from all over and am getting mixed messages. I really want to get into heavier lifting after getting bored with endurance/bodybuilding training. Now I am reading into 5X5 training and eventually hoping to get into WSBB and Metal Militia. However I am only 14, and many sources are claiming it is hazardous to growth and development: and some are claiming the opposite. If I can get some input that would be great. Thanks.

No.

There is not a single shred of evidence supporting the rumor that premature closure of the epiphyseal plates which would result in the stunting of growth.

[Newbtime]

Originally Posted by Rawngus

Stats 6'2







................................ o nvm

[UHCougar05]

Originally Posted by Arlecchino

Glad to see this (kinda-sorta) got back on track.

Thread on track? In this forum?

[Massg]

The Quote that provoked me to post this:

"Because your bones, joints, and tendons are still growing and developing, it's easy to overdo it and strain or even permanently damage them. When you're in the middle of a strength-training session and something doesn't feel right to you, you feel pain, or if you hear or feel a "pop" when you're in the middle of a workout, stop what you're doing and have a doctor check it out before you resume training.."

Never even pulled a muscle lifting before and the thought damaging things permanently scared me into believing it. I guess I got over it and am going to start seriously probably towards the start of school (keeps me on a stricter routine). I would like some general advice FROM SOMEONE WHO KNOWS WHAT THEY'RE DOING as to where to get started, whats really necessary (belts, wraps, etc.), and a general what to do routine when I first start (2X2 routines look kind of unrealistic now). I'm probably going to post new threads on this and am hoping the forums can give me some to dos/don'ts. Used site previously for finding good isolation exercises and somewhat of a nutritional guideline, but now am going to really get into it. If anyone feels like proving how smart they are and giving some sound advice please feel free to contact me. Again, any input is appriciated.

[someonefat]

Starting at 14 is considered late for most sports, I see tons of football kids lifting when they are 12 and almost all start lifting around 13. I would personally think 13ish be optimal for heavy training anything under just work body weight and technique. Its debatable though.

[The_cannibal]

Originally Posted by someonefat

Starting at 14 is considered late for most sports, I see tons of football kids lifting when they are 12 and almost all start lifting around 13. I would personally think 13ish be optimal for heavy training anything under just work body weight and technique. Its debatable though.

Agreed.

Originally Posted by Massg

The Quote that provoked me to post this:

"Because your bones, joints, and tendons are still growing and developing, it's easy to overdo it and strain or even permanently damage them. When you're in the middle of a strength-training session and something doesn't feel right to you, you feel pain, or if you hear or feel a "pop" when you're in the middle of a workout, stop what you're doing and have a doctor check it out before you resume training.."

Anyone who gets injured while training, no matter their age, should go see a doc, so this really has no relevance.

Now, like Arlecchino said, there's no evidence that training at a young age could have any bad effects. I can quote you a bunch of studies from PubMed if you want.

You should make sure to always use proper form while doing the lifts and do not increase the weights if the increase results in bad form. This is true at any age. Injury rates are neither greater nor lower at a young age, especially if you are supervised.

As for a good routine, look into Rippetoe's Starting Strength. I wrote a thread on beginner's routines a little while ago. I also trained many young athletes in the past, and still do now.

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hp?t=115994851

[pojo18]

Originally Posted by Massg

I've read things from all over and am getting mixed messages. I really want to get into heavier lifting after getting bored with endurance/bodybuilding training. Now I am reading into 5X5 training and eventually hoping to get into WSBB and Metal Militia. However I am only 14, and many sources are claiming it is hazardous to growth and development: and some are claiming the opposite. If I can get some input that would be great. Thanks.

its not hazardous to your health man. i started lifting at 12. and got serious around my 14th birthday. get on a simple program like rippetoes and learn the basics. get your form down . its great to start young.

[Massg]

Thanks everyone for everything. I'll stay off the internet to stop getting paranoid that squatting makes you shrink and all that. I am assuming that most cases of growth issues were a result of poor nutrition and rest. I'll probably be back tomorrow morning asking more newbie questions that you don't feel like answering.

[Gaash]

Originally Posted by brudman

Oh. I didn't know Wall Street was in Philadelphia now. Must have moved. Interesting.

or I moved. Probably easier than Moving Wall Street don't you think? Genius.

