Functional Trainer Vs. Weight Training

[xxsupergman25xx]

Ive been a trainer for a little over a year and been pretty much weight training. with most people ive noticed great progress with my clients.. i started workin at a new gym 6 months ago where most of the trainers are pretty much functional trainers. i started to throw a little bit of functional training in but havent noticed better results with it. our new boss is only about functional training and i find it quite annoyin that all he cares about is body weight....i think functional training is for the people who want to feel better that they worked out with little change..a little more strength overall. and weight training is for more look. how do u other trainers or people who workout themselves feel about this?

[bennutts929]

I agree with you 100%!
I've been training college students (starting my first adult client tomorrow!) for about 6 months and I've had great success with doing traditional "spiced up" weight training programs. I've seen great results from following some bodybuilding principles sometimes as well like throwing in a drop set/super set to really get my clients pumped!

I believe in direct sport functional training, but for the average mr. and mrs. jones don't be afraid to put em on that squat rack!

That's just me though.

[dasixthsun]

Originally Posted by xxsupergman25xx

Ive been a trainer for a little over a year and been pretty much weight training. with most people ive noticed great progress with my clients.. i started workin at a new gym 6 months ago where most of the trainers are pretty much functional trainers. i started to throw a little bit of functional training in but havent noticed better results with it. our new boss is only about functional training and i find it quite annoyin that all he cares about is body weight....i think functional training is for the people who want to feel better that they worked out with little change..a little more strength overall. and weight training is for more look. how do u other trainers or people who workout themselves feel about this?

i see your from pennsylvania. do you happen to work at fitness together?

[mydamnself]

Take this as constructive criticism, meaning it's not mean to offend.
You're a little backward on what functional training is, but there's also a good chance many of the trainers around you are as well, which is only creating more confusion. Functional training is about postural correction, restoring primal movement patterns (squatting, lunging, etc.) and giving the client the ability to work through all ranges of motion strongly, and not predicated ranges of motion such as what occurs when you train on machines.
I do all functional training. 'Looking good' for some means big biceps, exaggerated pecs, etc. In my opinion someone with a well rounded build, strength, and proper posture is more impressive than some guy with sweet abs that are virtually never seen.
As I said, I do all functional training. For most this conjures up images of people doing planks, working with swiss balls, bands, etc.
We do deadlfts, squats, kettlebells, clubbells, sandbag training, etc. Functional training does not have to be some lightweight endeavor.
Think outside the box.
Squatting is functional training, it is a primal movement pattern. Once you have established the client can squat properly with no weight, load them up!

[Kiknskreem]

Originally Posted by xxsupergman25xx

i think functional training is for the people who want to feel better that they worked out with little change..a little more strength overall. and weight training is for more look.

Wow, you train people?

[billy]

Originally Posted by mydamnself

Squatting is functional training, it is a primal movement pattern. Once you have established the client can squat properly with no weight, load them up!

Agreed. Squatting, whether it be with BW or with external loading is much more functional than doing chest press standing on a bosu ball. I don't have anything aganist bosu balls, but I would rather stick with the closed kinetic chain exercises for more carry-over in being functional.

Here's article by Christian Thibaudeau on what I believe the definition of functional training should be.

http://www.t-nation.com/readArticle.do?id=459430

Here's a small piece from the article incase it's too long of read for some you.

Type of Exercises

Complex motor tasks require a more important nervous system implication. With functional training we want to improve the capacity of the nervous system to solve motor tasks, so we need to use strength training exercises that are complex. Multi-joint exercises are the only way to go. Exercises such as squats, deadlifts, presses, cleans, snatches and chins are all prime choices. Isolation drills should be thrown out if you're strictly interested in functional gains.

Some stability or Swiss ball lovers will argue that unstable exercises are good for functional improvements because of the high level of complexity of these exercises. It?s true that they're complex from a motor standpoint, however, since the potential of these exercises for strength, strength-speed and speed-strength improvement is very low (at best) I really don't consider them to be functional training in its truest sense.

[nickmanzoni]

I like using swiss balls/bosu balls in MY training as well as client training.


I do feel like they've grown too big for their briches however.

It could be that the constant adjustment/readjustment that is put into place during a "ball" exercise is to somehow create a "more efficient" motor pathway. I basically use them as a mental toughness thing. If I can db press 'X' weight on a swiss ball, in my head I feel like I *could* do more on a stable surface.

The only tme where these balls take majority is when I do work "the core".

And I hate how using the word core is now a naughty word.

/2-cents

[HardGainer82]

It's become a "craze" in some gyms, which isn't a bad thing necessarily, as long as people actually understand what it is and how it works.

Unfortunately as a "craze" it also has the backlash against it.

