Christians, Does it bother you...

[neekz0r]

Originally Posted by bear87

good work man, we always need more threads to bash christians and their beliefs

I'm sorry if I came across as bashing. I freely admit to being biased against Christians in general, but I try not bash the faith nor those who practice it. If I did come across that way, I apologize.

[smokeater]

Originally Posted by rp29nct

Does it bother you that our non-Christian peers (what you could term "the world") have a disparaging and often poor opinion in general (and more specifically on the basis of perceived intellect) of Christians who profess and strive to share the Gospel message?

No. Everyone is entitled to their opinions. I don't doubt what I believe so if others wish to make negative comments it won't affect me. People I work with know that I am a Christian, but I don't go out of my way to push it on them, out of respect.

[grup910]

Originally Posted by smokeater

No. Everyone is entitled to their opinions. I don't doubt what I believe so if others wish to make negative comments it won't affect me. People I work with know that I am a Christian, but I don't go out of my way to push it on them, out of respect.

So if you weren't a christian and your co-workers were, you wouldn't want them to tell you about christianity?

[TheNewAddiction]

Originally Posted by rp29nct

Admittedly this is a loaded question, but from discussion with other Christians at my church and in the community, I've gotten some mixed reactions. The most alarming reaction is simply one of apathy.

Does it bother you that our non-Christian peers (what you could term "the world") have a disparaging and often poor opinion in general (and more specifically on the basis of perceived intellect) of Christians who profess and strive to share the Gospel message?

In my circle of friends, I am mostly surrounded by fellow Christians, but it occurred to me to ask my non-Christian friends very personally what they thought of Christians. While they did not put me into the same category, the overwhelming response was that Christians are ignorant, blind sheep chasing a fairy tale; People who cannot cope with reality and must invent something greater than themselves and the world in order to "deal." Reading and participating in many posts here and on other forums, suggests the same undercurrent of doubt in Christians to display any type of intelligence because we put so much faith and stock in belief as opposed to science.

I know that the response will be that the perception does bother other people than myself. Some at my church have responded that the only opinion that should matter is Jesus', but it can't start and stop there. As the Bible says, we're supposed to be ambassadors, representatives of restoration that God promises through Christ, and lights in the darkness. It doesn't mean we're somehow special or above "the world," because we are not the source of light, but reflections of it. The only way we can say that we're different is through the grace and mercy of our Lord Jesus.

So, if it bothers you, like it does me, what can we do about it? Hypocrisy and being judgmental are two aspects I know that discredit Christians. I'd really like to discuss applications and how we counteract this view of Christianity.

Excellent post!!

First off, I don't think one should be bothered by what others think. If people think I'm an idiot, so what. They are certainly entitled to their opinions, as am I. Having 'faith' in something does not make one stupid or unintelligent. Non believers, have faith that God does not exist, and are therefore in the exact same boat as believers. Science in and of itself cannot make any comment on whether God does exist or whether God does not exist. As far as people saying Christians are blind sheep or can't cope with reality, that is a very emotional, subjective argument that is in itself a stereotype and a generalization; it is also one that can be turned around and said of non believers as well.

But, I do agree that as a Christian I am greatly bothered when other Christians don't act like 'Christians'. (Of course on the flip side, I'm greatly bothered by people that use this to discredit Christianity and/or God) The best thing to do is first not to be one of those people. Secondly, educate yourself about your faith, or lack thereof. I find too often on both sides of the coin people using arguments that just do not work and do not actually address Christianity. The other thing is, if you attend a Church, push for so more educational classes about the Bible, Church History, Judaism, etc. I know personally I hate classes like, "How Jesus can make you super duper in 7 steps." That's nonsense in my opinion. I like what the great N.T. scholar Ben Witherington says, "We live in a Jesus haunted society that's Biblically illiterate. These two things don't go together." All in all, perhaps the best advice is if you're going to talk the talk, walk the walk. We as Christians should be the first to correct our fellow Christians. People as non believers should understand that Christians are just humans and therefore are subject to, and allowed to, have 'bad' days where we are mad, or upset, or judgmental -but that it makes profound statement on Christianity or God.

In the end, be a good example of a Christian. Honestly, people will take notice. The overwhelming majority of 'arguments' I've read and heard against Christianity are emotional arguments at their core. You can counter this not with hard, objective facts, but by being polite and cordial to them, and then having a calm discussion with them that will then allow you to introduce other facts.

That's my two cents on the matter,

TNA

[hank-williams]

Originally Posted by rp29nct

Admittedly this is a loaded question, but from discussion with other Christians at my church and in the community, I've gotten some mixed reactions. The most alarming reaction is simply one of apathy.

