Overtraining: What it is and what it isn't. And why you've stalled.

[wyche128]

To help in the process of increasing muscle mass you must diversify your workout. This could be as simple as varying the amount of reps you do on each exercise. if you stay in the same routine you muscles will adapt and stop growing. Here are two simple ways to avoid this problem

http://www.buildmuscleandburnfat.net...mart-training/

[Mavrock]

I've had a theory, but need others opinions on it.

for a routine, what if for example, u do your average bench press, but what if you don't do the amount of reps which requires a weeks rest period before benching again, but you do it everyday, upping the weight every week, without ever working yourself to the pain level?

usually when you see builders etc, they are usually well muscled out and they work the same muscle groups day after day, but they're tools aren't getting heavier so they have a stopping point.

views please?

[URYNOME]

Is it just as good to keep changing up the workouts every couple of weeks. Like for example using an easy curl bar for all sets of Bi's one week and using dumbbells the next week etc.?

[RforREVOLUTION]

Isn't just common sense to take a deload period to get "water off of your bucket"?? I mean you should do what your body is asking for. You can't just keep working out and be exhausted all the time, because then you won't be giving time for the muscle fibers to heal and get stronger. Anyways, whoever thinks his/her workout is not helping they should stop eating mcdonalds and stick to a healthy diet!

BTW: VM, it was a great article for people that don't have common sense. It was like a DELOADING FOR DUMMIES! Nice way to put it though! REP TO YOU MAN!

[ha775]

Viking Man,

just wanted to start off by saying im new to the site, but have been training for 3 years now.. started off at 115kg (all fat)... now a nice leanish 85kg (with a bit of loose skin)... not too happy, but what can you do..

this was the first article i read as i was once a victim of over training, and i cant stress enough how important it is let you CNS recover!
i train 6 days a week (1 body part per day) and rest on sunday. i never really had an issue with increasing size and strength, especially considering i was dieting to lose fat at the same time (a hard balance to obtain, but possible).

after years of maintaining a solid training routine pushing my body to its limits, i finally hit the wall and plateaued about 4 months ago. exactly what you were talking about! i lost all motivation, and felt drained all day at work. due to my fatigue i hastly decided to purchase caffeine tablets to use pre-workout (caffeine messes with ur CNS).. this continued for about 2 month till i decided to re-evaluate my training.

my diet is pretty immaculate (i think) so the only things i could change were my sleeping patterns, my training schedule, and re-evaluate my supplements. sleep was increased to 9hrs per night, and i decided to take an extra day off mid week (having 2 rest days now). caffeine was cut right out of my diet. within a week i was feeling like the hole in the bottom of that bucket u mention just got bigger!

training was back to full steam ahead and i was lifting heavier than before, as well as putting on some good size! (hard to quantify exact amount of muscle as i continue to lose fat)..

i just wanted to thank you for taking the time to write the article and sharing ur thoughts with everybody else. its surprising how much a little tweaking to your training program can make the world of difference!

background info:
- never, and will never (i hope) touch steroids.
- i train for about 2 hrs each session in the evenings after work

at the moment i am on the following supplements:
- Jungle warfare - ALRI Industries
- PowerFul - USPLabs
- Recreate - USPLabs
- MAX's protein

[daniel_d]

Thx man its been now a year that ive been training and this thread will sure be a big part of my training thx again !!

[Wilsonator]

this is working great for me.. i think im doing it right lol. i was working hard for about 5-6 weeks then my body began to hurt all the time everywhere, so i decided to make my workouts lighter and i visually see results, one question how long do i keep my workouts light???

[Jknis]

Hi I'm 20 years old, I'm 6'3" 255lbs and natural. I have extremely long arms and my chest and back overpower my arms and delts. Would training my arms 2x a week (Tues or wed) and again on saturday be overtraining, or beneficial. Any tips to increase width of my delts, I currently perform seated barbell military presses, Standing behind the neck presses, seated lateral raises(charles glass style) front raises, and 1 arm lateral raises. Any suggestions?

[nusya]

http://www.gudis.50gigs.net Here there are many resources
http://www.gudis.07x.net It can help you

[lees]

I just may say , you have a good theory or a good point of view, and this could be useful for some of us,or for another maybe not, but is it a good thread

[JacktFibras]

if i havn't hit a plateau.. and am still increasing my weight each week... is my CNS fried or am i still good to continue at my current state of intensity? i do get tired sometimes and am alwats sore and sometimes pretty drained... but i'm still makin some good progress... what do you guys recommend?