[DeezNuutz]

Wow, cant believe this debate still exists. I went through this growing pain with a gym back 2003. The way I look @ it:

Functional training as a "craze" meaning the primary useage of Sballs, dyna discs, bands, sliding boards, etc. is merely a passing fad and is most popular in the gym setting not b/c of its effectiveness (any exercise within your THR is effective done for @ least 30 min on most days of the week) but more so for the growth and marketing of Personal training. You see, FT will give most trainers job security as it forces clients to need trainers to perform such activities. I.e while standing on a bosu ball whose going to throw you the medicine ball while you do the proverbial squat on an unstable surface. LOL. Yes in some ways these exercises will make you perform a tad better but anything we come up with as trainers working agonist, antagonist, and synergist muscles will make you perform slightly better. Welcome to the wonderful world of marketing. This phenom known as "FUNCTIONAL TRAINING" is a brand. We think of words like "CORE STABILITY" and "STRUCTURAL ASSESSMENTS" and that justifies our job as personal trainer. A little knowledge goes a long way and as I always teach "EVERY THING WORKS.... FOR A WHILE". A good mix of all training styles with a client IMO is a great way to keep retention high and inhibit staleness for you and your client. Trust me, if any of you ever had 4 bodybuilders in a row to train ( boring ****) youd conteplate suicide. Counting reps are very boring. Periodization is the way to go. Use a mulititude of training styles.

[NDame616]

Originally Posted by DeezNuutz

Wow, cant believe this debate still exists. I went through this growing pain with a gym back 2003. The way I look @ it:

Whenever I see a woman (or a guy) do something like a squat to curl to press on an umside down BOSU with 5 lb weights I can't help but think how much harder/effective they would find the exercise if they got three different weights, supersetted them on the ground with 30 seconds rest (at most).

Just because an exercise is "hard" doesn't make it "effective". You want to train the core? do planks/side planks and some type of ball rollout. Don't do your core when trying to lift other stuff. There's plenty of core exercises out there.

[DeezNuutz]

Originally Posted by NDame616

Whenever I see a woman (or a guy) do something like a squat to curl to press on an umside down BOSU with 5 lb weights I can't help but think how much harder/effective they would find the exercise if they got three different weights, supersetted them on the ground with 30 seconds rest (at most).

Just because an exercise is "hard" doesn't make it "effective". You want to train the core? do planks/side planks and some type of ball rollout. Don't do your core when trying to lift other stuff. There's plenty of core exercises out there.

Agreed. LOL @ the trainers doing the squat curl, or the side lunge with a standing press @ the end. OMG, kills me. Do one or the other.

Originally Posted by NDame616

Just because an exercise is "hard" doesn't make it "effective".

So true and everyone believes this from bodybuilders to your average joe. "man, so and so is tough, I was about to puke he's a great trainer" how many times have you heard that? I 100% agree with you

[NDame616]

I'm very boot campish/circuit training oriented, but making the client sore and in pain or puke isn't a good thing. Hell I could probably have a client spend one hour doing push ups. And that's it. Or burpees. For an hour. They'd pule doing either (probably more so with burpees) and be insanely sore with the push ups. Is that a "good" workout?

[dasixthsun]

Originally Posted by DeezNuutz

Agreed. LOL @ the trainers doing the squat curl, or the side lunge with a standing press @ the end. OMG, kills me. Do one or the other.



So true and everyone believes this from bodybuilders to your average joe. "man, so and so is tough, I was about to puke he's a great trainer" how many times have you heard that? I 100% agree with you

Agreed. Seems like thats all some of these so called trainers now. "i kicked her ass" , " i almost made him puke", " he nearly fainted after my workout" and they think these things are positive. And the client doesnt no any better because they believe in the whole no pain no gain saying

[hublife]

This debate is pointless unless you know the clients goal. So unless you have the stones to walk up to a trainer and a client who are doing a particular exercise and ASK what their goals are then you really should keep your judgements to yourself.

Me personally I implement ALL types of training with my clients. I also do my best to reserve judgement because unless you know what that trainer and client have discussed you run the risk of looking like a jerk.

Just my .02

[nickmanzoni]

I forgot that most people are the best body posture analyzers ever!


To think: to be able to understand what's wrong with them after 20 seconds of looking at them! And to be able to criticize and scrutinize from ivory towers....


I wish I was that good.

[DeezNuutz]

Honestly most clients don't know what their goals are need to be. Also, a majority of Personal Trainers have no idea how to get clients to establish proper goals. I'd be willing to bet any amount of money that the clients I see that do predominantly "core" related exercises stated emphatically that their goals were to "tone" or "lose weight" or "Flatten my stomach" and its a matter of intensities. Can intensity be quantified by better movement? Can it be measured by amount of exercises or the level of difficulty? What i'm getting @ is for the most part the goals that people have arent being addressed when they are trained in this manner. I rarely if ever have seen a client say to me as a goal, "id like to perfect my gait" or "enhance my core stability" or better yet "inhibit my anterior pelvic tilt". What i'm seeing is a case of personal trainers working outside of their scope of practice. Overpromising and under delivering. If it was important to me i'd love to walk up to a trainer that was training their client in this manner and ask them what their clients goals were. The answer wont be any of the Latter i'll tell you that. More closely related to the former. JMO.

