Doctors about Arachidonic Acid

[Phosphate bond]

Originally Posted by w_llewellyn

Many doctors are even looking at AA loading to treat diseases, notably certain liver and kidney disorders.

Interesting, considering that too many omega 3s are hard on your liver.

[R_N_S]

Originally Posted by w_llewellyn

Don't worry about the veggies. Just avoid strong anti-inflammatory fats, and other AI supplements, and you should be o.k.

One thing I will tell you to watch is the calories. You may need to take in more than normal to keep gaining weight. Initially, many users lose bodyfat, which can cause a drop in the scale instead of an increase. Just keep your calories up and this will be more than offset by the muscle gain. If you keep your calories too low (what may have been maintenance before for some), you will preserve muscle (maybe gain a little) and lose fat more than you will build mass.

I tell everyone to wait 3-4 weeks before evaluating, but indeed some feel the effects much sooner than others. If you are noticing slight increases and soreness, it sounds like it is working just fine.

Best of luck! Please keep us posted.

any tips/insight on using XF with androgens? Kind of a broad question I know, but are there any minor tweaks that could help synergy? In regards to timing, would it be more beneficial to end the XF with the androgens and just start the XF before them, or would it be better to start them at the same time and have a couple weeks of XF during PCT?

thanks! Not sure if I'll go the XF+androgens route, but I'm usin XF this summer and I'm really excited!

[Joel]

Originally Posted by Danes

Ecdysterone works.But not to build muscles I have been using Ecdysterone many times with good effect.If I Stress to much, dont have energy and like that,when I work a lot and dont have the extra energy.Ecdysterone worked very good.But to build muscles it is horrible.It wont build your muscles or gain strenght.

Interesting discussion on AA.....and Ecdy


Danes, I know your position on Ecdy has RADICALLY changed at this point , how about with AA ?

[browndustin]

Originally Posted by franklinclinten

Cool

We ?know all? and can ?tell all? because the "Anabolic Almanac.com" is

written by the industry?s foremost researchers and gurus?
http://www.anabolicalmanac.com/

Strong first post

[212121]

Really don't care... just want to get big [/troll]

[Robby99999]

Some people actually have a dramatic deficiency in this fatty acid, and it can cause various symptoms.

[alfaRomero]

Originally Posted by PowerSwede

Translation:


Hi, i'm sorry for the somewhat late answer (i was sick, but really wanted to answer your question, because this is something i am both interested in and have information on)

My background, to answer you on that, is that i am a doctor (of course) but also that i have been weightlifting for 20 years and researched plenty in this field.

Arachidonic Acid exists in red meat and in egg. I would never think of supplementing it since it is something we try to get as little as possible of if one wants to live healthily. It's like this, actually, AA is broken down to a long slew of superpotent hormone-resembling "signaltransmitters" in the body that is called leukotriens and prostaglandins. Some of these prostaglandines are beneficial for your healt while other are very bad for your health because they increase all conditions from diseases in your body. An increased intake of AA increases only the bad prostaglandins. Now, you might say that i have no "diseases" in my body, so i can take it. To that one could disagree and say ateroskleros that we are all subjected to for our entire lifes is simply a disease in your arteries. And if you have one or many other latent illnesses, everything from asthma to psoriasis to migraines (the list is very, very long) an intake of AA can trigger the development of those diseases. An example of how we usually try to ingest less AA, if one cares about ones health, is red meat from wild animals (moose, deer and so on) contains a lot less AA than red meat from industrially produced meat (cow, swine). As a weightlifter we are also interested in good health not just big muslces, and by that i mean that it seems wrong to ingest something that we know is bad for our health generally.

What you refer to that the product should increase muscle growth, strenght and so on and that "studies have shown that it doesn't hurt you in any way, i have the following comment to: Who wrote that? The manufacturer that sells it (and makes money off of it)?
Well, we can figure out the rest for ourselves.
Are there any studies? How long did the studies last? What was examined? What about everything that we can't examine?

My conclusion is clear: Avoid it. Best case would be that you are just wasting your money, worst case would be that it damages your health.

You'll only get strong from regular more intense and proper training and A LOT of PROPER food. But that is old news i recon. Anyway, my message is: All supplements have only a marginal effect, together with good trainging and a proper diet. But it's good for the wallet of those who sell it!

