Just read an article against eating small meals/day

DieHollywoodDie · 01-10-2009, 10:37 PM

Interesting food for thought (pun intended):

"Many meals per day reduce insulin spikes a bit, but by substituting a nearly constant flow. Hence, total insulin is increased over the course of the day eating six or seven meals. This will make you more resistant to the action of insulin. Hence, your body must make more of it.

As your insulin drifts upward and you become resistant, you're on your way to the Metabolic Syndrome X: abdominal obesity, high blood pressure, and a pre-diabetic state. No wonder a number of bodybuilders develop diabetes.

The overweight people and bodybuilders tend to share a common strategy (or failure) of eating many meals a day. Both have problems. The obese have many and bodybuilders manage to avoid some of them because they have such high activity levels. But, they both tend to die of similar diseases ? diseases of metabolism.

The characteristic that links both these sets of individuals is that they both lack variation between the anabolic and catabolic states. They have a flattened and somewhat uniform metabolic state. The obese do little and eat steadily so that they seldom vary their metabolic state; they're almost always in the anabolic (growth) state.

Bodybuilders who fixate on maintaining a positive protein (nitrogen) balance only enter the catabolic state when they work out. Fortunately, they tend to work out often and long, so they do enter the catabolic state for that period of time. But they ingest a meal soon after the workout and then go back into the anabolic state. This is bad.

It's also a hassle to eat that often. It's hard enough to eat three meals that you prepare well with fresh ingredients. Finally, you weaken the growth hormone response you get from exercise and when you fall into REM sleep.
"

discuss.

nathanbailey · 01-10-2009, 10:50 PM

i dont need to worry about that. im on the warrior diet.

but when i was eating 6 - 7 meals a day i felt like absolute ****. no matter how good i ate i never felt right i really dont feel that it is healthy and didnt need an article to tell me.

zellers94 · 01-10-2009, 11:02 PM

I call bull****.

DieHollywoodDie · 01-10-2009, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zellers94

I call bull****.

i do too, but it's not that terrible of an idea. except according to him we're all going to get diabetes basically?

nathanbailey · 01-10-2009, 11:21 PM

lol dont you think a ridiculous amount of ppl have diabetes compared to 20 yrs ago??

if u wanna call bull**** try provide some evidence even if anecdotal about how eating 6 - 7 times a day is better for u.

fitopia · 01-10-2009, 11:28 PM

I'll never be onboard with the 6 meals idea. Nothing wrong with actually feeling hunger.

nathanbailey · 01-10-2009, 11:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fitopia

I'll never be onboard with the 6 meals idea. Nothing wrong with actually feeling hunger.

i only eat during a 4 hour period during the day every day and i barely feel hunger at all during the other times. my body knows when its coming near the time to start eating then ill get hungry.

anyways countries in europe actually have been using variations of fasting as their regular eating patterns and they are much healthier ppl then in the US etc

RickRolld · 01-10-2009, 11:43 PM

I would read this first. I trust a doctor over a person on a forum who did not present any evidence that what he/she typed is not falsified.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...8211712AAxo5OU

I'll trust the doctor.

nathanbailey · 01-10-2009, 11:54 PM

wow u know why i wont listen to that doctor? "eating small meals is a great way to not overeat" **** off it is. thats generally WHY people overeat because they are sick of those BS little meals that never fill you.

RickRolld · 01-11-2009, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nathanbailey

wow u know why i wont listen to that doctor? "eating small meals is a great way to not overeat" **** off it is. thats generally WHY people overeat because they are sick of those BS little meals that never fill you.

So you'd rather believe someone who has shown no basis for his/her claims over a doctor. Okay.

So, you feel that people overeat because they eat small meals that don't fill them up. Well, how about we educate those people about the proper foods to eat that will actually fill them up because it is nearly impossible to eat 3 meals a day, without overeating, that will fill you up until you get to the next meal, short of sleeping 16 hours a day.

Perhaps you overeat with small meals because you aren't eating the proper foods.