[NDame616]

Originally Posted by nickmanzoni

I forgot that most people are the best body posture analyzers ever!


To think: to be able to understand what's wrong with them after 20 seconds of looking at them! And to be able to criticize and scrutinize from ivory towers....


I wish I was that good.

It takes about ten seconds worth of squats to see what their postural issues are, what muscles are tight and weak, etc. If you have someone do an overhead squat and then basic view of their posture, you can very quickly determine what has to be done to certain muscle imbalances to correct them

[DeezNuutz]

Originally Posted by NDame616

It takes about ten seconds worth of squats to see what their postural issues are, what muscles are tight and weak, etc. If you have someone do an overhead squat and then basic view of their posture, you can very quickly determine what has to be done to certain muscle imbalances to correct them

I agree with that if the Proper HHQ's have been addressed and there are no prior injuries or trauma like, car accidents or sports injuries. Then it becomes much greater of a feat and small problems are made worse by attempting to correct what we (personal trainers) arent trained to do. It becomes physical therapy. Very easy to get sued nowadays. Just because WE CAN dosen't mean WE SHOULD.

[nickmanzoni]

So you know how long that client has been training, what issues they need to address and their limiting factors are from "Whenever I see a woman (or a guy) do something like a squat to curl to press on an umside down BOSU with 5 lb weights I can't help but think how much harder/effective they would find the exercise if they got three different weights, supersetted them on the ground with 30 seconds rest (at most)."


perhaps asthma? perhaps a rehab-type necessity with a cardio-esq routine? Perhaps creating better mind-muscle connections? Curl squats are very similar to clean and jerks... you don't see people who clean and press as inferior trainees do you? Because why not just squat and THEN press? I dunno.... I bet YOU do.


I don't like people who think they are "holier than thou"

[jcpicou]

I stick to the Basics, they get the results people are looking for. Now if you are trained through NASM you'll note the first stages are for balance and stability, and some clients need to start slow but as soon as it is physically possible i bring them up to speed with weights, and activities, Then we go back to the explosive movements when they hit plateaus, and then i'll do like a week or two of alternative excercises with the Medicine balls, and playing with there unstable surfaces then we go back to the weights.

[hublife]

Originally Posted by nickmanzoni

So you know how long that client has been training, what issues they need to address and their limiting factors are from "Whenever I see a woman (or a guy) do something like a squat to curl to press on an umside down BOSU with 5 lb weights I can't help but think how much harder/effective they would find the exercise if they got three different weights, supersetted them on the ground with 30 seconds rest (at most)."


perhaps asthma? perhaps a rehab-type necessity with a cardio-esq routine? Perhaps creating better mind-muscle connections? Curl squats are very similar to clean and jerks... you don't see people who clean and press as inferior trainees do you? Because why not just squat and THEN press? I dunno.... I bet YOU do.


I don't like people who think they are "holier than thou"

This is exactly the point I was trying to make. Love the "Ivory towers" reference in a previous post.

[xxsupergman25xx]

Originally Posted by DeezNuutz

Wow, cant believe this debate still exists. I went through this growing pain with a gym back 2003. The way I look @ it:

Functional training as a "craze" meaning the primary useage of Sballs, dyna discs, bands, sliding boards, etc. is merely a passing fad and is most popular in the gym setting not b/c of its effectiveness (any exercise within your THR is effective done for @ least 30 min on most days of the week) but more so for the growth and marketing of Personal training. You see, FT will give most trainers job security as it forces clients to need trainers to perform such activities. I.e while standing on a bosu ball whose going to throw you the medicine ball while you do the proverbial squat on an unstable surface. LOL. Yes in some ways these exercises will make you perform a tad better but anything we come up with as trainers working agonist, antagonist, and synergist muscles will make you perform slightly better. Welcome to the wonderful world of marketing. This phenom known as "FUNCTIONAL TRAINING" is a brand. We think of words like "CORE STABILITY" and "STRUCTURAL ASSESSMENTS" and that justifies our job as personal trainer. A little knowledge goes a long way and as I always teach "EVERY THING WORKS.... FOR A WHILE". A good mix of all training styles with a client IMO is a great way to keep retention high and inhibit staleness for you and your client. Trust me, if any of you ever had 4 bodybuilders in a row to train ( boring ****) youd conteplate suicide. Counting reps are very boring. Periodization is the way to go. Use a mulititude of training styles.

this is prolly my favorite response. i truely agree with this