[MattS1985]

I find this funny since young kids are strapping on football helmets playing tackle football tearing acl's an that's fine. Running an jumping can put up to 6 times bodyweight on your bones, joints, etc an that's fine. But strength/powerlifting style training no way.....WTF?

[Arlecchino]

Originally Posted by MattS1985

I find this funny since young kids are strapping on football helmets playing tackle football tearing acl's an that's fine. Running an jumping can put up to 6 times bodyweight on your bones, joints, etc an that's fine. But strength/powerlifting style training no way.....WTF?

Yeah. Injury rate is much lower in PL'ing than in many other sports. But people rarely allow reality to get in the way of their opinion.

[UHCougar05]

Originally Posted by Arlecchino

Yeah. Injury rate is much lower in PL'ing than in many other sports. But people rarely allow reality to get in the way of their opinion.

One should never let facts stand in the way of an argument.

[theduffman]

Originally Posted by trap-bar

now hold on for a minute you hippy. ive been hunting since i was 12(7th grade i think) and i have NEVER been a risk to anyone. you need to go kiss obama's ***

I voted obama over Mccain and I think kids can start hunting as long as they're strong enough to hold a gun properly and have adequate supervision.

to OP: Lifting is fine. Anything dangerous about it is just as dangerous when you do other s hit your age. Just focus on form and strength will follow
/thread

[Retardo-pex]

Originally Posted by Gaash

And do some research on them after they retire....especially the gymnasts, at what age, 20 if they are lucky?. And research how many injuries/etc. they have? And how many of them go through puberty late/never?

And to Isaku, yes, u are right, the argument does hold for any sport, too much sport at a young age is dangerous. Problem is it's much easier to do 'too much' powerlifting given the intensity vs other sports.

Unless they really have been training for at least a few years or are genetic freaks the amount of force a 14 year old new to the sport is going to be placing on their muscles/joints/tendons is far less than if they played basketball every day.

The fact is if you do a sport recreationally at any age the chance of injury is always present but not necessarily a given. If you want to be GOOD at any sport the chance of injury increases. Most athletes begin their training at a young age, olympians don't retire at 20 because they are so broken down with injuries and arthritis they can't leave their houses, its simply that for many sports 20+ is past their prime and they can no longer compete with the 15 and 16 year old athletes (that have been training for most of their lives)

[lifterg]

Strength training (and PL) has ALWAYS gotten a bad rap in most schools and the medical community. Stupid myths from personal experience:
1. a D1 football coach not allowing players to squat because it ruined their knees.
2. mom of a fat kid telling me her son shouldn't lift because it will stunt his growth. He would not have been able to lift anything exceeding the weight of his own body fat.
3. high school football coach telling his kids not to deadlift because it doesn't apply to football.
4. middle school PE teacher wanting to keep smith machine in weight room instead of power cage.
5. swim coach saying swimmers will get muscle bound.
6. boxing coach telling buddy lifting would make him slow, about 30 minutes before he knocked the coaches star out cold.
7. pediatrician telling me muscle soreness can constitute child abuse.
8. as many more as anyone would want.

My pet peave (my opinion):
Why do middle schools encourage youth athletes to join running clubs at school and not give them year round access to the weight room?
You can get aerobically trained for most sports in 6 weeks (or less). A foundation for strength training takes years. Running through middle school will make no appreciable difference in sports performance (for non-running specific sports) in high school. Lifting through middle school will result in a bigger, faster, stronger and more injury resistant athlete. This will improve performance in virtually any sport, with the possible exception of Xcountry (and I would argue that as well).

I think the attitude and misinformation regarding youth lifting is really an extension of the fact that people in general (including alleged professionals, coaches, trainers and doctors) are mostly clueless about strength training.

[grace_ou]

Originally Posted by lifterg

Strength training (and PL) has ALWAYS gotten a bad rap in most schools and the medical community. Stupid myths from personal experience:
1. a D1 football coach not allowing players to squat because it ruined their knees.
2. mom of a fat kid telling me her son shouldn't lift because it will stunt his growth. He would not have been able to lift anything exceeding the weight of his own body fat.
3. high school football coach telling his kids not to deadlift because it doesn't apply to football.
4. middle school PE teacher wanting to keep smith machine in weight room instead of power cage.
5. swim coach saying swimmers will get muscle bound.
6. boxing coach telling buddy lifting would make him slow, about 30 minutes before he knocked the coaches star out cold.
7. pediatrician telling me muscle soreness can constitute child abuse.
8. as many more as anyone would want.