Does it bother you that our non-Christian peers (what you could term "the world") have a disparaging and often poor opinion in general (and more specifically on the basis of perceived intellect) of Christians who profess and strive to share the Gospel message?

In my circle of friends, I am mostly surrounded by fellow Christians, but it occurred to me to ask my non-Christian friends very personally what they thought of Christians. While they did not put me into the same category, the overwhelming response was that Christians are ignorant, blind sheep chasing a fairy tale; People who cannot cope with reality and must invent something greater than themselves and the world in order to "deal." Reading and participating in many posts here and on other forums, suggests the same undercurrent of doubt in Christians to display any type of intelligence because we put so much faith and stock in belief as opposed to science.

I know that the response will be that the perception does bother other people than myself. Some at my church have responded that the only opinion that should matter is Jesus', but it can't start and stop there. As the Bible says, we're supposed to be ambassadors, representatives of restoration that God promises through Christ, and lights in the darkness. It doesn't mean we're somehow special or above "the world," because we are not the source of light, but reflections of it. The only way we can say that we're different is through the grace and mercy of our Lord Jesus.

So, if it bothers you, like it does me, what can we do about it? Hypocrisy and being judgmental are two aspects I know that discredit Christians. I'd really like to discuss applications and how we counteract this view of Christianity.

Define please what you would consider to be judgemental? I agree that there is a way to go about things but at the same time if the bible is preached and or told to someone that is not passing judgement is it?

[neekz0r]

Originally Posted by hank-williams

Define please what you would consider to be judgemental? I agree that there is a way to go about things but at the same time if the bible is preached and or told to someone that is not passing judgement is it?

In a way, it is. It also depends on how you do it. When you quote the bible to someone, unless it's at their request, you are inherently judging them in that you felt they needed guidance from the bible.

[BG41]

Originally Posted by SlapBassist

I didn't read it but you shouldn't judge people solely by what relgion they believe. Theres a lot more facets to ones' personality

[BG41]

Originally Posted by smokeater

No. Everyone is entitled to their opinions. I don't doubt what I believe so if others wish to make negative comments it won't affect me. People I work with know that I am a Christian, but I don't go out of my way to push it on them, out of respect.

[Violator009]

Originally Posted by rp29nct

So, if it bothers you, like it does me, what can we do about it? Hypocrisy and being judgmental are two aspects I know that discredit Christians. I'd really like to discuss applications and how we counteract this view of Christianity.

Doesnt bother me, and you cant change other people or their perception of you, all you can do is try to live the christian lifestyle in the best way you know how.
Dont worry about what other christians are doing, or how non religious people view you, God will judge and it starts with his house...

[bmy-]

The overwhelming majority of Christians don't think before they speak. That's what it comes down to. They're incapable of putting themselves in someone elses shoes.

Fix that and you fix the problem. Us mormons aren't exempt from that.. sometimes I think the LDS church is nastier. They talk about 'members' and 'non-members' but thankfully the people I associate with aren't idiots and see people for who they are.

[AKR]

Originally Posted by musclebound2007

Well the only reason I asked, is because I went to a private Christian high school and I am Roman Catholic. Now, this was a Baptist school. They made fun of my domination and actually were very hypocritical in their behavior. Their youth camps, were for kids to hook up (although it wasn't said to be the kids were doing it), they were very judgmental and insulting to other religions. Yet, there was a lot of scandal going on, throughout my high school career, that I laugh at Christians thinking that they are all that, just because of their religion.

So, although I am Catholic, I do agree with your non-Christian friends. Christians are highly hypocritical. It's there way or the high way.

This is my personal view, and idea of Christians, because of my experience with the Christian school I attended.

I went to a private Christian school as well, and in that school and the various churches I went to, Catholics were not considered Christian. Everyone was under the impression that they all worshipped Mary and the saints.

[grup910]

Originally Posted by neekz0r

In a way, it is. It also depends on how you do it. When you quote the bible to someone, unless it's at their request, you are inherently judging them in that you felt they needed guidance from the bible.

That's a sign that christianity is fake. If it were something to do with reality, it wouldn't be "judgmental." For example, if someone has a headache and you say, "take a couple of aspirin," that's not "judging" them, it's just reality. with christianity, however, it's perceived and recognized as judgmental, because it's just an opinion that has nothing to do with reality. Therefore, it's like you're saying "my opinion is better than your opinion, and there's something wrong with you for not believing in my unfounded opinion." That's different than with the advice to take an aspirin, because it's just a fact that an aspirin can help with a headache. There's no judgment, because it's reality.

