Estimate my body fat, how much lower for abs to show?

Can you pls estimate my body fat?

I'm 4ft 11 and 88 lbs... I have an apple shaped body and carry all my fat in my stomach and lower back/love handles. Most people estimate my body fat to be lower because I have skinny arms and have a petite build; however, all my fat is in my abs/lower back and some on my upper thigh. I do have quite some body fat as my abs aren't showing yet. I did one of those online body fat tests and it came up to 24.47% Does that sound about right?

I do HIIT as well as lift and I do work my abs and core/lower back hard... plus take lots of protein. However my abs are still hidden under fat...

Does my body fat look around 24 % or does it look lower? How low do you think it will have to go before you see abs?

im going to say right around 22-24%. Not to go with estimating female body fat though. Looking good btw ;)

How much lower for them to show? Never

You have to have muscle for muscle to show through. If you are seriously only 88 pounds it is likely you'll have nothing underneath the fat. You would need to bulk up and gain some muscle first then cut the fat to reveal the underlying muscle.

[QUOTE=megdaig;934243083]How much lower for them to show? Never

You have to have muscle for muscle to show through. If you are seriously only 88 pounds it is likely you'll have nothing underneath the fat. You would need to bulk up and gain some muscle first then cut the fat to reveal the underlying muscle.[/QUOTE]

I actually lift heavy and have a high protein intake... I'm 88 lbs cause I have extremely tiny bones (I'm Asian)... However, believe it or not; I do have a lot of muscle... you can see my arm muscles in the last pic when I'm flexing... I lift 3-4 a week and lift as heavy as I can as well as drink tons of protein and I have a very high protein intake...

My thighs are hard, calves are defined when I wear heels. I can also see my biceps plus I also work hard on my shoulders... I think my chest is also defined cause I do lots of fly's, chest presses, push ups... I actually do have muscle. I have been lifting for almost 8 months now.

I also work my core with weights; I do things like weighted jack knifes, crunches with a 10 lb weigh, standing abs with a 8lb ball, also lots of compound movements like deadlifts and squats which work my core...

I know 88 lbs sounds like I have no muscle but believe it or not I do...

[QUOTE=megdaig;934243083]How much lower for them to show? Never

You have to have muscle for muscle to show through. If you are seriously only 88 pounds it is likely you'll have nothing underneath the fat. You would need to bulk up and gain some muscle first then cut the fat to reveal the underlying muscle.[/QUOTE]

This^^

Even with a petite frame, you're underweight and undermuscled for your height. It comes down to having a low body fat, combined with enough overall muscle to support the look.

You want abs, you need to focus on building not cutting...you're going backwards.

[QUOTE=kimm4;934250193]This^^

Even with a petite frame, you're underweight and undermuscled for your height. It comes down to having a low body fat, combined with enough overall muscle to support the look.

You want abs, you need to focus on building not cutting...you're going backwards.[/QUOTE]

I lift 3-4 times a week... I go to a bootcamp where it's always 30 min of cardio and lifting.

I'm not underweight; I actually have a lot of fat on my belly and I do have muscles... Keep in mind that I'm 4ft11 and very small boned.

I have been lifting for 7-8 months already and work my entire body with weights; biceps, tricpeps, back, legs, ass etc

I have muscles when I flex my arms and my chest and shoulder muscles are also rather hard... my thighs are extremely hard too (lots of uphill running at incline 8-10 etc).... so I do have muscles despite not weighing much...

I think most people simply assume I am underweight because the average person is so big... I'm Asian and my bones are really small but it's a lot of muscle... I don't go by the regular BMI chart to measure if I'm underweight or not since I am built differently.

You can see biceps/shoulders here

Also, a few years ago when I was eating nothing but junk food and my stomach got SO FAT that I could not even zip up my size 24 jeans I was 85 lbs.... I was eating junk food for years and that's as heavy as I got... I could not zip up my jeans anymore but I never weighed more than 85 lbs... I actually gained 3 lbs of muscle since I started working out....

