Coffee vs. Caffeine Pills

For awhile I've been drinking about 20 oz. of brewed coffee with my breakfast or before a workout for an energy boost. But recently I turned to caffeine pills instead. (Haven't used them in over four years.) I must say, the jolt from a caffeine pill is night and day compared to brewed coffee. Theoretically, 20 oz of brewed coffee should contain more than 200 mg of caffeine, yet 200 mg in the pill form blows it away. Not to mention it spares me several inconvenient trips to the restroom.

So does anyone have a theory behind this? Here are a few theories I present:
1) When caffeine is ingested as a pill (vs. a beverage), you don't have all the liquid to dilute its absorption/concentration in the bloodstream.
2) Coffee contains other xanthine derivatives besides caffeine, so perhaps there's a bit of competition between the various xanthines.
3) Pharmaceutical grade caffeine has more integrity than mother nature's caffeine.

[QUOTE=Chuck61686;190606951]For awhile I've been drinking about 20 oz. of brewed coffee with my breakfast or before a workout for an energy boost. But recently I turned to caffeine pills instead. (Haven't used them in over four years.) I must say, the jolt from a caffeine pill is night and day compared to brewed coffee. Theoretically, 20 oz of brewed coffee should contain more than 200 mg of caffeine, yet 200 mg in the pill form blows it away. Not to mention it spares me several inconvenient trips to the restroom.

So does anyone have a theory behind this? Here are a few theories I present:
1) When caffeine is ingested as a pill (vs. a beverage), you don't have all the liquid to dilute its absorption/concentration in the bloodstream.
2) Coffee contains other xanthine derivatives besides caffeine, so perhaps there's a bit of competition between the various xanthines.
3) Pharmaceutical grade caffeine has more integrity than mother nature's caffeine.[/QUOTE]
[url=http://jap.physiology.org/cgi/content/full/85/3/883]Metabolic and exercise endurance effects of coffee and caffeine ingestion[/url]

Feel free to continue your research from here :)

caffeine pills don't stain your teeth. WOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

There's also a bajillion other chemicals in coffee they haven't figured out yet. It's really hard to pin it on one thing that causes a lack of uptake for caffeine.

I skimmed over the article and didn't find anything that jumped out at me about why pills were better than coffee, but there was one paragraph:

Additional compounds in coffee that could have metabolic importance are present in small concentrations, including nicotinic acid, opiate-receptor antagonists, and cholinomimetics (1, 22). Tse (26) isolated a cholinergic compound from both regular and decaffeinated coffees, purified it, and demonstrated that injecting it into rats resulted in decreases in heart rate and blood pressure. This illustrates that the effects of coffee should not automatically be attributed to caffeine.

So while 20 oz of coffee should have 200mg caffeine, it doesn't seem to come out to that number in the end. A pill on the other hand will give you a no-bull@#$% amount of caffeine (unless of course you get your caffeine pills from a shady dealer).

I'd also seriously doubt that boiling water would degrade caffeine or something to that effect. If it were a protein, maybe.

I think we are overlooking the most obvious question here.

OP-How much coffee grounds do you use?

Personally I have the darkest Folger's available, my coffee maker does not have a pot, but rather travel mugs (16 oz i believe), and still fill the grounds all the way to the top. Trust me, I take pills as well, but nothing beats that cup o' joe for getting me going.

[QUOTE=put5onyo;190663231]I think we are overlooking the most obvious question here.

OP-How much coffee grounds do you use?

Personally I have the darkest Folger's available, my coffee maker does not have a pot, but rather travel mugs (16 oz i believe), and still fill the grounds all the way to the top. Trust me, I take pills as well, but nothing beats that cup o' joe for getting me going.[/QUOTE]

I think the study standardized the amount of caffeine per cup per person, so it should have delivered X amount of caffeine but it didn't.

Again, as the article stated, there are many, many chemicals, and one I quoted was an opiate receptor agonist. So yeah, a cup o' joe may get you goin, but you really don't know how much caffeine you're getting.