[flexxdzl]

I'm confused..lol

U only need to work out one body part a week?

here's what's I've been doing

Mon..chest/tri's
Tues...back/biceps
weds..thighs/calves
thus...chest/tri's
friday...back and bi's
Sat...tighs/calves

Sun rest

5 day's a week walking on treadmill 2 miles

So I should do

mon..chest
tues...legs
weds..back
thurs..arms
fri..something

then rest sat an sun ..and this will work? r u serious?

[ChicagoBldr]

I think that's what is being said. I have followed both routines before. I'm currently back on the once a week plan. Except for abs and calves.

Mon- Back
Tues- Shoulders/Calves/Abs
Wed- Legs
Thurs- Calves/Abs/Arms
Friday- Chest
Saturday- More legs if I'm up for it (legs are my weak point so I try to hit 'em 2x a week. could be a light day just for a pump)
Sunday- off

Try that...I love this split. I don't get burnt out during the week on big body parts since they are split up through the week.

[MuscleMike15]

How do you know if ur overtraining


Because like i workout 3 times a week in a gym, but than sometimes ill do abs every other day at home or like work a bodypart that i havent worked in awhile at home aside from my 3 days a week

like monday wednesday and friday, or sometimes tuesday thursday saturday

Like heres my gym split

Day-Morning - Chest,Back, ABS/Core, and some squats before working chest
Day-Morning-Biceps, Triceps, forearms, ABS/Core
Day-Morning- Legs and shoulders Abs/Core- like Leg press, and mass building exercises in addition to legs and shoulders

i workout with a personal trainer so im not overtraining at the gym.

But sometimes if i wanted to work something but forgot, id work it at home that day,


or ill do an ab workout in the morning on the days i dont workout in the gym

I dont want to overtrain and hit a plateau, how do u know if ur overtraining and stuff

and any ideas on different splits and stuff, cause i want to maybe do a 4 day split, like what are some good days to do it on and like what two days would be back to back

[aoklesson]

Great post VM, it was really informative

[ChicagoBldr]

Originally Posted by MuscleMike15

How do you know if ur overtraining


Because like i workout 3 times a week in a gym, but than sometimes ill do abs every other day at home or like work a bodypart that i havent worked in awhile at home aside from my 3 days a week

like monday wednesday and friday, or sometimes tuesday thursday saturday

Like heres my gym split

Day-Morning - Chest,Back, ABS/Core, and some squats before working chest
Day-Morning-Biceps, Triceps, forearms, ABS/Core
Day-Morning- Legs and shoulders Abs/Core- like Leg press, and mass building exercises in addition to legs and shoulders

i workout with a personal trainer so im not overtraining at the gym.

But sometimes if i wanted to work something but forgot, id work it at home that day,


or ill do an ab workout in the morning on the days i dont workout in the gym

I dont want to overtrain and hit a plateau, how do u know if ur overtraining and stuff

and any ideas on different splits and stuff, cause i want to maybe do a 4 day split, like what are some good days to do it on and like what two days would be back to back

Overtraining can come in many forms. If you are really tired, just not into the workout, or hurt yourself. Your body will tell you if you're overdoing it. Listen to what it's saying.

Is that more helpful?

[MuscleMike15]

Originally Posted by Chitown79SLoop

Overtraining can come in many forms. If you are really tired, just not into the workout, or hurt yourself. Your body will tell you if you're overdoing it. Listen to what it's saying.

Is that more helpful?

yeah thanks man it helped

[Joel.]

Originally Posted by flexxdzl

So I should do

mon..chest
tues...legs
weds..back
thurs..arms
fri..something

then rest sat an sun ..and this will work?

Thats a very similar split to one my training partner and I had run for a long time, For the last month or two we have been tying a simpler push/pull split alternating one day on one day off style.
I think mixing it up is advantageous, personally reaching failure followed by a couple of forced reps is as far as I'll go and I find myself ready to work out the same muscle group three or four days ahead perfect. A whole week leaves everything feeling a little unloved if you ask me.

[grow14me2]

I am doing the body for life program. What supplements should I be taking???