[rp29nct]

Originally Posted by neekz0r

In a way, it is. It also depends on how you do it. When you quote the bible to someone, unless it's at their request, you are inherently judging them in that you felt they needed guidance from the bible.

Agreed that it can be too pushy or offered at the wrong moment. Most Christians are excited about their faith and eager to share it, not because they want to claim superiority, but because it is something personal that happened to them. When I provide advice to my non-Christian friends, it's obviously going to be influenced by Scripture.

The Bible is, at its heart, the over-arching story of God's plan of salvation and restoration for the human race to be returned to a harmonious relationship. To me, that is the essence that has to be first shared, so that there is a foundational understanding between the sharer and the listener. When you talk from am personal point of view in how it changed and continues to change you, I think that's less threatening and judgmental.

Of course, that sharing presupposes that both parties agree that something is wrong with the world.

Good post, though, I appreciate the insight.

[rp29nct]

Originally Posted by bear87

good work man, we always need more threads to bash christians and their beliefs

What are you talking about? Did you even read any of the original post or discussion? I'm a Christian asking OTHER Christians if the perception I've encountered bothers them like it does me. That I'm hearing more from non-Christians is still quite helpful.

I'm not bashing Christians... I'm trying to discuss an obvious problem with involvement from my fellow believers.

[neekz0r]

Originally Posted by rp29nct

Agreed that it can be too pushy or offered at the wrong moment. Most Christians are excited about their faith and eager to share it, not because they want to claim superiority, but because it is something personal that happened to them. When I provide advice to my non-Christian friends, it's obviously going to be influenced by Scripture.

I know I'm always excited when I learn something new or when something I know can help someone else out. Christians aren't any different in that respect. However, I think a lot of it has to do with ... tone .. I can't put it in any better words. Again, I think it has to do with my previous post in regards to religions and the "us vs them" mentality.

Originally Posted by rp29nct

The Bible is, at its heart, the over-arching story of God's plan of salvation and restoration for the human race to be returned to a harmonious relationship. To me, that is the essence that has to be first shared, so that there is a foundational understanding between the sharer and the listener. When you talk from am personal point of view in how it changed and continues to change you, I think that's less threatening and judgmental.

Of course, that sharing presupposes that both parties agree that something is wrong with the world.

Good post, though, I appreciate the insight.

The bible has many wonderful things going for it. It also has some extremely judgmental things, as well. From a Christian perspective, I imagine it's hard to walk the line between separating yourself from sin and keeping friendships with your non-Christian friends. I know this has caused tension between my Christian friends and my non-Christian friends (myself included). At such times, even if it's not intended to be so, it does seem like we are being judged as unworthy of the Christians friends presence.

[guest89]

Originally Posted by rp29nct

.

Does it bother you that our non-Christian peers (what you could term "the world") have a disparaging and often poor opinion in general (and more specifically on the basis of perceived intellect) of Christians who profess and strive to share the Gospel message?

.

What bothers me a bit more is the fake 'Christians' who say one thing, do another, and cause 'the world' to have a poor opinion on Christianity as a whole.




I have a friend who's family is like that, and its sad. People who they come into contact with them are like "Is that really what Christianity is about?" And they form a poor opinion on everyone because a few people are living a lie.

[hank-williams]

Originally Posted by neekz0r

In a way, it is. It also depends on how you do it. When you quote the bible to someone, unless it's at their request, you are inherently judging them in that you felt they needed guidance from the bible.

In a sense you are right, but truth is truth. i agree that everyone does not adhere to what the bible teaches, so therfor they may not want to hear it. For example in this forum it is entitled religious forum so from that heading I could determine that religious things will be discussed and if I am easly offended I may not want to visit it.

[Swamp Dog]

Originally Posted by DorteeClan

That always annoys me when people blurt out how much of a "good Christian" they are. Christians should never have to tell people whether they are Christian or not. Their actions should show the love and respect that Christ had for all people. That's the mark of a good Christian IMHO.

People who would say they are a "good Christian" are either liars or full of pride.
Wait, that kinda negates the whole "good Christian" label doesn't it?

[chocs]

Every Christian should believe that he was saved in baptism, is being saved now through believing in Jesus and living a clean life and will be saved when he or she dies. It is not enough to say we believe in Jesus therefore we are saved. We do not know what will happen in the end. And a true Christian will have his share of suffering. This suffering will push you to new limits and God through grace will create you what he wants you to be not what we want to be. This happens eventually and a novice Christian is not bad if he doesn't do the above, he just has not become proper yet which will happen in time.

This suffering makes you like dead in this world it will give you power that whoever slaps you you will turn the other cheek to him also so you will have great power under control. We politely share the Bible with other people and when they say no thank we move on and don't make them feel bad. We should never talk about the subject to them again. We should not try to force others to believe, we should not argue or make them inferior because this shows we have no love. Lastly we should not try to prove our faith because it is as if we are questioning it ourselves.