By the way, I don't appreciate being told to **** off when all I am doing is trying to help when you are acting like a troll. Now mind you, I am not calling you a troll, but you are certainly showing signs with your previous post.

nathanbailey · 01-11-2009, 12:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RickRolld

So you'd rather believe someone who has shown no basis for his/her claims over a doctor. Okay.

So, you feel that people overeat because they eat small meals that don't fill them up. Well, how about we educate those people about the proper foods to eat that will actually fill them up because it is nearly impossible to eat 3 meals a day, without overeating, that will fill you up until you get to the next meal, short of sleeping 16 hours a day.

Perhaps you overeat with small meals because you aren't eating the proper foods.

By the way, I don't appreciate being told to **** off when all I am doing is trying to help when you are acting like a troll. Now mind you, I am not calling you a troll, but you are certainly showing signs with your previous post.

actually id rather believe my own experience and YEARS of experience of fasting vs eating 6 - 7 meals a day.

and dont tell me i dont know how to eat. my family only ever has healthy food in the house i know how to diet and eat properly.

no offence but what the doctor is saying is only his opinion anyway. he has no science to back him up just what he beleives to be right. and no not every doctor studies about the effects of diet/insulin sensitivity.

and yes ive also seen doctors that seem to be complete idiots and not have a clue. until you got a scientific claim then you cant claim to be right either. im on the look for one right now to suggest an answer either way.

edit: i wasnt telling u to **** off i was saying that about the part i had quoted.

Neil5587 · 01-11-2009, 12:08 AM

As far as anecdotal evidence I remember in college learning that the "Americanized" 3 meals a day eating schedule is bad for the body and may be contributing to the Obesity Epidemic in USA. This being because our bodies are set to ingest energy throughout the day and with our 3 meal a day schedule we go hours without eating. By feeling hunger for extended periods of time your body thinks you are starving it so when you do finally eat something you eat in large quantities and your body sets itself to store that energy as fat to prevent you from starving being that your body thinks you are starving it. By eating until you are "full" you are doing more damage because you are eating more than what your stomach is meant to hold thus stretching it (which is that achy lethargic feeling we have all experienced before I am sure). By consuming energy throughout the day in smallER (not necessarily too small) amounts we are keeping our bodies consistently nourished thus allowing our bodies to set itself up to increase your metabolic rate being that your body isn't under the impression you are starving it temporarily. As we all know increases in your metabolic rate means increases in weight-loss and at times muscle loss so it is advisable to eat carbs in the morning for energy and then eat protein rich foods for around 4 out of the 6 meals to keep muscle sustained, growing and healthy.

That is in a nutshell what I learned from my Biology and Nutrition college professor.

RickRolld · 01-11-2009, 12:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nathanbailey

actually id rather believe my own experience and YEARS of experience of fasting vs eating 6 - 7 meals a day.

and dont tell me i dont know how to eat. my family only ever has healthy food in the house i know how to diet and eat properly.

no offence but what the doctor is saying is only his opinion anyway. he has no science to back him up just what he beleives to be right. and no not every doctor studies about the effects of diet/insulin sensitivity.

and yes ive also seen doctors that seem to be complete idiots and not have a clue. until you got a scientific claim then you cant claim to be right either. im on the look for one right now to suggest an answer either way.

edit: i wasnt telling u to **** off i was saying that about the part i had quoted.

My apologies about the **** off comment then. It is difficult sometimes to discern what people mean with those types of comments.

I am interested in what types of healthy foods you are referring to though. You can eat a ton of healthy foods and it may not be right for what you actually need. I am not suggesting you don't know, but am simply curious as to get a better basis for your personal experiences since this is what you are going off of.

I never did say that I was right. I was simply stating what I was going to go from. I stated that I had no problem with what you were going to base your diet off of in the first sentence. You seem to think that I am trying to disprove what you are saying when I am simply trying to discuss the matter in a civil manner and respect what you have to offer, outside of the worthless **** off comments and apparent demeaning comments about what I think. It appears that you are saying that I feel that all doctors study insulin resistance when I know that is not the case. Please try to be civil.

nathanbailey · 01-11-2009, 12:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RickRolld

My apologies about the **** off comment then. It is difficult sometimes to discern what people mean with those types of comments.

no worries mate. seriously though im on the warrior diet atm right...

ive eaten 3 times a day, 6 - 7 times a day... i felt terrible when i ate like that

i got more energy during the day now that i fast. i feel healthier. im WAY stronger at the gym

and i dont under eat like ppl probably assume.

