Hey Par Deus

[jay12]

When is avant labs gonna start selling "ONE" and have you had any experience with it yet. I remeber PA saying the 1-AD had some irritating affects on the skin, did you find a way to get around that? Oh yeah, one more thing, who else sells avant labs stuff besides their website, I haven't been able to find any.
thanks, jay

[Par Deus]

Originally posted by jay12
When is avant labs gonna start selling "ONE" and have you had any experience with it yet. I remeber PA saying the 1-AD had some irritating affects on the skin, did you find a way to get around that? Oh yeah, one more thing, who else sells avant labs stuff besides their website, I haven't been able to find any.
thanks, jay


The beta version of "One" could be available as soon as early the week after next (10 days or so), the final version will follow a few weeks after that. I have not tried it yet -- should have it next week.

Someone brought up 1-AD irritating the skin and PA said he didn't say it. He did say it did not work as well as oral.

However, "One" will not contain 1-AD, it will contain its conversion product 1-testosterone. It is what was found to be 7-8 times as anabolic as testosterone in a levator ani study.

PA made a topical of 1-test for some guys at ErgoPharm and said it worked "very, very well", which are strong words for PA. And, our topical formulation is significantly better than ErgoPharm's, IMO.

Not to mention that 1-AD seems to work quite well and since "One" already contains the active androgen, it will avoid enzyme issues.

Not many retailers carry our products yet. Marketing is not by strong suit, to say the least.

You can probably find a few here and there with a Google search, but the best thing would be to bug your favorite retailer to carry them.

[jay12]

Thanks for the info Par, can't wait to try "ONE," hey maybe we should start bugging BB.COM to start selling Avant Labs, maybe I'll start a poll.

[Big Cat]

The beta version of "One" could be available as soon as early the week after next (10 days or so), the final version will follow a few weeks after that. I have not tried it yet -- should have it next week.


Beta as in trial run, or beta as in the isomer ?



Someone brought up 1-AD irritating the skin and PA said he didn't say it. He did say it did not work as well as oral.


He didn't, i do remember him saying it was quite irritating to take orally (not in cap) as well as nasally. He never said it was irritating to the skin. I also asked him about the transdermal thing, and his reply to me wasn't that he thought it wouldn't work, his reasoning was "what is the point in inventing the most orally active prohormone, only to make it transdermal ?" So it would be a good idea in my opinion. What are you going to charge retail ?



However, "One" will not contain 1-AD, it will contain its conversion product 1-testosterone. It is what was found to be 7-8 times as anabolic as testosterone in a levator ani study.


You too ? How do you get your hands on this stuff ? And how is any product shown to be 2.5 times more effective than enth still covered by the DSHEA ? Not that I'm not excited. A legal product that is better than an anabolic steroid delivered in transdermal fashion would be a miracle ! Will it be a gel ?



PA made a topical of 1-test for some guys at ErgoPharm and said it worked "very, very well", which are strong words for PA. And, our topical formulation is significantly better than ErgoPharm's, IMO.


To say otherwise wouldn't be a smart marketing move now would it ? :)



Not many retailers carry our products yet. Marketing is not by strong suit, to say the least.


Working on it ...

[Par Deus]

Originally posted by Big Cat


Beta as in trial run, or beta as in the isomer ?




Trial run. Basically, it is what I expect to be the final forumulation, but without the final packaging.





I also asked him about the transdermal thing, and his reply to me wasn't that he thought it wouldn't work, his reasoning was "what is the point in inventing the most orally active prohormone, only to make it transdermal ?" So it would be a good idea in my opinion.



He originally, on MFW, said he thought it would work better. He later said he tested it and it did not work as well. I asked him theory on why somewhere, but cannot recall where, so I have never received an answer.




What are you going to charge retail ?


Probably in the $70-80 range for a 2-3 weeks supply. It will not be cheap. Basically, just want it to be better and cheaper than Biotest.





You too ? How do you get your hands on this stuff ? And how is any product shown to be 2.5 times more effective than enth still covered by the DSHEA ? Not that I'm not excited. A legal product that is better than an anabolic steroid delivered in transdermal fashion would be a miracle ! Will it be a gel ?


The company we get it from is getting it from China, I believe. It is covered by the DSHEA for the reasons stated in my last post -- naturally occuring, never pursued by a pharmaceutical company. Now, whether it will stay legal is an entirely different question.

As long as noone calls it 1-testosterone on the label, I think it should be cool (though, Biotest using a ****ing estert cannot help).

It will be in a topical gel -- same formula as 4-ADerm/Nor-ADerm.





A legal product that is better than an anabolic steroid delivered in transdermal fashion would be a miracle !