I have one of those weird bodies where it is extremely difficult for me to gain weight.... However, I really did have a pot belly (even an ex joked that I looked pregnant) and I lost most of my belly since I started working out. I just want abs now and even though it may not look like it; I lift a lot and I drink Optimum Nutrition Gold Standard whey isolate in addition to really eating lots of lean chicken and fish etc... I eat a lot...

My body is just made small; I can't help it.

Also, I have to disagree that my body doesn't have enough muscle in order to support abs.. When I do standing abs with weights and go side to side (reach towards the side of my knees with my weight) I can literally see my obliques flex in the mirror; I can see the line....it's on the side... I can see it on both sides (when I work the other side)... I just can't see it when I'm standing normal...

The thing is, you can lift heavy til the cows come home but if you're not eating enough, your muscles aren't going to grow. During the 8 months you've been lifting have you been eating at a deficit?

I think you might be insulted by the responses of the other girls but it is not meant to be an insult, just a matter of observation. You asked the question, you got the answer. Your ethnicity/frame doesn't change the physiology/science. I understand you're trying to convince us that you are unique but you have low muscle mass and low weight, it just isn't going to reflect abs, sorry.

All of these girls are under 5'0 on a good day. Do they have it easier or equal to some good-fer-verk Scandanavian girl? Doubtful. But they put in the years of hard work and nutrition to beat the odds. You're not there yet, you can be, but you can't fall back on your ethnicity and size as an excuse.

Sonia Gonzales (Filipino)
[img]http://www.hardbody.com/news/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/muscle-and-fitness-hers.jpg[/img]

Tricia Dong (Chinese)
[img]http://www.dragondoor.com/assets/1/40/InstructorMainDimension/1709_10074187.jpg[/img]

Karen Pang (Chinese)
[img]http://gymidiots.files.wordpress.com/2010/09/karen-pang.jpg?w=490[/img]

OP, we don't want you making the same mistakes a lot of other girls make and that is spinning their wheels eating in an INSANE deficit years-on-end and completely wrecking their metabolisms trying to obtain this look that their bodies are not developed for, YET. Give yourself a good year at eating at a surplus and continue doing what you are doing except for maybe dropping the cardio, then come back and cut fat to show all the new muscle that you've gained.

[QUOTE=jstar007;934246503]I actually lift heavy and have a high protein intake... I'm 88 lbs cause I have extremely tiny bones (I'm Asian)... However, believe it or not; I do have a lot of muscle... you can see my arm muscles in the last pic when I'm flexing... I lift 3-4 a week and lift as heavy as I can as well as drink tons of protein and I have a very high protein intake...

My thighs are hard, calves are defined when I wear heels. I can also see my biceps plus I also work hard on my shoulders... I think my chest is also defined cause I do lots of fly's, chest presses, push ups... I actually do have muscle. I have been lifting for almost 8 months now.

I also work my core with weights; I do things like weighted jack knifes, crunches with a 10 lb weigh, standing abs with a 8lb ball, also lots of compound movements like deadlifts and squats which work my core...

I know 88 lbs sounds like I have no muscle but believe it or not I do...[/QUOTE]Lifting heavy is important, and so is protein intake, but if you are not eating in a surplus, your muscles will not grow. How much weight did you gain while you were lifting all those months?

And when you say you lift heavy - like what does that mean to you? And are you doing the compound lifts, like squat, deadlift, overhead press, bench press, etc? Can you do chin/pull ups?

What is your calorie intake? How much fat are you eating? How much over maintenance have you been eating?

[QUOTE=oregonchick76;934390023]Lifting heavy is important, and so is protein intake, but if you are not eating in a surplus, your muscles will not grow. How much weight did you gain while you were lifting all those months?

And when you say you lift heavy - like what does that mean to you? And are you doing the compound lifts, like squat, deadlift, overhead press, bench press, etc? Can you do chin/pull ups?