RickRolld · 01-11-2009, 12:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nathanbailey

no worries mate. seriously though im on the warrior diet atm right...

ive eaten 3 times a day, 6 - 7 times a day... i felt terrible when i ate like that

i got more energy during the day now that i fast. i feel healthier. im WAY stronger at the gym

and i dont under eat like ppl probably assume.

I think that that is really cool. I have tried the 3 meals a day before and simply don't have the energy not matter what combination of food I eat and the amount that I eat. It seems that the adage is true about everyone being different. This is such a hard topic to deal with because of that as well.

nathanbailey · 01-11-2009, 12:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RickRolld

My apologies about the **** off comment then. It is difficult sometimes to discern what people mean with those types of comments.

I am interested in what types of healthy foods you are referring to though. You can eat a ton of healthy foods and it may not be right for what you actually need. I am not suggesting you don't know, but am simply curious as to get a better basis for your personal experiences since this is what you are going off of.

I never did say that I was right. I was simply stating what I was going to go from. I stated that I had no problem with what you were going to base your diet off of in the first sentence. You seem to think that I am trying to disprove what you are saying when I am simply trying to discuss the matter in a civil manner and respect what you have to offer, outside of the worthless **** off comments and apparent demeaning comments about what I think. It appears that you are saying that I feel that all doctors study insulin resistance when I know that is not the case. Please try to be civil.

my point with him more is that we dont know if he studies the nutrition field that closely at all.. whether he might be a specialist or not you know. so for me to blindly follow him just doesnt click with me either.

you want to see evidence to support my theory and id like the same.

especially because of all these people saying "your body will store everything you eat and you will lose all your muscles if you dont eat every 2 hours." i call major bull**** on that. i only eat for 4 hours of every day and i measure my bodyparts and they have not shrunk apart from a tiny bit but considerin im losing weight thats kinda expected? :P

i think a lot of things are overhyped and most ppl just listen because every1 says its true

RickRolld · 01-11-2009, 12:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nathanbailey

my point with him more is that we dont know if he studies the nutrition field that closely at all.. whether he might be a specialist or not you know. so for me to blindly follow him just doesnt click with me either.

you want to see evidence to support my theory and id like the same.

especially because of all these people saying "your body will store everything you eat and you will lose all your muscles if you dont eat every 2 hours." i call major bull**** on that. i only eat for 4 hours of every day and i measure my bodyparts and they have not shrunk apart from a tiny bit but considerin im losing weight thats kinda expected? :P

i think a lot of things are overhyped and most ppl just listen because every1 says its true

I completely agree with what you are saying. I was just looking for clarification about the doctor studying insulin resistance by the way.

People's bodies are different in so many ways that it is ridiculous. Trial and error is almost always what people have to do. However, I feel that starting out with the thing that most people respond to (like 8-12 rep range for mass building) is the way to go because a person has the highest chance of being correct on their first try. (Not saying that 6-7 meals is the way to start out. It is definitely best to simply listen to your body and eat when you feel it is necessary and not gorge oneself.)

nathanbailey · 01-11-2009, 12:36 AM

do you know how hard it is to find studies on pubmed :P you put a few words in you wanna search for and most of them dont come up on the studies listed.. and theres like 2000!!

nathanbailey · 01-11-2009, 12:42 AM

heres a study about fasting. yes its only about fasting one day a month but its about cardiovascular health.

