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Hey guys, I'm currently around 180 and cutting. I am a firm believer in spiking insulin PWO, even while cutting. I heard chocolate milk is good for this, and I love the stuff. I have about two cups with macros around this:
50 grams carbs(mostly sugar)
20 grams protein
5 grams fat(I use 2%)
Will this suffice for a post workout recovery? I account for it in my calories/macros.
Also, I know milk protein is about 80% casein, but there are some faster acting proteins in there, is that a big deal?
the choc milk is fine, i would still add some whey though or other protein
PWO spike is not needed, but if you like it, I respect that. Chocolate Milk is fine IMO.
[QUOTE=d2bstud69;196609111]Hey guys, I'm currently around 180 and cutting. I am a firm believer in spiking insulin PWO, even while cutting. I heard chocolate milk is good for this, and I love the stuff. I have about two cups with macros around this:
50 grams carbs(mostly sugar)
20 grams protein
5 grams fat(I use 2%)
Will this suffice for a post workout recovery? I account for it in my calories/macros.
Also, I know milk protein is about 80% casein, but there are some faster acting proteins in there, is that a big deal?[/QUOTE]
Drink up. I commend you for not going for the WMS at first blush.
[QUOTE=d2bstud69;196609111] I am a firm believer in spiking insulin PWO.[/QUOTE]
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You really have no boundaries do you goon
[QUOTE=d2bstud69;196673021]You really have no boundaries do you goon[/QUOTE]
you do not need to spike insulin postwo. im tired of reading the same thing 5,000 times every day. By the way, if you prefer mik postwo, use whole.
Whole milk? I'm pretty sure its not bioscience that excess saturated fat is not heart healthy. I get some saturated fat from other sources like low fat cheese and chicken, but I try to keep it very low.
I know the studies that it keeps testosterone up and such, but it is still something that should be minimized.
[QUOTE=d2bstud69;196676721]Whole milk? I'm pretty sure its not bioscience that excess saturated fat is not heart healthy. I get some saturated fat from other sources like low fat cheese and chicken, but I try to keep it very low.
I know the studies that it keeps testosterone up and such, but it is still something that should be minimized.[/QUOTE]
some whole milk is not excess and will not hurt you.
[QUOTE=d2bstud69;196676721]Whole milk? I'm pretty sure its not bioscience that excess saturated fat is not heart healthy.[/QUOTE]
In excess, saturated fat is not heart healthy. In lesser amounts (such as the amount in one cup of whole milk) it is fine.
anyhoo, my reasoning for whole milk postwo ...
[url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16679981?dopt=abstractplus[/url]
[b]Milk ingestion stimulates net muscle protein synthesis following resistance exercise.[/b]
Elliot TA, Cree MG, Sanford AP, Wolfe RR, Tipton KD.
Metabolism Unit, Shriners Hospitals for Children and Department of Surgery, The University of Texas Medical Branch, Galveston, TX, USA.
PURPOSE: Previous studies have examined the response of muscle protein to resistance exercise and nutrient ingestion. Net muscle protein synthesis results from the combination of resistance exercise and amino acid intake. No study has examined the response of muscle protein to ingestion of protein in the context of a food. This study was designed to determine the response of net muscle protein balance following resistance exercise to ingestion of nutrients as components of milk. METHOD: Three groups of volunteers ingested one of three milk drinks each: 237 g of fat-free milk (FM), 237 g of whole milk (WM), and 393 g of fat-free milk isocaloric with the WM (IM). Milk was ingested 1 h following a leg resistance exercise routine. Net muscle protein balance was determined by measuring amino acid balance across the leg. RESULTS: Arterial concentrations of representative amino acids increased in response to milk ingestion. Threonine balance and phenylalanine balance were both > 0 following milk ingestion. Net amino acid uptake for threonine was 2.8-fold greater (P < 0.05) for WM than for FM. Mean uptake of phenylalanine was 80 and 85% greater for WM and IM, respectively, than for FM, but not statistically different. Threonine uptake relative to ingested was significantly (P < 0.05) higher for WM (21 +/- 6%) than FM (11 +/- 5%), but not IM (12 +/- 3%). Mean phenylalanine uptake/ingested also was greatest for WM, but not significantly. [b]CONCLUSIONS: Ingestion of milk following resistance exercise results in phenylalanine and threonine uptake, representative of net muscle protein synthesis. These results suggest that whole milk may have increased utilization of available amino acids for protein synthesis.[/b]
[url]http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=108518211&highlight=the+skinny+on+saturated+fat[/url]
[QUOTE=d2bstud69;196676721]Whole milk? I'm pretty sure its not bioscience that excess saturated fat is not heart healthy. I get some saturated fat from other sources like low fat cheese and chicken, but I try to keep it very low.
I know the studies that it keeps testosterone up and such, but it is still something that should be minimized.[/QUOTE]
1 cup of whole milk = 5g saturated fat. Holy ****, get the defibrillators.
wow I just got a bitch slap of science:) But you guys are just agreeing with me, saturated fat is good but only in moderation. As I am cutting right now, I am trying to keep all fat low(bout 20% calories) just because it has 9 kcals/gram. The fat I do get comes from almonds and peanut butter(and a little from the cheese/chicken).
I'm not saying that saturated fat is the devil, so stop giving me studies. I just feel healthier keeping it low.
