Do naturals lose way more muscle dieting?

I keep seeing alot of you guys super lean far out from a show. I know you guys are doin 12, 14, 16 and even 20 week diets! I dieted 7 weeks last show from 230 to 201 and I didnt notice any loss in muscle at all (not natty). I know I wasnt completely peeled, but not terrible by any means. With 2-3 weeks extra I could have been peeled.

So my question is, do you guys diet so slowly because you would lose muscle to quick? Have any of you noticed a mad drop in LBM from dieting to quick?

It messes with my head seeing some of you guys so damn lean at like 10 weeks out!

Heres a pic of me 1 day out, think two or three weeks would have been enough?



So I had a 29 lb loss in 7 weeks. Pretty much avg of over 3 lbs a week lost.

I know one guy on here said he last 2 lbs from 6 weeks out to 1 week out... Austrian Oak said hes aiming for 5 lbs over 10 weeks. Is it really that dangerous for naturals to diet quick?

In the know this as well. More importantly, I'm interested in [U]why[/U] natties lose more muscle. Is it due to a decrease in test due to elongated underfeeding, not being able to lift as heavy when depleted, etc.

its because most are small to begin with or higher bodyfat than they thought, they think they had more muscle than they really did

[QUOTE=DomzyCuttin;854601093]I keep seeing alot of you guys super lean far out from a show. I know you guys are doin 12, 14, 16 and even 20 week diets! I dieted 7 weeks last show from 230 to 201 and I didnt notice any loss in muscle at all (not natty). I know I wasnt completely peeled, but not terrible by any means. With 2-3 weeks extra I could have been peeled.

So my question is, do you guys diet so slowly because you would lose muscle to quick? Have any of you noticed a mad drop in LBM from dieting to quick?

It messes with my head seeing some of you guys so damn lean at like 10 weeks out!

Heres a pic of me 1 day out, think two or three weeks would have been enough?



So I had a 29 lb loss in 7 weeks. Pretty much avg of over 3 lbs a week lost.

I know one guy on here said he last 2 lbs from 6 weeks out to 1 week out... Austrian Oak said hes aiming for 5 lbs over 10 weeks. Is it really that dangerous for naturals to diet quick?[/QUOTE]


I think much of the dieting process is just different for natty vs not natty. In my view any non natty can get in show shape in 12 weeks. Whether you have 10 pounds to lose or 100 pounds to lose. It should never take you more than 12 weeks. It's ok to take more but anyone can get in shape in 12 weeks. Most natty's would not agree from my experience with that statement as you can see many diet 12-26 weeks for a show. I think it is a smart move to take it slow and steady to try to hold on to muscle which is why many of them look leaner at 12 weeks out than we do.

I make a 180 degree transformation from weeks 4 to the show...most natties on here look 100% stage ready at 4 weeks out and just seem to discuss tightening up. To most non natties that's when things get really serious lol.

[QUOTE=FunkymonkAW;854625753]In the know this as well. More importantly, I'm interested in [U]why[/U] natties lose more muscle. Is it due to a decrease in test due to elongated underfeeding, not being able to lift as heavy when depleted, etc.[/QUOTE]


On a calorie deficit pushing your body regardless of test levels makes it tough to keep muscle. PLENTY of guys taking 1gram+ of ped's a week lose muscle dieting. Actually most users will lose some degree of muscle which further explains why somone with no assistance would tend to lose some muscle.

Yes, naturals have the potential to lose more muscle because we cannot combat the catabolic hormonal environment with drugs. An enhanced bodybuilder can create a large deficit and mitigate (or almost, eliminate) muscle loss because they can create a synthetic hormonal environment. Hormones are what shifts our bodies into and out of fat burning and muscle building "modes". With a natural, when calories are high and muscle repair or growth is required, the signaling devices are there to create muscle tissue. When we eat in a caloric deficit, and particularly when we become very lean, these signaling devices slow metabolic rate and rate of muscle repair. So when we burn muscle tissue doing catabolic workouts, its not as readily replaced. I have found the most success when my deficit is very small and I diet for long periods of time. This prep is prime example. Ive been dieting since jan 2 and I have lost 7 lbs. I am fuller, harder, and heavier than I have ever been at this body fat level. Ive got 10 more weeks and probably another 5-6 lbs of fat to move.

Great answers! Ill have to reps you guys when I can. Thanks flex, that puts me at ease. I get a little paranoid when I see these guys so lean so far out. Your a national NPC competitor right? I remember you from years back, always knew your ****, you were on the celltech forum alot right?