My pet peave (my opinion):
Why do middle schools encourage youth athletes to join running clubs at school and not give them year round access to the weight room?
You can get aerobically trained for most sports in 6 weeks (or less). A foundation for strength training takes years. Running through middle school will make no appreciable difference in sports performance (for non-running specific sports) in high school. Lifting through middle school will result in a bigger, faster, stronger and more injury resistant athlete. This will improve performance in virtually any sport, with the possible exception of Xcountry (and I would argue that as well).

I think the attitude and misinformation regarding youth lifting is really an extension of the fact that people in general (including alleged professionals, coaches, trainers and doctors) are mostly clueless about strength training.

Alot of them are clueless,, but the bottom line comes down to money. There is no money to made by the schools in weightlifting so nobody cares about it. Football,basketball,track these sports bring money, scholarships and attention to our schools. That's the bottom line. If there's no money to be gotten through it the schools want (or in some cases can't) give a **** about it.

[lifterg]

Originally Posted by grace_ou

Alot of them are clueless,, but the bottom line comes down to money. There is no money to made by the schools in weightlifting so nobody cares about it. Football,basketball,track these sports bring money, scholarships and attention to our schools. That's the bottom line. If there's no money to be gotten through it the schools want (or in some cases can't) give a **** about it.

The part I really don't get is they can't seem to connect the dots that a solid strength training program will result in a better football or basketball team, thereby more money.

Pro teams, college teams and high schools made the connection. It will probably trickle down to middle schools eventually, but talking with stupid people ticks me off.

[grace_ou]

Originally Posted by lifterg

The part I really don't get is they can't seem to connect the dots that a solid strength training program will result in a better football or basketball team, thereby more money.

Pro teams, college teams and high schools made the connection. It will probably trickle down to middle schools eventually, but talking with stupid people ticks me off.

It will prob trickle down eventually but it'll be very slow!! Only the high schools with winning football teams are likely to have weightlifting programs. Coaches don't like to advertise their training practices though so type of thing trickles down very slow!

My sons elementary school has this running team. ( I have no doubt because at there age the fastest way to get them on a good football team is size and a strong running base.) Anyway it raises about 45,000 to 65,000 a year for the school at it's annual run athon. But the real money comes from sales to the children daily! The school allows the teachers to sell snacks to the children before practice. Now they offer nothing except candy and soda!! I do mean nothing else! Even when they did the fund raiser all the kids run to miles and pledge for them. Afterward they will have water coolers, but all they sale is candy and soda!

And then they have the nerve twice a year to test your childs bf and weight ect!! They will send you notices home telling you if your child is overweight the best way to put them on a diet and what kind of exercise they should be getting at home!

I was called to the nurses office last year to be lectured about the negative effects that weightlifting would have on my child! How unhealthy it was for him! Not only that she insisted he was overweight!

He is a big kid! He's very wide chested and stocky but not fat. He rides 6 miles a day on his bike, he weight trains and he plays. He's healthy so I wouldn't give a **** if he were overweight.

lol end rant.. I forgot what my point was.

[lifthard72]

new thread title: ITT Gaash is fail



anyway i started lifting a 5x5 program when i was 13 about 5'7 im now 16 and about 5'11 (maybe taller) i was extremely weak back then benched about 90x1 max and so i think it wouldnt affected my growing anyways because i had been lifting so light+ being a farmers kid i was constantly bailing hay, lifting bails and what not so that was sorta a wrokout in itself

[UHCougar05]

Originally Posted by grace_ou

It will prob trickle down eventually but it'll be very slow!! Only the high schools with winning football teams are likely to have weightlifting programs. Coaches don't like to advertise their training practices though so type of thing trickles down very slow!

My sons elementary school has this running team. ( I have no doubt because at there age the fastest way to get them on a good football team is size and a strong running base.) Anyway it raises about 45,000 to 65,000 a year for the school at it's annual run athon. But the real money comes from sales to the children daily! The school allows the teachers to sell snacks to the children before practice. Now they offer nothing except candy and soda!! I do mean nothing else! Even when they did the fund raiser all the kids run to miles and pledge for them. Afterward they will have water coolers, but all they sale is candy and soda!

