Training - How much wieght is enough?

[BodyPhilosophy]

My stats - I'm 5'6'' 155 lbs. My goal is to lean out, and build muscle. I have been coupling wieght training with cardio (and watching my nutrition).

I am aware of the following (simplified) concepts: 1) to gain definition and burn more calories -- less wieght, high reps, and 2) to gain more mass -- less reps and heavier wieght.

I've been doing #1 because I want more definition, and am less concerned with mass. I put on muscle easily, but it's not my main goal.

Here are some examples of what I do: Seated Leg Extensions - 4 sets x 15-20 reps of 45 lbs.
Machine Squats - 4 sets x 15 reps of 80 lbs.

With any exercise, upper or lower body, I lift an amount that is comfortable to finish each set. I feel a good burn in the last three reps of each set, but don't ever reach a point of failure. I feel I could keep going on with the reps. I feel like I should be sore after my wieght training and I'm not.

I need feedback as to whether what I'm doing what is appropriate to reach my goal. Am I doing this right? I need some feedback por favor!!!

[startinout12]

lift light weight for more reps for definition lol. I cant believe people still say this.

[Xtcme]

Originally Posted by startinout12

lift light weight for more reps for definition lol. I cant believe people still say this.

Why, Because it doesnt work for you? Sorry, I gain Extreme cut from High reps, Works like cardio for me!

[BodyPhilosophy]

Well, Startinout12, I'll overlook your critical remark, and would appreciate some enlightenment since you have voiced your opinion. Explanation or suggestions?

[startinout12]

well, while lifting lighter weight, u will lose some muscle and even though u will burn more cals during that type of workout u would get better results from lifting the heavier weight and just doing cardio at another time. This will preserve muscle and give u better definition when your bf is low enough.

[startinout12]

Originally Posted by Xtcme

Why, Because it doesnt work for you? Sorry, I gain Extreme cut from High reps, Works like cardio for me!

not saying u wont get cut, but y not try to build your muscle up more and then get cut by doing cardio. This way u gain muscle and can lose fat to look bigger when u are cut.

[BodyPhilosophy]

Ok...so how heavy should I go then? So for example...I'm lifting 45 lbs comfortably with leg extensions to finish 15 reps. You're saying I should increase to 60 lbs with 8-10 reps, and be lifting to the point where I can barely finish the last rep? Is that the idea? Lifting to failure in each set? How exhausted should my muscles be feeling at the end of each set?

[rbtrout]

Exactly. Well said Startinout. If you've busted butt to make size and strength gains and then start doing high reps and light weight, you'll lose muscle and size. If you don't care, then go for it. I work too hard for my gains to do something like that. Getting cut is 70% diet, not all workout and cardio like everyone seems to think. If you lift hard and heavy; watch your diet by eating a calorie deficit each day and eating clean food; and up your cardio (HIIT is best for burning fat) then you'll keep most of the size/strength you just put on. As Startinout said, yes, you can get cut by doing the light weight high reps thing, but why lose muscle mass and strength when you don't have to?

You want to be sore after your workout? Why? Pain <> gain. The old axiom 'No pain, no gain', is BS. It has nothing to do with muscle growth.

[startinout12]

Originally Posted by BodyPhilosophy

Ok...so how heavy should I go then? So for example...I'm lifting 45 lbs comfortably with leg extensions to finish 15 reps. You're saying I should increase to 60 lbs with 8-10 reps, and be lifting to the point where I can barely finish the last rep? Is that the idea? Lifting to failure in each set? How exhausted should my muscles be feeling at the end of each set?

Depends on your workout. What split or w/e ur doing. 8-10 reps is a good range. I wouldnt go to failure on each set. U will kill yourself doing that. To really tell u more i need to know what ur doing workout wise.

[BodyPhilosophy]

Interesting comments. I just hear a lot of conflicting suggestions from different people, and wanted to get some feedback on the matter.

I do about 45-min to 1 hr of cardio- mix of eliptical, treadmill, bike, kickboxing 3x per week (for now).
I wieght-train 3 days a week on the same days I'm doing cardio.
I'll alternate weeks and do upper, lower, upper body, and the next week, lower, upper, lower.

I know I need to get into the gym more than 3 days a week to speed up my progress, but I more concerned with makin sure my time is invested correctly at this point.

As far as wieght training...do you need to know about the amount I lift or what exercises I'm doing?