[QUOTE=DomzyCuttin;854811513]Great answers! Ill have to reps you guys when I can. Thanks flex, that puts me at ease. I get a little paranoid when I see these guys so lean so far out. Your a national NPC competitor right? I remember you from years back, always knew your ****, you were on the celltech forum alot right?[/QUOTE]


yup I used to go around there quite a bit back in the day. Haven't competed much in a while. In the gym and hitting it hard but not much competing...I lost the love of dieting for a few years...well not so much dieting as competing. Doing a show in may though.

You'll be fine I saw you have 8-10 weeks. Your pic is hard to tell with the lighting but you can make it...just push the peddle to the floor baby!

[QUOTE=DomzyCuttin;854811513]Great answers! Ill have to reps you guys when I can. Thanks flex, that puts me at ease. I get a little paranoid when I see these guys so lean so far out. Your a national NPC competitor right? I remember you from years back, always knew your ****, you were on the celltech forum alot right?[/QUOTE]

also just from my observation it's a common goal for natty competitors to be ready for show a couple weeks ahead, that way they can start raising calories before the show and kind of coast in feeling much better / less depleted.

[QUOTE=DomzyCuttin;854601093]I know one guy on here said he last 2 lbs from 6 weeks out to 1 week out...[/QUOTE]

Guessing you were referring to me! I was curious and looked back at my weight at 11 weeks out and I was 132lbs, sitting at 128lbs now, so only 4 lbs in 10 weeks! Doesn't seem like a lot, but pics are night and day difference lol. This is my first contest prep, so I really can't compare it to anything. I have set PR's along the way also, I refused to lose strength. :)

I feel that whether natural or not longer dieting is the way to do it! Do it smart and take your time, and In fact I think you will hold onto muscle or even gain muscle in certain areas.
The way I like to do it and have seen people do it is(younger aged I mean 25 and under due to relatively fast metabolism)
24 weeks out from a projected show start to really clean it up get down to a cheat meal or 2 a week, start introducing some cardio.
20 weeks out bring it down to one cheat meal, start measuring foods if not already!
18 weeks out I cut cheat meals, And cardio is much more planned out and serious.
17-13 - IM EATING A TON and doing a good deal of cardio during this phase my workouts are always the best
13-7-start playing with variables- seeing some nice steady changes!
7-2-IT gets real most changes, most intensity in the gym usually good amount of cardio.

But in the early stages at least up till 6 weeks out if you do things right I don't see any muscle loss, just fat, most people DOn't get shredded enough for shows, and think they are leaner then they really are in their offseason!

hope that answered your questions a little bit

[QUOTE=pshickey;854933433]Guessing you were referring to me! I was curious and looked back at my weight at 11 weeks out and I was 132lbs, sitting at 128lbs now, so only 4 lbs in 10 weeks! Doesn't seem like a lot, but pics are night and day difference lol. This is my first contest prep, so I really can't compare it to anything. I have set PR's along the way also, I refused to lose strength. :)[/QUOTE]

Yes I was actually. Wow 4 lbs! When dieting that slow, how do you know your even in a defecit?! It must be a fine line between defecit and maintnance.

Another thought I have is that juicers can def make significant lbm gains in just a couple short months. Even in weeks. So we can optimize our bulks knowing that we can lose the fat fast without losing musch lbm. As for a natural, whats the point of bulking two months extra to gain 2 lbs of muscle, if dieting that extra two months may help preserve 3.

[QUOTE=Flex500;854740453]I think much of the dieting process is just different for natty vs not natty. In my view any non natty can get in show shape in 12 weeks. Whether you have 10 pounds to lose or 100 pounds to lose. It should never take you more than 12 weeks. It's ok to take more but anyone can get in shape in 12 weeks. Most natty's would not agree from my experience with that statement as you can see many diet 12-26 weeks for a show. I think it is a smart move to take it slow and steady to try to hold on to muscle which is why many of them look leaner at 12 weeks out than we do.

^ Yep I'm natty and remain pretty lean all year round. Started dieting early January for a show at the end of April...Now 5 weeks out and I think I'll be stage ready a little in advance. With what my plan is.

[QUOTE=NoXplode15;855032723][QUOTE=Flex500;854740453]I think much of the dieting process is just different for natty vs not natty. In my view any non natty can get in show shape in 12 weeks. Whether you have 10 pounds to lose or 100 pounds to lose. It should never take you more than 12 weeks. It's ok to take more but anyone can get in shape in 12 weeks. Most natty's would not agree from my experience with that statement as you can see many diet 12-26 weeks for a show. I think it is a smart move to take it slow and steady to try to hold on to muscle which is why many of them look leaner at 12 weeks out than we do.

^ Yep I'm natty and remain pretty lean all year round. Started dieting early January for a show at the end of April...Now 5 weeks out and I think I'll be stage ready a little in advance. With what my plan is.[/QUOTE]


well good luck man you look awesome