Good luck with the choice, i would, as you understand, not recommend to ingest more of something that most people try to ingest less of generally!


--------------------------

I'D LIKE TO HEAR THE RESPONSE TO THIS FROM THE REPS OF GASPARI.

[deserusan]

Originally Posted by alfaRomero

I'D LIKE TO HEAR THE RESPONSE TO THIS FROM THE REPS OF GASPARI.

There are some big words in there but if you sound them out you too will be a successful reader.

Originally Posted by Calder 2007

In conclusion, this new study by Katsumoto et al. adds valuable new information to our knowledge about the impact of increased dietary intake of arachidonic acid (11) . Taken together with earlier studies (12 ? 20), this study suggests that, rather than being harmful, moderately increased arachidonic acid intake is probably harmless in healthy adults, although the effect of intakes above 1?5 g/d are not known and the effect of increased intake in diseased individuals is not known. Furthermore, arachidonic acid appears to be an important constituent of infant formulas and in this setting may be helpful in growth, development and health.

Philip C. Calder
Institute of Human Nutrition
School of Medicine
University of Southampton

[alfaRomero]

Originally Posted by AcuDoc

Here are some abstracts on AA and some other issues which concern me. Bill could you address these?




1: Crit Rev Neurobiol. 2004;16(1-2):181-6. Related Articles, Links

5-Lipoxygenase as a putative link between cardiovascular and psychiatric disorders.

Manev R, Manev H.

The Psychiatric Institute, Department of Psychiatry, University of Illinois at Chicago, Chicago, Illinois 60612, USA.

There is evidence of an association between depression and anxiety and cardio- cerebro-vascular conditions, but the mechanisms of this association are unknown. Here we review a possible role for the 5-lipoxygenase (5-LOX) pathway. 5-LOX is an enzyme that, in association with 5-LOX-activating protein (FLAP), leads to the synthesis of leukotrienes from omega-6 arachidonic acid. Production of active leukotrienes can be reduced by dietary omega-3 fatty acids, which also are beneficial in cardiac and psychiatric (e.g., depression) pathologies. Human 5-LOX and FLAP gene polymorphisms are a risk factor in atherosclerosis and cardio-cerebro-vascular pathologies; an overactive 5-LOX pathway is found in these diseases. Studies with 5-LOX-deficient transgenic mice suggest that 5-LOX activity may contribute to anxiety- and depression-like behaviors. Future research should characterize the role of the 5-LOX pathway in comorbid cardio-cerebro-vascular and psychiatric disorders and in the therapeutic actions of dietary omega-3 fatty acids
nt Rev Neurobiol. 2004;59:297-326. Related Articles, Links
Click here to read
Membrane phospholipids and cytokine interaction in schizophrenia.

Yao JK, van Kammen DP.

VA Pittsburgh Healthcare System, Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania 15206, USA.

Although the potential key role that lipids may have in schizophrenia is not fully understood, multiple lines of evidence to date implicate the lipid environment in the behavior of neurotransmitter systems. Decreased phospholipid polyunsaturated fatty acids (PUFAs) have been demonstrated in both brain and peripheral membranes in schizophrenia, which is consistent with the hypothesis of myelin-related dysfunction in schizophrenia. Membrane defects, such as those induced by decreased PUFAs in phospholipids, can significantly alter a broad range of membrane functions and ipso facto behavior through multiple "downstream" effects. A number of putative mechanisms have been identified to explain the decreased PUFAs in schizophrenia, notably the increased turnover of phospholipids and decreased incorporation of arachidonic acid (AA) in membranes. In addition to increased oxidative stress, altered immune function may also be responsible for increased phospholipase activities. This association is particularly relevant in relation to phospholipids/PUFA, as AA can be converted to a variety of biologically active compounds, such as eicosanoids, which serve as potent messengers in regulating the inflammatory response, as well as endocannabinoids, which may affect schizophrenic psychopathology. Direct evidence of immune changes in some patients with schizophrenia have come to light, particularly in the activities of several cytokines known to be altered in autoimmune dysfunction. Given the diverse physiological function of AA, the specific behavioral symptomatology of schizophrenia is related mostly to the effect of AA changes that regulates neurodevelopment, neurotransmitter homeostasis, phosphatidylinositol signaling, and neuromodulatory actions of endocannabinoids in schizophrenia. Hence, in the current conceptualization, AA may be at a nexus point in the cascade leading to the syndrome of schizophrenia and represents a common biochemical pathway leading to the varied symptomatology of this disorder.