And then they have the nerve twice a year to test your childs bf and weight ect!! They will send you notices home telling you if your child is overweight the best way to put them on a diet and what kind of exercise they should be getting at home!

I was called to the nurses office last year to be lectured about the negative effects that weightlifting would have on my child! How unhealthy it was for him! Not only that she insisted he was overweight!
He is a big kid! He's very wide chested and stocky but not fat. He rides 6 miles a day on his bike, he weight trains and he plays. He's healthy so I wouldn't give a **** if he were overweight.

lol end rant.. I forgot what my point was.

You should punch the nurse dead-square in the ovaries.

[grace_ou]

Originally Posted by UHCougar05

You should punch the nurse dead-square in the ovaries.

OMG!! I was so angry!!! I thought my head was gonna explode!! My son was so upset by this whole thing!! They actually weighted and did bf test on the children like in front of everyone! That no privacy at all! My son was told he was at risk for being obese and that he was overweight and close to obesity! The nurses talk to the kids about how they eat, what kind of exercise they get **** like that,, when my son said he weightlifts.. she actually told him that that could be why he's a little on the short side!!! WUTT!!

These test and the info they have is just so outdated!! It's unbelievable!

They do this during health week, were the kids are being taught ya know how bad it is to be overweight and the health problems that can come from that.. blah blah..

What really pisses me off is they have rules that only allow the children to bring healthy snacks! But the teachers are allowed to sell candy to them at snack time!

[UHCougar05]

Originally Posted by grace_ou

OMG!! I was so angry!!! I thought my head was gonna explode!! My son was so upset by this whole thing!! They actually weighted and did bf test on the children like in front of everyone! That no privacy at all! My son was told he was at risk for being obese and that he was overweight and close to obesity! The nurses talk to the kids about how they eat, what kind of exercise they get **** like that,, when my son said he weightlifts.. she actually told him that that could be why he's a little on the short side!!! WUTT!!

These test and the info they have is just so outdated!! It's unbelievable!

They do this during health week, were the kids are being taught ya know how bad it is to be overweight and the health problems that can come from that.. blah blah..

What really pisses me off is they have rules that only allow the children to bring healthy snacks! But the teachers are allowed to sell candy to them at snack time!

Sweet, sweet hypocrisy... And I'll bet they still use BMI to test too and didn't take into account his LBM. I was the fat kid until about 9th grade when I got in PL, so I can understand the frustration (not saying your boy is fat at all. ) I wore husky clothes back when you weren't embarrassed to be called husky.

[grace_ou]

Originally Posted by UHCougar05

Sweet, sweet hypocrisy... And I'll bet they still use BMI to test too and didn't take into account his LBM. I was the fat kid until about 9th grade when I got in PL, so I can understand the frustration (not saying your boy is fat at all. ) I wore husky clothes back when you weren't embarrassed to be called husky.

Yeah those test are total crap.. and to me testing a child's bf is stupid anyway! Children go through phases were there bf goes up and down. It's not a big deal. Having low bf is not necessarily an indication that child is healthy. It's just out dated bull****.

Damn people piss me off. My son damn near gets his arm ripped off in football practice one day.. comes home with it swollen, wrapped in ice and bruised .. nurses doesn't even call! But they find out he's weightlifting and I have to go in and talk to them..

[lifterg]

Originally Posted by grace_ou

Yeah those test are total crap.. and to me testing a child's bf is stupid anyway! Children go through phases were there bf goes up and down. It's not a big deal. Having low bf is not necessarily an indication that child is healthy. It's just out dated bull****.

Damn people piss me off. My son damn near gets his arm ripped off in football practice one day.. comes home with it swollen, wrapped in ice and bruised .. nurses doesn't even call! But they find out he's weightlifting and I have to go in and talk to them..

Look at the bright side. Kids are smart enough to look at what you do, and will usually learn your values. It's frustrating but your kids will get the message.

Besides the nurse probably doesn't exercise and will turn into a cow. That's always good for a laugh.