Other people believe only in science and try to present proof and we have our own kind of proof where we think science fails. A particular lady I have heard of had cancer in her intestines and they removed 70% of them and only gave her a little while to live but those intestines by the power of God grew back into their original state and she is normal again. So some chose to believe in science and should be respected and others chose to believe elsewhere where they believe science has failed.

[neekz0r]

Originally Posted by chocs

Every Christian should believe that he was saved in baptism, is being saved now through believing in Jesus and living a clean life and will be saved when he or she dies. It is not enough to say we believe in Jesus therefore we are saved. We do not know what will happen in the end. And a true Christian will have his share of suffering. This suffering will push you to new limits and God through grace will create you what he wants you to be not what we want to be. This happens eventually and a novice Christian is not bad if he doesn't do the above, he just has not become proper yet which will happen in time.

This suffering makes you like dead in this world it will give you power that whoever slaps you you will turn the other cheek to him also so you will have great power under control. We politely share the Bible with other people and when they say no thank we move on and don't make them feel bad. We should never talk about the subject to them again. We should not try to force others to believe, we should not argue or make them inferior because this shows we have no love. Lastly we should not try to prove our faith because it is as if we are questioning it ourselves.

Other people believe only in science and try to present proof and we have our own kind of proof where we think science fails. A particular lady I have heard of had cancer in her intestines and they removed 70% of them and only gave her a little while to live but those intestines by the power of God grew back into their original state and she is normal again. So some chose to believe in science and should be respected and others chose to believe elsewhere where they believe science has failed.

A well done, thoughtful, and, from an outsiders point of view, how a Christian should behave.

[smokeater]

Originally Posted by grup910

So if you weren't a christian and your co-workers were, you wouldn't want them to tell you about christianity?

If I wasn't a Christian, but my co-workers were, and I wanted to know about Christianity, I would ask them.

[NimmajNeb101]

Wow There is a lot being covered in this thread.

To the initial question, no it does not bother me that non-christians think of me in a negative manner. I do my best to change that when I can but I do not let it get to me. I know what I am and I know I cannot change other people's opinions in an instant.

To the question of Catholics. I think it is wrong to say that Catholics cannot be as much christian as any Prodestent. I believe that anyone that has prayed the sinner's prayer and gone through baptism and has TRULY repented is in fact Christian. I believe that there are Catholics that are christians and that there are also prodestent "christians" that aren't. In any church there are always the people that play church.

[lancs_hotpot]

I view most christians as very misled

[rp29nct]

Originally Posted by lancs_hotpot

I view most christians as very misled

Would you care to elaborate? What, specifically, would you say Christians are misled about, and would you say it is willingly so or not?

[SYRIANKID]

I respect Christians who stand up for their morality and try to save society's ethically sinking ship.

Check this thread out:

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hlight=America

[DCarruso]

Originally Posted by chocs

Every Christian should believe that he was saved in baptism, is being saved now through believing in Jesus and living a clean life and will be saved when he or she dies. It is not enough to say we believe in Jesus therefore we are saved. We do not know what will happen in the end. And a true Christian will have his share of suffering. This suffering will push you to new limits and God through grace will create you what he wants you to be not what we want to be. This happens eventually and a novice Christian is not bad if he doesn't do the above, he just has not become proper yet which will happen in time.

This suffering makes you like dead in this world it will give you power that whoever slaps you you will turn the other cheek to him also so you will have great power under control. We politely share the Bible with other people and when they say no thank we move on and don't make them feel bad. We should never talk about the subject to them again. We should not try to force others to believe, we should not argue or make them inferior because this shows we have no love. Lastly we should not try to prove our faith because it is as if we are questioning it ourselves.

Other people believe only in science and try to present proof and we have our own kind of proof where we think science fails. A particular lady I have heard of had cancer in her intestines and they removed 70% of them and only gave her a little while to live but those intestines by the power of God grew back into their original state and she is normal again. So some chose to believe in science and should be respected and others chose to believe elsewhere where they believe science has failed.

Science and Christianity are not mutually exclusive, in contrary to what has been insinuated by a couple anti religion, bitter losers on the forum.

Check out this book, by the former head of the Human Genome Project, medical genetist, Dr.Francis S. Collins. A Christian scientist.

http://www.amazon.com/Language-God-S...791640&sr=8-12

[Klippymitch]

Originally Posted by SYRIANKID

I respect Christians who stand up for their morality and try to save society's ethically sinking ship.

Check this thread out:

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hlight=America

Same here.