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hlight=fasting

iknowjujitsu · 01-11-2009, 12:47 AM

the fact is guys, no one person is alike. it's ignorant to look at this claim and think it applies to EVERYBODY. if someone doesn't feel right on 6 small meals and it doesn't work for them, well fine. it will suit someone else just fine. i personally don't adhere to the 5-6 small meals theory, but i feel that it is a myth, and that a lot of people have stuck by that theory because of fear - fear of losing their precious muscles. i don't think it's necessary. but that's just my opinion and it shouldn't matter to anyone but me. you guys all argue so much about what the right way should be for everyone. save your breath for your workouts, because there is no right way for everyone.

mingo3403 · 01-11-2009, 02:09 AM

I eat 6-7 times a day, i feel fkn better than ever, energy levels through the roof

Snarff · 01-11-2009, 03:24 AM

imo, it all boils down to calories in vs calories out, regardless if your bulking cutting or maintaining. everyones has different goals.

bulking - alot easier to consume your increased calorie intake over 6 or even 7 meals

cutting - for satiety purposes, prob better to consume 4 solid meals over the course of the day

like you say, everyone is different and it comes down to what makes you feel comfortable. if your eating healthy and sufficiently, training hard and getting enough rest, spread your meals out however you wish cos it wont too much of a difference

LayzieBone085 · 01-11-2009, 04:27 AM

So.. your source for the article?

We got more Muscle and Fitness BS?

Disenfranchised · 01-11-2009, 05:01 AM

It's not HOW OFTEN you eat, it's WHAT you eat. Obese people and bodybuilders don't eat the same foods obviously.

wave_length · 01-11-2009, 05:05 AM

From my experience meal frequency has no significant influence on progress. It should be used as an individual tool to make cutting as easy as possible. For me that means eating one big meal a day.

Disenfranchised · 01-11-2009, 05:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wave_length

From my experience meal frequency has no significant influence on progress. It should be used as an individual tool to make cutting as easy as possible. For me that means eating one big meal a day.

If I ate one meal a day while cutting I would certainly overeat and feel like **** throughout the whole day. Not a great idea IMO.

wave_length · 01-11-2009, 05:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Disenfranchised

If I ate one meal a day while cutting I would certainly overeat and feel like **** throughout the whole day. Not a great idea IMO.

That's exactly my point, use meal frequency as a convenience tool. For me it worked great and I never had better results. If more meals work better, go for that.

DieHollywoodDie · 01-11-2009, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wave_length

That's exactly my point, use meal frequency as a convenience tool. For me it worked great and I never had better results. If more meals work better, go for that.

you have no credibility at 5' 10" 150 lbs.....i would be a shredded 5' 9" 200 by now if i didnt play a sport.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snarff

imo, it all boils down to calories in vs calories out, regardless if your bulking cutting or maintaining. everyones has different goals.

bulking - alot easier to consume your increased calorie intake over 6 or even 7 meals

cutting - for satiety purposes, prob better to consume 4 solid meals over the course of the day

like you say, everyone is different and it comes down to what makes you feel comfortable. if your eating healthy and sufficiently, training hard and getting enough rest, spread your meals out however you wish cos it wont too much of a difference

this is true, it IS alot easier over several meals. but once again, calories in and calories out is simplifying the whole process far too much if you want to not just gain weight but muscle. hormone fluctuations ARE very real things. macro/micro nutrients ARE very real.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LayzieBone085

So.. your source for the article?

We got more Muscle and Fitness BS?

try again, t-nation...which is arguably a better site than bb.com. however i don't agree with the article.

wave_length · 01-11-2009, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DieHollywoodDie

you have no credibility at 5' 10" 150 lbs.....i would be a shredded 5' 9" 200 by now if i didnt play a sport.

As a lifetime natural? In this case you would be the best lifetime natural of all times considering your height.

Anyway, I measure efficiency by relative change of body composition. You can disregard my opinion if you think my current absolute weight means I have no experience.

glossygraphics · 01-11-2009, 08:48 AM

[QUOTE=nathanbailey;272028301]actually id rather believe my own experience and YEARS of experience of fasting vs eating 6 - 7 meals a day.

and dont tell me i dont know how to eat. my family only ever has healthy food in the house i know how to diet and eat properly.

no offence but what the doctor is saying is only his opinion anyway. he has no science to back him up just what he beleives to be right. and no not every doctor studies about the effects of diet/insulin sensitivity.

and yes ive also seen doctors that seem to be complete idiots and not have a clue. until you got a scientific claim then you cant claim to be right either. im on the look for one right now to suggest an answer either way.

QUOTE]

all of the above