[JohnyB997]

Great post, I realy have a better understanding of fatigue now

[asukyle]

I am tired of reading people's articles asking whether or not they are overtraining. A spreadsheet of your workout is not going to give an explanation as to whether or not you are overtraining. I have seen guys do more sets for one bodypart than it takes me to complete my workout (1 hour), which usually includes two muscle groups. Just because they spend an hour of doing the same exercise for the same bodypart during that time does not necessarily mean they are overtraining. That would be overtraining to me, but for them it may be different. If your gains stop and you are still sore from the previous chest workout, to a point that it limits your ability to lift your weight, than it is possible you are overtraining. It is also possible that you are in need of a break from the gym (when is the last time you took one?). If you think you are overtraining, to a point that you have to ask someone in order to try and get someone to tell you otherwise, cut back on quantity and add some quality.

[Iron Rain]

Originally Posted by asukyle

I am tired of reading people's articles asking whether or not they are overtraining. A spreadsheet of your workout is not going to give an explanation as to whether or not you are overtraining. I have seen guys do more sets for one bodypart than it takes me to complete my workout (1 hour), which usually includes two muscle groups. Just because they spend an hour of doing the same exercise for the same bodypart during that time does not necessarily mean they are overtraining. That would be overtraining to me, but for them it may be different. If your gains stop and you are still sore from the previous chest workout, to a point that it limits your ability to lift your weight, than it is possible you are overtraining. It is also possible that you are in need of a break from the gym (when is the last time you took one?). If you think you are overtraining, to a point that you have to ask someone in order to try and get someone to tell you otherwise, cut back on quantity and add some quality.

Seconded.

__________________
http://germanvolumetraining.blogspot.com
GERMAN VOLUME TRAINING

[debbniev18]

Originally Posted by VikingMan

So your chest isn?t growing like you want it to, or your bench isn?t going up anymore, or your squat has stalled. Why?

Here is one of the most common reasons why, other than diet.

CNS fatigue. Unless your diet just sucks balls, the answer is usually that you don't understand fatigue, what it does to progress, and what to do about it.

Get this, because the solution to your problems WILL involve this concept one way or another.

Think of CNS fatigue as water and as yourself as a bucket. When you lift heavy weights, it's basically like taking a cup of water, and pouring it into the bucket. The size of the cup is how strong you are coupled with how much work you do. When you sleep and eat right, you open up a temporary hole in the bottom of the bucket. Now. The stage is set.

Take this example, and imagine what happens as you continue lifting weight on a frequent basis, slowly getting bigger and stronger. Your decent sleep and eating habits allow you to empty the bucket of the fatigue you've accumulated because the cup you've been using to fill the bucket is pretty small. But now you're stronger and can do more work, and the cup is bigger. The bucket fills itself faster than you can empty it. And eventually, it's too full. What happens when the bucket is too full? Simple. The fatigue spills over, inhibiting performance in the gym. Boom. Automatic plateau halting your progress just as sure as the sun will rise tomorrow. Why the plateau? Because of accumulated CNS fatigue that you can't get rid of.

So. What do you do about it? Chances are VERY good that you have the genetic potential to reach whatever goal you?re shooting for, unless you?re already quite advanced, at which point, some realism might be a healthy thing. How do you get there when the CNS fatigue induced by the weight you?re using is halting your progress?

Again, the answer is simple. The answer gets into the different rates at which fatigue and fitness dissipate. All this time while you've been lifting weights, accumulating fatigue, you have ALSO been accumulating fitness, in the form of bigger and stronger muscles. The CNS fatigue has halted your progress however, so the fitness is temporarily stalled. If you were to do something that would temporarily decrease the size of the cup, what would happen? The fatigue would dissipate, right? Well, wouldn't the fitness likewise dissipate? Actually, NO, it would not, at least, not at first. So, how do we use a smaller cup? Perform less work, for a limited period of time. This allows the fatigue to dissipate, because fatigue dissipates FASTER than fitness, good thing too.

Result... dual factor theory. CNS fatigue and fitness dissipate at different rates. If you deload, or start using a smaller cup for a short period of time, the CNS fatigue will dissipate quickly, while the fitness won't really dissipate at all. Thus, your CNS is now fresh, and progress can once more take place.

So what do you do? You deload. Deloading is just drastically cutting the amount of work you perform. You can do this in several ways.

1. Cut sets and/or reps, use same weight.

2. Cut weight, use same sets and/or reps.

3. Both

I like to cut sets and use the same weight. My primary concern is getting stronger, so I'd rather keep the intensity high, but just do less work with it.

So, if you normally do 10 sets for chest, for example, do 2 or 3 for a period of one to two weeks. OR, if you?re still relatively weak, just do a reset. Drop weight by 20-30 pounds, and work back up to your current maxes over a period of 3-4 weeks using the same set/rep scheme.