Chocolate milk is a great pwo drink. Like they said, saturated fat should be taken in moderation. However, testosterone is created directly from monounsaturated and saturated fat, not polyunsaturated or even EFAs. The majority of all testosterone is created through saturated fat. The sat fat that isn't converted to testosterone deposits on the body or in the arteries. If 10% of your daily fat intake comes from saturated fat, you won't have a problem.
Before people begin telling me that I'm wrong, here's a portion of the study from the book, [I]God-given Foods Eating Plan[/I] (concerning foods and hormones):
[url]http://www.fitnessforoneandall.com/nutrition/article/hormones/part_two.htm[/url]
[QUOTE=TheWaffleIron;196678421]In excess, saturated fat is not heart healthy. In lesser amounts (such as the amount in one cup of whole milk) it is fine.
anyhoo, my reasoning for whole milk postwo ...
[url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16679981?dopt=abstractplus[/url]
[b]Milk ingestion stimulates net muscle protein synthesis following resistance exercise.[/b]
Elliot TA, Cree MG, Sanford AP, Wolfe RR, Tipton KD.
Metabolism Unit, Shriners Hospitals for Children and Department of Surgery, The University of Texas Medical Branch, Galveston, TX, USA.
PURPOSE: Previous studies have examined the response of muscle protein to resistance exercise and nutrient ingestion. Net muscle protein synthesis results from the combination of resistance exercise and amino acid intake. No study has examined the response of muscle protein to ingestion of protein in the context of a food. This study was designed to determine the response of net muscle protein balance following resistance exercise to ingestion of nutrients as components of milk. METHOD: Three groups of volunteers ingested one of three milk drinks each: 237 g of fat-free milk (FM), 237 g of whole milk (WM), and 393 g of fat-free milk isocaloric with the WM (IM). Milk was ingested 1 h following a leg resistance exercise routine. Net muscle protein balance was determined by measuring amino acid balance across the leg. RESULTS: Arterial concentrations of representative amino acids increased in response to milk ingestion. Threonine balance and phenylalanine balance were both > 0 following milk ingestion. Net amino acid uptake for threonine was 2.8-fold greater (P < 0.05) for WM than for FM. Mean uptake of phenylalanine was 80 and 85% greater for WM and IM, respectively, than for FM, but not statistically different. Threonine uptake relative to ingested was significantly (P < 0.05) higher for WM (21 +/- 6%) than FM (11 +/- 5%), but not IM (12 +/- 3%). Mean phenylalanine uptake/ingested also was greatest for WM, but not significantly. [b]CONCLUSIONS: Ingestion of milk following resistance exercise results in phenylalanine and threonine uptake, representative of net muscle protein synthesis. These results suggest that whole milk may have increased utilization of available amino acids for protein synthesis.[/b][/QUOTE]
The problem I have with this study is that it only addresses two amino acids. Are these two indicative of all other aminos or are these the only two that showed a significant difference?
[QUOTE=d2bstud69;196676721]Whole milk? I'm pretty sure its not bioscience that excess saturated fat is not heart healthy. I get some saturated fat from other sources like low fat cheese and chicken, but I try to keep it very low.
I know the studies that it keeps testosterone up and such, but it is still something that should be minimized.[/QUOTE]
don't forget that if your monounsaturated fat is higher than saturated, you'll maintain good cholesterol profiles. Plus if you eat enough fiber, are you really worried about a few grams of fat a day from whole milk?
I thought I read by Layne Norton that the sugars in milk digest slowly, slower then oat meal, so is it really a good way to spike insulin?
Until youve tried the PW spike and non for at least 8 weeks....quit friggn commenting.....I've done both and no question the energy,m the fullness, the recovery is 100x better when spkied, even with Waxy which is what I believ3e is the best by far
According to this site Chocolate Milk is fairly low GI, wouldn't that mean no insulin spike?
[url]http://www.carbs-information.com/glycemic-index/chocolate-milk-gi-value.htm[/url]
[QUOTE=FoodNut;196941391]According to this site Chocolate Milk is fairly low GI, wouldn't that mean no insulin spike?
[url]http://www.carbs-information.com/glycemic-index/chocolate-milk-gi-value.htm[/url][/QUOTE]
no, the BCAAs in milk are insulinogenic.
[QUOTE=FF8114;196893111]The problem I have with this study is that it only addresses two amino acids. Are these two indicative of all other aminos or are these the only two that showed a significant difference?[/QUOTE]
Phenylalanine & Threonine uptake were measured because those particular AA's are not oxidized in muscle, and their uptake can occur only as a result of their use for protein synthesis.
[QUOTE=rhizome;196957641]Phenylalanine & Threonine uptake were measured because those particular AA's are not oxidized in muscle, and their uptake can occur only as a result of their use for protein synthesis.[/QUOTE]
Thank you.
I read the study that was posted in this thread, but it seems they only tested Whole milk and Fat-free milk. What about 1% fat chocolate milk? Does it make a difference?
damn it. im at "work" right now and all i can think about is chocolate milk. grrrr
[QUOTE=TexasNick;198734341]I read the study that was posted in this thread, but it seems they only tested Whole milk and Fat-free milk. What about 1% fat chocolate milk? Does it make a difference?[/QUOTE]
My guess given the information is that yes it does make a difference.