[rbtrout]

Don't need to know weights used, but exercise listing would be good. You need to be doing the big, compound movement exercises first followed by any isolation work that you want to do.
The light weight/high rep thing bothers me because I wouldn't want to see you lose size and strength. I've seen too many guys over the years do this and then ask why am I smaller and I can't lift as much. You will lose a bit in a cut, but you can minimize that by lifting hard and heavy.
I'm doing a very slow cut right now. I'd like to trim off most of the excess belly I've got from poor eating (T-giving, Christmas and New Years - the eating season). I've dropped nearly 10 pounds, but I set a new PR on squats on Monday. I'll continue to lift hard and heavy during the cut and expect some more PRs.

[rach2]

So do i need to lift heavy everytime I work out to gain muscle? I have been doing like 3 sets of 12 reps confortably on some days, if i wanna gain muscle do I need to lift heavy everytime I work-out?

[startinout12]

Originally Posted by BodyPhilosophy

Interesting comments. I just hear a lot of conflicting suggestions from different people, and wanted to get some feedback on the matter.

I do about 45-min to 1 hr of cardio- mix of eliptical, treadmill, bike, kickboxing 3x per week (for now).
I wieght-train 3 days a week on the same days I'm doing cardio.
I'll alternate weeks and do upper, lower, upper body, and the next week, lower, upper, lower.

I know I need to get into the gym more than 3 days a week to speed up my progress, but I more concerned with makin sure my time is invested correctly at this point.

As far as wieght training...do you need to know about the amount I lift or what exercises I'm doing?

Ok, very glad to see ur doing an upper/lower split. I hate bp splits and was hoping u did not do that.

I hope ur doing the cardio at a seperate time or after the weights.

Now onto the weight training:
The amount of sets u do for an exercise is up to u and the rep scheme is also up to u, but i wouldnt go higher than 12 reps unless your doing calves or forearms or hypers. Although i dont waste my time on calves or forearms, it is up to u if u do them.

U can set up your set/ rep scheme up as 3x5 6x3 3x8. That is up to u. Switch the exercises that u are doing pretty frequently though to avoid staleness and plateauing.

u really dont need to go to the gym more. in all honesty, i will recommend two programs that i think are good and you could try unless you like your workout, which is fine. Westside Barbell 4 Skinny Bitches and a good 5x5 variation.

[startinout12]

Originally Posted by rach2

So do i need to lift heavy everytime I work out to gain muscle? I have been doing like 3 sets of 12 reps confortably on some days, if i wanna gain muscle do I need to lift heavy everytime I work-out?

the 3rd set of 12 u should be getting challenged. Not saying go to failure, but close. And you should try to increase the weights pretty frequently. Chanllenging your muslces is how they grow.

[startinout12]

Originally Posted by rbtrout

Don't need to know weights used, but exercise listing would be good. You need to be doing the big, compound movement exercises first followed by any isolation work that you want to do.
The light weight/high rep thing bothers me because I wouldn't want to see you lose size and strength. I've seen too many guys over the years do this and then ask why am I smaller and I can't lift as much. You will lose a bit in a cut, but you can minimize that by lifting hard and heavy.
I'm doing a very slow cut right now. I'd like to trim off most of the excess belly I've got from poor eating (T-giving, Christmas and New Years - the eating season). I've dropped nearly 10 pounds, but I set a new PR on squats on Monday. I'll continue to lift hard and heavy during the cut and expect some more PRs.

Dead on. 100% in agreeance

[BodyPhilosophy]

You do know that I'm a female...not sure if that makes any difference in your suggestions...but hey, muscle is muscle. I apologize for the names I'm gonna give to you to describe what I'm doin... I haven't been using free-weights because I'm not confident with proper form.

Lower Body - Machine Hack Squats, Leg Extensions, Leg Curls, Calf-press machine, Thigh Abductor, Adductor.

Upper Body: All machine - incline bench press, pull down, pectoral , bicep curls, assisted pull-ups, tricep extensions...

lol. I'm tryin here...

I try to do 5-6 exercises for upper and lower body, and then I'll do abs. 250 reps.

[rbtrout]

NO on this - Switch the exercises that u are doing pretty frequently though to avoid staleness and plateauing.

You'll never be able to measure your progress if you change things too frequently. You stick with a routine until you stop making gains, then you change something up, maybe only one exercise.

If you're doing and upper/lower split (I did a 4 day upper/lower split) then you can incorporate the big lifts first and the accessory lifts afterwards and go heavy/light.

Monday - lower
squats - heavy
leg press (if you want, I don't much) - heavy
stiff leg deadlifts - heavy
calf raises (if you want) - heavy

Tuesday - upper
Bench press - heavy
incline db press - med.
dips - bw or bw+ to failure
abs

Wed. off

Thursday - lower
deads - heavy
front squats - med.
pull throughs
calf raises

Friday - upper
SOHP - heavy
front laterals
rear laterals
hammer curls or bb curls
abs

Throw your cardio in 3x a week.