I fully expect it to pretty much revolutionize "natural" bodybuilding.

Hopefully, I am correct.






To say otherwise wouldn't be a smart marketing move now would it ? :)


True, though I have backed up the statement with a rather long presentation of data.

[Big Cat]

Probably in the $70-80 range for a 2-3 weeks supply. It will not be cheap. Basically, just want it to be better and cheaper than Biotest.


Depending on the wholesale value we'll knock some of that off here at BB.com. Better than Biotest will not be an issue, not even in this case. If you are correct about the ester only delivering a 3% increase, the liquid form and the fact that it is mixed with another, weaker substance make it so it can't compare to the actual stuff in a sustained release form like topical.



The company we get it from is getting it from China, I believe. It is covered by the DSHEA for the reasons stated in my last post -- naturally occuring, never pursued by a pharmaceutical company. Now, whether it will stay legal is an entirely different question.


That's what I figured, there must be like a million reasons it shouldn't be legal to begin with. What's up with those Chinese anyway ? I found websites where you can order like nandrolone in bulk and ****.

I say you brew up a ton of that stuff before hand, and if the FDA comes to shut you down, we can pan it for 50% more on the black market. Think about it, no taxes, more income...



As long as noone calls it 1-testosterone on the label, I think it should be cool (though, Biotest using a ****ing estert cannot help).


Ok, break it down. This is the company currently getting sued by Muscletech and AST. If you get sued by those two ****piles, something has to be seriously wrong with your mental condition. Then Old ******* blabbed his mouth about Roberts being able to outdo Arnold and Llewellyn. So he had to deliver. What did you honestly expect from these guys ?



I fully expect it to pretty much revolutionize "natural" bodybuilding.


Considering the amount used is no longer limited by enzyme control, this technically isn't a natural supplement anymore. Not that it would stop me, but I thought I'd run that by you.



True, though I have backed up the statement with a rather long presentation of data.

So why are you holding out on me ? Where can I get a copy ?

[Big Cat]

Glad to see Par Deus here. FInally there is educated and meaningful discussion here. [/B]

Thanks a lot bro ...

[Big Cat]

oh, ok ... :)

[Par Deus]

Originally posted by Big Cat

So why are you holding out on me ? Where can I get a copy ?


"Data" was not the best choice of words, should have said "science". I wrote a rather long vis a vis a vis for 4-ADerm, AndroSpray, and Androsol in the "Pimpology" section of the second issue of Big Mf'r -- it's entitled "Battle of the Transdermal Prohormones"

[Par Deus]

Originally posted by K (same)
Par Deus wrote :"The company we get it from is getting it from China, I believe"

Seems like every body is getting their ingredient from some firms in China. The question is WHERE DO THE CHINESE GET THEIR STUFF FROM? What about the quality issue? We know for a fact that the creatine from CHina is so contaminated with potentially harmful impurities. What about the quality of these andro/Norandro/1-test imported from China? Has any one checked at all?


China is quite cabable of producing USP grade pharmaceuticals -- they can build a nuclear weapon, afterall. The company I am getting it from has every batch of evrything they get tested at an independent lab.

[Big Cat]

Thanx man, i'll be checking that out again then. Its usually my habit to skip returning columns. I'm getting mad cause I can't get my printer to work and its a bitch to read on a comp screen. I still want to read that, your piece on leptin and those fat-loss articles of Elzi's on Anabolic Pharmacology.

[Fit For Life]

Yeah, those Chinese have it all.

I have connections to chinese supps through a chinese guy who owns a company down there.

I looked at a a catalog once, but it was all in Chinese, so I couldn't quite figure out what some of the stuff was??

Maybe I will dig it out if I have it, and see if any one knows what some of the stuff is??

fit

[admin]

Check it out!

Bodybuilding.com now sells Avant Labs. (Just wait for the other sites to copy us.) They are some awesome products!

http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/al/avant.htm

[VIPERS]

Has anyone tried this yet. If so please let us know how it works. Also would this work with some oral prohormones or would the oral be a waste. Thanks for any info.

[Dorian]

i guess I will have to try some of the stuff he makes.

[Big Cat]

Originally posted by VIPERS
Has anyone tried this yet. If so please let us know how it works. Also would this work with some oral prohormones or would the oral be a waste. Thanks for any info.

Yes, in fact it would work great to stack it with an oral prohormone. Stacking 4ADerm with a 1,4-andro or Noraderm with 1AD for example. The oral wouldn't be a waste. I for one believe in the synergism of stacking orals with transdermals. Besides, until they come out with transdermal 1,4-andros and 1ADs I don't think anything will replace them.