I do agree with you, in that if you want better results solely from your coffee, then use a darker roast and use more of it.

Im having trouble understanding what you are saying. A cup of coffee for me will have me jolted and shaking for hours compared to caffeine pills which usually dont do anything for me. You really want a caffeine boost, try ready 4 war.

I've heard teh caffeine in coffee is better than supplemental form, I forget why.

[QUOTE=put5onyo;190663231]I think we are overlooking the most obvious question here.

OP-How much coffee grounds do you use?

Personally I have the darkest Folger's available, my coffee maker does not have a pot, but rather travel mugs (16 oz i believe), and still fill the grounds all the way to the top. Trust me, I take pills as well, but nothing beats that cup o' joe for getting me going.[/QUOTE]

The darker the coffee the less caffeine it contains, being roasted longer they lose more caffeine in the process.

I would stick to the more natural form of caffeine and use coffee instead. Not the best idea to go to pills. If you want more caffeine, just use more coffee grounds per cup of water. And enjoy it, put in some Splenda packets and a little Half and Half. It's good stuff

[QUOTE=Mnx4;190700521]I think the study standardized the amount of caffeine per cup per person, so it should have delivered X amount of caffeine but it didn't.

Again, as the article stated, there are many, many chemicals, and one I quoted was an opiate receptor agonist. So yeah, a cup o' joe may get you goin, but you really don't know how much caffeine you're getting.

I do agree with you, in that if you want better results solely from your coffee, then use a darker roast and use more of it.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Xeric;190703811]The darker the coffee the less caffeine it contains, being roasted longer they lose more caffeine in the process.[/QUOTE]


You guys are really over thinking this. More coffee grounds=more caffeine. Period.

If the OP is making his coffee weak and only getting 75 mg/cup, of course a 200mg pill is gonna get him going more. I don't care about the study, or if light roast or dark roast has more caffeine.

[QUOTE=pats55583;190704161]I would stick to the more natural form of caffeine and use coffee instead. Not the best idea to go to pills. If you want more caffeine, just use more coffee grounds per cup of water. And enjoy it, put in some Splenda packets and a little Half and Half. It's good stuff[/QUOTE]

Thank you. Someone else who understands.

Wait!!! I got this study on PubMed. No one cares. Want more Caffeine? Use more grounds.

/thread

[QUOTE=put5onyo;190710361]You guys are really over thinking this. More coffee grounds=more caffeine. Period.

If the OP is making his coffee weak and only getting 75 mg/cup, of course a 200mg pill is gonna get him going more. I don't care about the study, or if light roast or dark roast has more caffeine.[/QUOTE]

lol, you were the one who made it a point to say that you use "the darkest folgers available" when we were talking about caffeine amounts as if you were getting so much caffeine. If you like brewing your coffee with too much grounds because your coffee has a low caffeine content go right ahead. I also believe the longer the beans are roasted the less "good chemicals" they contain. Just sayin...

[QUOTE=Xeric;190712561]lol, you were the one who made it a point to say that you use "the darkest folgers available" when we were talking about caffeine amounts as if you were getting so much caffeine. If you like brewing your coffee with too much grounds because your coffee has a low caffeine content go right ahead. I also believe the longer the beans are roasted the less "good chemicals" they contain. Just sayin...[/QUOTE]

Just saying if OP wants more caffeine from coffee, use more grounds. Not sure why that is too difficult to understand.

[QUOTE=put5onyo;190716771]Just saying if OP wants more caffeine from coffee, use more grounds. Not sure why that is too difficult to understand.[/QUOTE]
I take it you didn't read what the OP wanted - a reason for the difference - "So does anyone have a theory behind this"

[QUOTE=put5onyo;190716771]Just saying if OP wants more caffeine from coffee, use more grounds. Not sure why that is too difficult to understand.[/QUOTE]

No, what dont you understand about what im telling you? The OP should use a lighter roast of coffee if he wants more caffeine. Do you not realize that you could be saving yourself money by using less grounds and changing to a lighter coffee? Then upping the grounds if need be, but regardless you would be using less/ saving money.

lighter roast beans = more caffeine = less grounds used = coffee isnt bitter as **** from using way too much grounds = saves you money.