What is your calorie intake? How much fat are you eating? How much over maintenance have you been eating?[/QUOTE]

Keep in mind that I'm using dumb bells. Heavy to me is being able to do 10-12 reps max before I'm physically unable to do anymore.... I do squats with 15 lbs dumbells (so 30 lbs total) and that is all I can do.... bicep curls I use 12 lbs and can't even finish a set with my left arm; I have to use my right arm towards the end to move my arms.... can do it on using my left arm though. Yes I do overhead press and bench press but with free weights (one pair around 12 -15 lb for bench press) and one pair of 12lb (24 lb total) for overhead. I have also increasing my weights gradually so I can get stronger and that is my max at the moment.

I probably could do pull ups but I haven't. I don't keep track of calories/fat grams/macros to be honest but I eat lots of fat (olive oil and avocados)...

Do you have access to a gym?

i'd say get down to seven percent and that should be good enough. right now your probably at ten or eleven percent. sexystomach /10

[QUOTE=Ajthemeso;934425123]i'd say get down to seven percent and that should be good enough. right now your probably at ten or eleven percent. sexystomach /10[/QUOTE]

Female body fat levels are completely different than male. 7% body fat is below female essential body fat, let alone the difficult athletic range.

[QUOTE=sonti;934431633]Female body fat levels are completely different than male. 7% body fat is below female essential body fat, let alone the difficult athletic range.[/QUOTE] yeah i thought i heard that it's hard for women to get down to ripped up abs and obliques but i didn't wanna get OP's jimmies rustled. do you know why?

[QUOTE=sonti;934423693]Do you have access to a gym?[/QUOTE]

Sure I do. I live right across from Crunch Gym...

I have been going to Barry's Bootcamp here in L.A. It's the same place Kim Kardashian and many celebs go.... maybe I have been doing too much cardio there... (its 30 min of sprints, running and crazy hills) in addition to 30 min of weights....

maybe i should just lift heavy instead at the gym and bulk...

[QUOTE=Ajthemeso;934425123]i'd say get down to seven percent and that should be good enough. right now your probably at ten or eleven percent. sexystomach /10[/QUOTE]

I did a body fat test using one of the online calculators and my body fat is more like 24%... not even close to 7 percent... People totally overestimate how low my body fat is percent I'm petite and have small arms...

Do you think I need to do a bulk first before cutting for more defined abs?

[QUOTE=jstar007;934436413]I did a body fat test using one of the online calculators and my body fat is more like 24%... not even close to 7 percent... People totally overestimate how low my body fat is percent I'm petite and have small arms...

Do you think I need to do a bulk first before cutting for more defined abs?[/QUOTE]

Ding ding ding...we have a winner.

This is exactly what we've been trying to tell you. Bulk for a good year (at minimum) then cut. Focus on a strength program first to build your base then look toward a hypertrophy program for the remainder of your bulk.

[QUOTE=jstar007;934436413]I did a body fat test using one of the online calculators and my body fat is more like 24%... not even close to 7 percent... People totally overestimate how low my body fat is percent I'm petite and have small arms...

Do you think I need to do a bulk first before cutting for more defined abs?[/QUOTE] well i meant your probably about 11 or 12 percent and 7 should be good enough for your lower abs to show. women can only build so much muscle because of your testosterone levels (more testosterone= more muscle) but you could lean bulk for halve a year if your afraid of getting fat. just use this websites calorie calculator to see how many calories you use a day and just up that by 200 to 250. for instance if you use 3000 calories a day up that to 3200. and a little tip for ab building: don't do weighted exercises just do body weight exercises because when you do weighted it makes your abs look bulky and make your stomach stand out more. i made that mistake and i increased my pant size from 32 to 34. good luck

Guys truly stink at estimating women's body fat levels. She's no where near 11 or 12%...shed be ripped already...

This....is 11% on a woman...