[midian]

Originally Posted by grace_ou

Yeah those test are total crap.. and to me testing a child's bf is stupid anyway! Children go through phases were there bf goes up and down. It's not a big deal. Having low bf is not necessarily an indication that child is healthy. It's just out dated bull****.

Damn people piss me off. My son damn near gets his arm ripped off in football practice one day.. comes home with it swollen, wrapped in ice and bruised .. nurses doesn't even call! But they find out he's weightlifting and I have to go in and talk to them..

I know it, i went from 65kg and being very small (thus small and fat) to 50kg and taller to 75kg and my current height to 60kg again and now i'm between 77-80kg all in a period of 10 years. Being skinny is never an indication of overall health. Italians are the most overweight people in Europe with the least cholesterol while in Poland it's the other way around (skinniest and most cholesterol).

I got crap from teachers in high school too. I even got pissed off at the vice principal (or whatever her tittle was). She allowed someone who went biking after school to quit school an hour earlier on friday because he had gym class and he promised to went biking instead. I was doing Smolov and Russian squats routine so my legs were cramped/sore pretty much all the time, i went to her to say that i too workout 4-5 days a week and plan on competing (the other guy was an amateur, no plans to compete) and that running loads of km's wasn't productive for me. Her reply: "You must be overtraining, you'll go run like "everyone" else."

Sorry, your post brought back memories

[samsuperjew]

It sucks just as much, if not more for me to actually BE in hs/ms etc, than have a kid in it


During pe last year:

(going to call the kid on the football team "jack"

Jack: hey coach, can i not weightlift today (we have a machine weight rooom for "fitness class which is required for everyone for one year) i have practice today

coach: yeah sure jack, you're gonna be training later today anyway

SSJ: can i take the day off as well, i have a meet this weekend and should probably rest this week

coach: WHY WOULD YOU TAKE THIS WEEK OFF??!??!? dont you wanna be strong for your competition!?!??!?

SSJ: Sure...... *proceeds to use all the machines with 5 lbs on them*

[grace_ou]

Originally Posted by midian

I know it, i went from 65kg and being very small (thus small and fat) to 50kg and taller to 75kg and my current height to 60kg again and now i'm between 77-80kg all in a period of 10 years. Being skinny is never an indication of overall health. Italians are the most overweight people in Europe with the least cholesterol while in Poland it's the other way around (skinniest and most cholesterol).

I got crap from teachers in high school too. I even got pissed off at the vice principal (or whatever her tittle was). She allowed someone who went biking after school to quit school an hour earlier on friday because he had gym class and he promised to went biking instead. I was doing Smolov and Russian squats routine so my legs were cramped/sore pretty much all the time, i went to her to say that i too workout 4-5 days a week and plan on competing (the other guy was an amateur, no plans to compete) and that running loads of km's wasn't productive for me. Her reply: "You must be overtraining, you'll go run like "everyone" else."

Sorry, your post brought back memories

Part of the problem is that weightlifting is seen as non productive sport.. it's not taught very well. If you get a weightlifting class in most collages chances are your getting taught outdated info and it's probably seen as nothing but a filler class. And power lifting well that's just seen as something for genetic freaks .. everyday people couldn't possibly do that! lol

It's just common and there's not enough common knowledge about it yet for people to see value or worth in teaching it in schools.. and then of coarse there's the money side!

And there's still alot of stigma attached to the sport.. about drug use.

[grace_ou]

Originally Posted by lifterg

Look at the bright side. Kids are smart enough to look at what you do, and will usually learn your values. It's frustrating but your kids will get the message.

Besides the nurse probably doesn't exercise and will turn into a cow. That's always good for a laugh.

LOL, I know my son will!! He's a very black or white kinda of child. Everything is right or wrong .. there is no middle ground for him. He will argue his point till he's blue in the face! Once I got a note from his teacher that he causes a disturbance in the lunch line. LMAO!! The lunch lady tried to give him a cherry poptart as piece fruit! She tried to tell him it was healthy cause it had fruit in it! He argued with her till his teacher pulled him out of line!

Now he likes poptarts but lunch is suppose to protein, a veggie and fruit!

[bufflad87]

One way to find out. Lift hard, if you don't get mad injuries, go for gold, if you do, you'll eventually get weened out of it by injuries. Either way, you'll be a hero!