[QUOTE=Xeric;190725161]No, what dont you understand about what im telling you? The OP should use a lighter roast of coffee if he wants more caffeine. Do you not realize that you could be saving yourself money by using less grounds and changing to a lighter coffee? Then upping the grounds if need be, but regardless you would be using less/ saving money.

lighter roast beans = more caffeine = less grounds used = coffee isnt bitter as **** from using way too much grounds = saves you money.[/QUOTE]
this is a true statement...after having a conversation with someone at Starbucks, she informed me that although a "Bold" coffee may be a stronger TASTING coffee, the lighter versions contain more caffeine.

[QUOTE=Xeric;190725161]

lighter roast beans = more caffeine = less grounds used = coffee isnt bitter as **** from using way too much grounds = saves you money.[/QUOTE]

Here ya go-

[url]http://www.coffeefaq.com/site/node/15[/url]

"If you measure your coffee using a scoop you will have less caffeine per cup using dark roast coffee.
If you measure your coffee by weight you will have more caffeine per cup using a dark roast.
The difference one way or the other is small."

"This is mostly an academic discussion because the differences in caffeine content are relatively small."


And here-

[url]http://www.coffee-makers-cafe.com/coffee-beverage.html[/url]



"If you have ever experienced bitter, unpleasant coffee, it was probably over-extracted...The most common reasons for over-extraction include using too little coffee..."



Next?

[QUOTE=buckeye7;190727371]this is a true statement...after having a conversation with someone at Starbucks, she informed me that although a "Bold" coffee may be a stronger TASTING coffee, the lighter versions contain more caffeine.[/QUOTE]

Depends on how they measure it out. If they use say two teaspoons of light or two teaspoons of dark, the light will have more caffeine. If they use 2 oz of light or 2 oz of dark, the dark will have more caffeine.

Like the link above says, the difference between the two is trivial and is probably only noticeable when tested.

[QUOTE=rhizome;190722511]I take it you didn't read what the OP wanted - a reason for the difference - "So does anyone have a theory behind this"[/QUOTE]

OK

My theory is he is making a weak cup of coffee.

[QUOTE=put5onyo;190734851]Here ya go-

[url]http://www.coffeefaq.com/site/node/15[/url]

"If you measure your coffee using a scoop you will have less caffeine per cup using dark roast coffee.
If you measure your coffee by weight you will have more caffeine per cup using a dark roast.
The difference one way or the other is small."

"This is mostly an academic discussion because the differences in caffeine content are relatively small."


And here-

[url]http://www.coffee-makers-cafe.com/coffee-beverage.html[/url]



"If you have ever experienced bitter, unpleasant coffee, it was probably over-extracted...The most common reasons for over-extraction include using too little coffee..."



Next?[/QUOTE]

Ok....how many people do you know that measure out their coffee on a scale? no one? good guess. That second link you posted is saying that MAY be a cause, not that it is. Why did you not list everything else it said about over extraction? lol, whatever, Ive made my point clear enough for everyone else to understand

Ive been in the coffee business for a few years now, not pulling my knowledge off random google searches such as yourself.

[QUOTE=Xeric;190740381]Ok....how many people do you know that measure out their coffee on a scale? no one? good guess. That second link you posted is saying that MAY be a cause, not that it is. Why did you not list everything else it said about over extraction? lol, whatever, Ive made my point clear enough for everyone else to understand

Ive been in the coffee business for a few years now, not pulling my knowledge off random google searches such as yourself.[/QUOTE]

So if you buy two pounds of light roast or two pounds of dark roast, which one is gonna have more total caffeine? The answer is dark roast, so if the cost is the same dark roast is a better buy if you are looking for total caffeine.

Not enough grounds is the reason for bitter coffee. My link shows it and I have also heard it discussed by Alton Brown on the Food Network.