OH MY GOD! SUPPLEMENT COMPANIES MAY BE ALLIED TO ANY SATANIC UNDERGROUND SOCIETY THAT TRY TO KILL A GREAT AMOUNT OF HUMANS USING THEIR AMBITION AND VANITY!!

[ILIFT!]

If I suffer horrible side effects in the next 8 weeks, you are correct.
If I do not, you are wrong.

[Trenbolone]

Thanks for bringing this to the table Danes!!!

[guyrelax]

Originally Posted by Colinballin23

what products have AA in them?

Molecular Nutrition X Factor
Gaspari Halodrol liquigels
Axis Hemodraulix
I-force Max-out

and I think planet was making a bulk powder but not anymore

[guyrelax]

Originally Posted by Phosphate bond

Interesting, considering that too many omega 3s are hard on your liver.

So too much fish oil is bad for the liver? I thought that was the one thing that didn't have anything bad about it

[funkybass52]

ive actually been researching AA lately as well. Im definately not taking it. All the medical sites and research studies that i have read say the same thing. In nutrition classes in college (textbooks as well) they told us it is terrible for you as well. The support i can find for it is that when you exercise you can handle more of it. But only take it for a short period and get off. thanks for the thread!

[michael3435]

Originally Posted by guyrelax

Molecular Nutrition X Factor
Gaspari Halodrol liquigels
Axis Hemodraulix
I-force Max-out

and I think planet was making a bulk powder but not anymore

also animal test, mhp dark rage,

[G.W. Hayduke]

Originally Posted by funkybass52

ive actually been researching AA lately as well. Im definately not taking it. All the medical sites and research studies that i have read say the same thing. In nutrition classes in college (textbooks as well) they told us it is terrible for you as well. The support i can find for it is that when you exercise you can handle more of it. But only take it for a short period and get off. thanks for the thread!

Lulz @ the guy who doesn't understand.

[Dudefood]

Originally Posted by PowerSwede

Don't sweat it, you tried to bring information about a product to this board and you should be thanked for it, morons will be morons and neg rep people for all the wrong reasons.

Haha jag h?ller med!sk?nt n?r n?n kommer med seri?sa svar. och alla bara dissar han haha.
Av vad jag h?rt/l?st s? verkar AA ha mer och v?rre bi effekter ?n en mild steroid kur. Helt sjukt. har vart p?v?g att k?ra p? AA flera g?nger men har alltid vart sjuk eller n?t som kommit iv?gen. kanske man borde h?lla sej undan det ?nd?, fan inte v?rt att l?gga hela h?lsen p? 2 burkar.
peace

[neuron]

Originally Posted by Dudefood

Haha jag h?ller med!sk?nt n?r n?n kommer med seri?sa svar. och alla bara dissar han haha.
Av vad jag h?rt/l?st s? verkar AA ha mer och v?rre bi effekter ?n en mild steroid kur. Helt sjukt. har vart p?v?g att k?ra p? AA flera g?nger men har alltid vart sjuk eller n?t som kommit iv?gen. kanske man borde h?lla sej undan det ?nd?, fan inte v?rt att l?gga hela h?lsen p? 2 burkar.
peace

Det skal du skita i

[Hat_Monster]

AA never did me any harm in the 8 weeks which is the recommended time for consumption. The side-effects are nothing compared to PH/DS so gtfo.

[wengl]

Originally Posted by Hat_Monster

AA never did me any harm in the 8 weeks which is the recommended time for consumption. The side-effects are nothing compared to PH/DS so gtfo.

You can do a lot of things for 8 weeks and not do any harm to your body, doesn't mean it's good for you. Anybody with a decent knowledge of biochemistry or physiology should know to stay away from arachadonic acid, not that it's going to kill you if you use it, but AA is a basic compound from which a lot of other substances are made and it has wide ranging systemic effects that impact your body in ways apart from the athletic performance benefits. People are always so black and white about this type of stuff, like either a supplement will kill your liver overnight or it's the best most nutritious thing ever. People just get confused when it's somewhere in between like with AA.

But if there's anything I've learned from my time here, it's that people posting in the supplement section are looking for affirmation and not advice. 99% of the time they've already definitively made up their mind on taking a certain supplement.