[BodyPhilosophy]

Coo...I'll utilize this info and try it out.

[rbtrout]

Free weights are always best, but you can do machines to get this done. I understand that free weights are intimidating and going into the free weight area (if separate) can be quite intimidating, but it's best.

Cutting is cutting, male or female, so is bulking. Again, I'd really hate to see you lose size or strength by doing something wrong.

Hope this helps.

[startinout12]

This is to rbtrout. hear me out. I am doing Westside and trust Louie Simmons very much. He is a very smart guy who started Westside Barbell and trains NFL athletes. He has his powerlifters at his gym change all of thier exercises weekly. U then can assess your progress when u come back to that exercise. Doing the same exercise all the time will slow down progress.

[rbtrout]

If you're talking changing them up every week, then I'd still argue. If you mean every few (4-6 weeks), then I'd agree more.

[ThickAsABrick]

Originally Posted by startinout12

I hate bp splits and was hoping u did not do that.

Please stop breathing for an extended period of time.

Thanks in advance.

[BodyPhilosophy]

It did. I printed out your comments so I can refer back to your suggestions.

[startinout12]

Originally Posted by ThickAsABrick

Please stop breathing for an extended period of time.

Thanks in advance.

Dude i get it we dont like each other. U like your way i like mine. I have started Westside. How can u knock Westside.

[ThickAsABrick]

Stop posting.

[BodyPhilosophy]

I've heard, if you switch up your program every two weeks that's best. I think it boils down to what works for the individual.

[startinout12]

Originally Posted by ThickAsABrick

Stop posting.

idiot. U are a thick headed prick. At least u know too. Westside FTW

[ThickAsABrick]

Originally Posted by BodyPhilosophy

I've heard, if you switch up your program every two weeks that's best.

Read:

Originally Posted by JOHN GARGANI

Been seeing more of this lately on the forum, as it always comes up more, now and then......

change for the sake of changing.... a bad and foolish thing.....

The beauty of bodybuilding, compared to many other sports, is that the results are so directly measureable:

1. your bodyweight can go up while your bodyfat percentage remains the same

2. your bodypart measurements can go up, ie: your flexed arm measurement or expanded chest measurement goes up WHILE YOUR BODYFAT PERCENTAGE DOESN'T....

3. you lift bigger weights WHILE STILL BEING IN TOTAL CONTROL OF THE MOVEMENT.


When you are achieving these 3 very basic and recordable improvements in bodybuilding, why change the exercises you are doing????


oh, but we hear:

1. I am getting bored.....really? bored with getting bigger and leaner???

2. I am not getting sore anymore.........and you like feeling sore? this means your muscles are adapting and you are stronger than you used to be.


I could understand boredom when you are at a stand still, but boredom when you are improving???

Sometimes I think the problem lies in that people do not keep recordable records of their improvements: oh, yes, lots of people write down sets and reps, but you must remember also, to keep a record of basic bodypart measurements, as in: arm flexed, chest expanded, thighs , calves, neck...etc.......

and although they are not really that accurate, SOME type of bodyfat measurement also with the idea in mind , that although not totally accurate, may still be relevant if you do it the same way all the time.


Periodization of exercises is to prevent, or remedy staleness: Staleness is simply when your measurements are not going up...that's all......

you have trained a month without any improvement in weight lifted, or size gained, or bodyfat lost or maintained......

Periodization was never meant to interrupt a working process: if you have something good, that is producing, you ride it out until it doesn't.......

If you started a new supplement and were making mad gains, would you after a couple of weeks of this, simply stop taking the supplement???

If your bench was rocketing up at a faster rate than normal, would you then leave it out after a couple of weeks "just so you don't go stale"??

IF IT IS ROCKETING UP, YOU AREN'T STALE! lol.......


Change for changes sake alone...don't fall into that trap......

listening to your body is not just for individual exercises or for dietary results: it also means knowing WHEN to change and when not to.......

we should NEVER be in a rush to interfere with a productive combination of things......

and as for boredom, as I said, if you are truly stale, then I can understand boredom, but if you are making gains AND you are bored, you might have to start taking up another endeavor......

[BodyPhilosophy]

Hey! Play nice guys! Dang!

[startinout12]

i dont understand ur post. when u do Westside u max every week for one exercise. If u do it too often u wont progress. Also louie simmons says to change accessory work every 2 weeks or so. i dont think u know more than louie