I didn't need google, these things I already knew. My line of work requires the use of evidence though, so I am used to using it.

[QUOTE=put5onyo;190743761]So if you buy two pounds of light roast or two pounds of dark roast, which one is gonna have more total caffeine? The answer is dark roast, so if the cost is the same dark roast is a better buy if you are looking for total caffeine.

Not enough grounds is the reason for bitter coffee. My link shows it and I have also heard it discussed by Alton Brown on the Food Network.

I didn't need google, these things I already knew. My line of work requires the use of evidence though, so I am used to using it.[/QUOTE]

lol, this is from YOUR link, I didnt even have to go find one to make you look bad -

"If you have ever experienced bitter, unpleasant coffee, it was probably over-extracted."

"The most common reasons for over-extraction include using too little coffee, using water that is too hot, or brewing the coffee for too long."

You see that? Plural. ReasonSSSSS. With an S. There are MANY reasonSSSS why it can happen. Read the whole page you ripped off of google before you pretend you know so much.

[QUOTE=put5onyo;190743761]

Not enough grounds is the reason for bitter coffee. My link shows it.
[/QUOTE]

Among the other three possibilities they listed. Right? Must I continue?

This is my last post, hopefully someone actually learned something here.

Dont even get me started on the loss and degrading of antioxidants and the other bs that come with roasting longer.

/thread

It all depends on your coffee quality! I order my Whole bean coffee fresh and from a supplier in New Jersey. They make the beans then ship them out the same day. I also do my coffee with a french press-- you get more flavor and more of the full acidic body. Quality coffee is where it is at! Cheap folgers is old, stale, and gives me the shakes. I can't drink that crap. If any of you need suggestions for good coffee feel free to ask!

I take No Doz at like 400 to 500 mg if I am tired and it is a nice slow up and a nice slow down.

[QUOTE=Xeric;190725161]

lighter roast beans = more caffeine = less grounds used = [B]coffee isnt bitter as **** from using way too much grounds[/B] = saves you money.[/QUOTE]


You said it, and even if it is one of many reasons, you are still wrong. Too many grounds will not cause bitter coffee. Just admit you were wrong.

[QUOTE=Xeric;190753421]lol, this is from YOUR link, I didnt even have to go find one to make you look bad -

"If you have ever experienced bitter, unpleasant coffee, it was probably over-extracted."

"The most common reasons for over-extraction include using too little coffee, using water that is too hot, or brewing the coffee for too long."

You see that? Plural. ReasonSSSSS. With an S. There are MANY reasonSSSS why it can happen. Read the whole page you ripped off of google before you pretend you know so much.



Among the other three possibilities they listed. Right? Must I continue?

This is my last post, hopefully someone actually learned something here.

Dont even get me started on the loss and degrading of antioxidants and the other bs that come with roasting longer.

/thread[/QUOTE]

There are many reasons, but you said too many grounds causes it, and I proved you were wrong. Why discuss the other issues if they were never brought up. I just pointed out where you were wrong.

Yes, brewing for too long or too hot of coffee can lead to bitterness as well, but you said too many grounds will cause bitterness, and you were wrong.

Here is Alton's-

[url]http://www.foodnetwork.com/food/recipes/recipe/0,1977,FOOD_9936_10020,00.html[/url]

"If you prefer a milder cup, brew to full strength, and then dilute with hot water. Brewing with too little coffee will result in over-extraction, and that means bitterness."


Only reason he gave. Once again, your equation is proven wrong. Feel sorry for your customers.

guarna has 3x the caffeine as coffee

[QUOTE=gjohnson5;190769101]guarna has 3x the caffeine as coffee[/QUOTE]

Guarana? tssk tssk

[QUOTE=put5onyo;190770071]Guarana? tssk tssk[/QUOTE]

LOL a TV watcher here...