[IMG]http://i128.photobucket.com/albums/p181/truckdriver07/Progress/1b50acf1.jpg[/IMG]

If she had more muscle she should see abs at around 15 to 16%, but that all depends on how much is underneath the layer of fat and skin.

[QUOTE=Ajthemeso;934425123]i'd say get down to seven percent and that should be good enough. right now your probably at ten or eleven percent. sexystomach /10[/QUOTE]

Don't be ridiculous! 7% is what Figure Pros get on stage at.

OP you say you have been lifting for 8 months now, but if all you can squat is 30lbs, you are doing it wrong. That' VERY WEAK, meaning you don't have anywhere near as much muscle as you think. As others have said, you need to eat more and build that muscle.

As for abs showing, we are all different in where we store the most fat. I store it preferentially in my butt and thighs so I don't need to get to very low body fat to see my abs. Asians from what I see tend to be apple shaped, so you'll probably have to work hard to see your abs.

[QUOTE=jstar007;934413743]Keep in mind that I'm using dumb bells. Heavy to me is being able to do 10-12 reps max before I'm physically unable to do anymore.... I do squats with 15 lbs dumbells (so 30 lbs total) and that is all I can do.... bicep curls I use 12 lbs and can't even finish a set with my left arm; I have to use my right arm towards the end to move my arms.... can do it on using my left arm though. Yes I do overhead press and bench press but with free weights (one pair around 12 -15 lb for bench press) and one pair of 12lb (24 lb total) for overhead. I have also increasing my weights gradually so I can get stronger and that is my max at the moment.

I probably could do pull ups but I haven't. I don't keep track of calories/fat grams/macros to be honest but I eat lots of fat (olive oil and avocados)...[/QUOTE]Ok, well, you don't lift heavy. Heavy is squatting at least your bodyweight, benching with at least 1/2 your bodyweight, etc. You didn't develop any muscle flinging around 12 lb dumbbells. Sorry, muscle takes more stimulation than that to grow.

This is the body/abs I want to achieve... More of the Victoria's Secret type abs... and like Nicole Scherzinger... not a six pack... Will I need to bulk still in order to get my abs looking like that?

[QUOTE=jstar007;934629373]This is the body/abs I want to achieve... More of the Victoria's Secret type abs... and like Nicole Scherzinger... not a six pack... Will I need to bulk still in order to get my abs looking like that?[/QUOTE]

Why are you on a body building forum?

[QUOTE=sy2502;934644673]Why are you on a body building forum?[/QUOTE]

Well; it's still building muscles/ abs... and their abs are showing. It's not the more extreme body building but still putting on muscle mass. I know the VS models lift and such. Bodybuilding isn't exclusive to those who bulk or cut... Building muscles is still a form of "light" body building. Do you disagree?

[QUOTE=jstar007;934652403]Well; it's still building muscles/ abs... and their abs are showing. It's not the more extreme body building but still putting on muscle mass. I know the VS models lift and such. Bodybuilding isn't exclusive to those who bulk or cut... Building muscles is still a form of "light" body building. Do you disagree?[/QUOTE]
First of all, no, VS models don't have muscle. Second no, they don't lift weights, they do yoga, cardio and circuit training. Third, just touching a dumbbell doesn't automatically make you a body builder. But that's my personal opinion and I am sure others will differ with me.

[QUOTE=jstar007;934629373]This is the body/abs I want to achieve... More of the Victoria's Secret type abs... and like Nicole Scherzinger... not a six pack... Will I need to bulk still in order to get my abs looking like that?[/QUOTE]


I don't see any abs in those pics??

[QUOTE=Kiwi10;934669543]I don't see any abs in those pics??[/QUOTE]

So it's not just me? :)

You are not 'lifting heavy'. You are squating 30lbs. Yes I know we all start somewhere and many people may start at that weigh, but 8 months later and that is what you are squatting? That will not be building muscle of any description.
Maybe post a vid of this heavy lifting, so then we can see if there is something in your form which is really holding you back.