Do this with ALL the work you do in the gym. This will allow the fatigue to dissipate. Once the deload is over, resume normal training. Your fresh CNS will now allow you to get stronger because it can now perform at full capacity again.

In terms of timeframes involved, the stronger you are, the faster the bucket fills up. An advanced lifter moving big poundages will be ready to deload after only 3-4 weeks. It's the primary reason why progress gets progressively harder as you get stronger. A weaker lifter will take longer to fill his bucket, but as soon as he crosses a threshold, he WILL fill it with any kind of serious work in the gym.

Also, there are things you can do to make the hole in your bucket bigger. Eat better, sleep better, reduce stress in your life, take your vitamins, improve your conditioning with cardio, get laid once in a while. Stuff like that.

BUT, don't let anyone make you believe that overtraining is a myth. It's simply a matter of time before heavy weight training puts you there. Not that you shouldn?t do all you can to increase the size of the hole in your bucket, but if you don't learn how to deal with fatigue, you'll become a "critique my workout" thread starting zombie, perpetually wondering why you can't make any progress, looking everywhere you can for the next magic workout program to "shock your muscles into growth", buying hundreds of dollars worth of supplements each month thinking they are actually the answer. Funny. All you really needed was to learn how and when to take one step back, so you could take five steps forward.

AND THEN...

This is also one of the primary reasons why guys prematurely turn to steroids, unless their just stupid and start using them right off the bat because they think it's the only way to grow muscle. They stall and think they need something special to help them continue making progress. Will the steroids do it? Absolutely. Because they generally have the affect of increasing your recovery capacity. The real kicker is, the results they achieved throughout their early use of steroids could have easily been achieved without the gear, if they had simply understood fatigue. How foolish is that?

Hi. I was checking out what you wrote about overtraining. I was at a plateau for a while and seem to have broken it. But, I don't know if I am doing too much in one session at the gym or not. I also want to try new things, but am new to all this. If you could give my workouts a quick look and offer some advice I'd appreciate it! Thanks so much!

[gonloft]

Originally Posted by RforREVOLUTION

Isn't just common sense to take a deload period to get "water off of your bucket"?? I mean you should do what your body is asking for. You can't just keep working out and be exhausted all the time, because then you won't be giving time for the muscle fibers to heal and get stronger. Anyways, whoever thinks his/her workout is not helping they should stop eating mcdonalds and stick to a healthy diet!

Agree with ya 100%!

[oldmanriver92]

Great advice VM, clearly you know what you're talking about so keep helping us all out, your the kind of guy who needs to be dishing the info out, not some joke who doesn't know anything. Keep it up VM

[BuildYourGUnz]

Originally Posted by Chitown79SLoop

I think that's what is being said. I have followed both routines before. I'm currently back on the once a week plan. Except for abs and calves.

Mon- Back
Tues- Shoulders/Calves/Abs
Wed- Legs
Thurs- Calves/Abs/Arms
Friday- Chest
Saturday- More legs if I'm up for it (legs are my weak point so I try to hit 'em 2x a week. could be a light day just for a pump)
Sunday- off

Try that...I love this split. I don't get burnt out during the week on big body parts since they are split up through the week.

Not a bad routine. I personally thinking you should hit every muscle twice a week. This amount of rest seems unneccessary. I'd also personaly have a hard time going to the gym for 20 min a day or however long it would take to hit one body part.

[BuildYourGUnz]

Great post VM! deffinetly some good info here. Thanks for the knowledge.

[wyrepyre]

Originally Posted by BuildYourGUnz

Not a bad routine. I personally thinking you should hit every muscle twice a week. This amount of rest seems unneccessary. I'd also personaly have a hard time going to the gym for 20 min a day or however long it would take to hit one body part.

I work my weak areas twice a week, but keep all other areas to once a week...feels good...more rest is better...however you are 24

[allredkidd]

good post my man, I think I realy sufferd from this. So my scedule at work plays a big role in fatige to right?

[diebreezy]

I also suffered from overtraining a month ago. My bench press was growing very fast and I felt great. Started to workout more often about 5 times a week. Each day 2 muscle groups. Started to have headaches, felt worse and the worst thing was that my bench press regressed. My blood pressure was too high. Doctor signed me some pills. I took them for a week. When I felt better, I wrote a new training program for me. From that week I understood what overtraining means. Now I workout 1 muscle group in about 9 days. Feel a lot better and results are growing. So I think that to rest is as important as to workout and to eat.