[QUOTE=put5onyo;190663231]
Personally I have the darkest Folger's available, my coffee maker does not have a pot, but rather travel mugs (16 oz i believe), and still fill the grounds all the way to the top. Trust me, I take pills as well, but nothing beats that cup o' joe for getting me going.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Xeric;190703811]The darker the coffee the less caffeine it contains, being roasted longer they lose more caffeine in the process.[/QUOTE]

That would be correct.

Question:
Can you tell me how much caffeine is in my Folgers Coffee?

Answer:
Caffeine content can vary by blend ([b]dark roasted coffees contain less caffeine than lighter roasted coffees[/b]), so here's the scoop:

Serving size equals 1 tablespoon ground coffee to 6 oz of water.
Milligrams of Caffeine per Serving:
Regular: 59 mg per tablespoon (one serving)
[url]http://folgers.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/folgers.cfg/php/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=1330&p_created=1034880776&p_sid=NnVFQy8j&p_accessibility=0&p_redirect=&p_lva=&p_sp=cF9zcmNoPTEmcF9zb3J0X2J5PSZwX2dyaWRzb3J0PSZwX3Jvd19jbnQ9NCZwX3Byb2RzPSZwX2NhdHM9MCZwX3B2PSZwX2N2PSZwX3BhZ2U9MSZwX3NlYXJjaF90ZXh0PWNhZmZlaW5l&p_li=&p_topview=1[/url]

There's a reason Starbucks ground Breakfast Blend contains the most amount of caffeine per serving out of the entire Strabucks ground line. It's because Breakfast Blend is the lightest roasted coffee. :cool: Same goes for the Dunkin' Donuts Breakfast Blend.

I drank 4 cups of Folgers brew everyday for years. That turned out to approx 236g's of Caffeine each and everyday. I recently cut down to only 3 cups, and hope to get it down to at least 2 sometime soon. I love my stims, but now I want to cut down on my caffeine intake, as it certainly can't be all that healthy.

If you want the strongest coffee available, then simply brew your own Espresso. Or you can order a Grande at Starbucks, a 16oz cup has approx 330mg of caffeine. Or just brew some more at home...........

do a google search for coffee and "liver enzymes". Why simple coffee consumption isn't recommended as one of the most important cycle support and post cycle support recommendations for methylated compounds is beyond me.

FWIW, I used to drink around 40-50 ounces of coffee a day, a quart of which i made at home, almost espresso strongm from the darkest roast i could find in a can (CFON new york roast). I started having some horrible sick feelings, and changed how much water, protein, and food i ingest, how i eat, etc. long story short, coffee is totally different than red bull, caffeine pills, etc. in my system at least. right now using ripped fuel 5x, and i am on painkillers for a thoracic strain and shoulder blade injury, so i can't comment on specifics, since i react horribly to opiates. the ******** makes me sweat, so i drink more, so i piss more. Oh, and it's dope, it's disorienting too. gonna ask the doctor for something non-narcotic.

Does anyone else find that the coffee you buy at a coffee shop seems to work and taste better than when you brew at home? I drink black coffee so my usual cup is only $2 at Starbucks, but I'd rather make at home but it never has the same taste or gives me the same kick

[QUOTE]the ******** makes me sweat, so i drink more, so i piss more. Oh, and it's dope, it's disorienting too. gonna ask the doctor for something non-narcotic.[/QUOTE]

Actually, ******** is an opioid, not a narcotic ;)

[QUOTE=fldhkybnva;968961503]Does anyone else find that the coffee you buy at a coffee shop seems to work and taste better than when you brew at home? I drink black coffee so my usual cup is only $2 at Starbucks, but I'd rather make at home but it never has the same taste or gives me the same kick[/QUOTE]

so many things make a cup of coffee taste good

Beans:
- Roast level (mild, medium, dark)
- Freshness (do the beans look oily or dry?)
- Grind ( french press is large grind, drip coffee is medium, and espresso is very fine ground)

Brew:
- Water temperature is ideal at 190 degrees. Too hot will give bitter coffee, too cold will give bland coffee.
- Strength of coffee varies at home, it's always the same at starbucks

there are so many other reasons...

Caf pills are way cheap and convenient. Get 'er done.