Political views on hunting and fishing

[Budweiser]

So this thread is just for anyone to express their views on hunting and fishing...Why you think some laws should be changed, why you don't support hunting or fishing, why you think that this sport should be conserved for years to come.

I got this idea from a discussion on the Member pics thread (outdoors section) and thought that we should have a place for these type of debates.

I'll start it off with this. What are you thoughts on taking a small buck?

I personally don't shoot a buck unless it is going to go on my wall and so does everybody that I hunt with. IMO if you are going to shoot something small you mind as well shoot a doe and let the buck get big enough for a trophy.

Replies?

[fitnessman]

It's all a matter of being responsible. We as sports men (and women) are the care takers for the next generations. Through selective harvest, we ensure a healthy population of fish and game for years to come.

That being said, I take one Deer per season, Always a Doe. I don't rack hunt anymore.

[Nainoa]

So this thread is just for anyone to express their views on hunting and fishing...Why you think some laws should be changed, why you don't support hunting or fishing, why you think that this sport should be conserved for years to come.

I got this idea from a discussion on the Member pics thread (outdoors section) and thought that we should have a place for these type of debates.

I'll start it off with this. What are you thoughts on taking a small buck?

I personally don't shoot a buck unless it is going to go on my wall and so does everybody that I hunt with. IMO if you are going to shoot something small you mind as well shoot a doe and let the buck get big enough for a trophy.

Replies?

Now I'm not really a hunter... I go with sometimes to hunting camp with my buddies...

The thing I don't get here though, is that isn't it better to shoot the buck than it is the Doe... Considering that you can have a very low Buck population in a herd, and they can still "Spread it around" to doe's who come into esteres (sp?)...

Where as a doe is at best putting 1 fawn into the world a year...

So you'd have a greater chance of reproductive success killing bucks rather than does.

Am I missing something there?

***

As for me, as more of a fisherman...

With anything other than Pan Fish, I only keep younger one's... Such as a Walleye 13-20... Anything over that, unless it's somehow maimed by gut hooking, I don't keep simply because the fish is perfect breeding stock...

She's proved that she's fast growing and hearty, by getting to 20"+ Thus her offspring will also pass on those good genes...

And of course larger fish aren't that good to eat anyway.

[Budweiser]

There are WAY more doe (at least in my area) than buck. And the reason for this is simple, people like to brag about shooting a buck (large or small) so now there are very few trophy buck running around and a TON of doe (decent sized doe too).

So what happens is people will take a small 4 pointer over a doe just to say that they shot a buck. And no we do not want that many doe around just so we can have more deer. In my area (southeastern MN) each hunter can shoot up to 7 deer/year! Now that's alot of deer being taken.

I have drove by some peoples land around dusk and seen literally hundreds of does in the field just eating and relaxing. It is truely a sight to behold.

[Nainoa]

There are WAY more doe (at least in my area) than buck. And the reason for this is simple, people like to brag about shooting a buck (large or small) so now there are very few trophy buck running around and a TON of doe (decent sized doe too).

So what happens is people will take a small 4 pointer over a doe just to say that they shot a buck. And no we do not want that many doe around just so we can have more deer. In my area (southeastern MN) each hunter can shoot up to 7 deer/year! Now that's alot of deer being taken.

I have drove by some peoples land around dusk and seen literally hundreds of does in the field just eating and relaxing. It is truely a sight to behold.



Where my buddy's hunt (And granted I'm not up to date) but you have to actually get a doe permit... Though in recent years it's become easier and easier for them to get the DP.

I actually have deer that come into my yard from time to time...

And the city of St. Cloud (My Hometown) just passed a motion to have an Urban Archery hunt, because we have to many deer that have been living in the Mississippi corridor (Which is like 200 feet from my house) That deer are prancing through the city streets... (They haven't outlined the regulations for it yet.)

Last fall a Deer almost hit my car... And my car was parked in my office parking lot!

[Budweiser]

Where my buddy's hunt (And granted I'm not up to date) but you have to actually get a doe permit... Though in recent years it's become easier and easier for them to get the DP.

I actually have deer that come into my yard from time to time...

And the city of St. Cloud (My Hometown) just passed a motion to have an Urban Archery hunt, because we have to many deer that have been living in the Mississippi corridor (Which is like 200 feet from my house) That deer are prancing through the city streets... (They haven't outlined the regulations for it yet.)

Last fall a Deer almost hit my car... And my car was parked in my office parking lot!


Yeah up until two years ago you had to apply for a doe perment during the doe season. Now if you go doe season you automatically get to take a doe and do not need to apply for a permit.

up until two years ago during buck season you could not shoot a doe, but now you can apply for a doe permit and shoot one during buck season as well.

Even with all these new laws and making it easier to shoot a doe the hunters are still not keeping up with the number to doe that are produced every year.

But I'm doing my part and my freezer is full of meat!

[Nainoa]

But I'm doing my part and my freezer is full of meat!

Yeah I hear ya Bro!

My Secretary's Husband hunts deer with his buddy's because it makes him feel butch and all that jazz... Dude is a serious poser of a sportsman... But he hates venison... Ironically he goes out every year, just to save "Man-Face" and ends up shooting a deer... He gets his meat... And then his wife brings in some roasts, tenderloins, ground and steaks for me to take.

My Girlfriend is a Gourmet Cook turned Nurse, and I'm one hell of a cook myself... So we've gotten damn good cooking Venison now...

Crappy thing was last year the guy only shot a small one, so the stash of meat was small... Now I'm all out, :( and have to wait for that ******* to go blast me up another one!

Goddam it... Now I'm itching for some of my venison lasagna!
(I spent the first 8 years of my life raised by Sicilian Immigrants, so I've found all kinds of ways of incorporating Venison into italian dishes.)

[Hartski]

I hunt for meat, so I don't care if it's a doe or a buck. It all just depends on what tag I get. And if I shoot at a buck, I don't care if it's a button-buck or a 12 pointer. Meat is meat.

[Budweiser]

I hunt for meat, so I don't care if it's a doe or a buck. It all just depends on what tag I get. And if I shoot at a buck, I don't care if it's a button-buck or a 12 pointer. Meat is meat.
I feel that is wrong. You are not giving them a chance to mature and produce other large bucks. So in a sense you are actually loosing meat my shooting the small bucks and not letting them get big so you have large bucks to eat.

Right now there are alot of small buck and not alot of large buck. With a few years of not shooting the small bucks they will mature and there will be a ton of large buck around.

[Nainoa]

I feel that is wrong. You are not giving them a chance to mature and produce other large bucks. So in a sense you are actually loosing meat my shooting the small bucks and not letting them get big so you have large bucks to eat.

Right now there are alot of small buck and not alot of large buck. With a few years of not shooting the small bucks they will mature and there will be a ton of large buck around.

My Boss always gets at least 2 deer every season... One bow hunting and one rifle...

His 17 year old son was in my office last fall, telling this epic tale of him getting his 10th deer lifetime... You know... All the epic prose, and hyperbole, but very little description of the deer itself...

Just as he finishes the story, and I give him the obligatory congrats... My boss walks in, cuts him off and says "So did you happen to mention that it still had spots!"

Kid turned red, and left.

[GREENFEATHER]

I hunt for meat just like Hartski, meat is meat to me. If it's a buck or doe, doesn't matter to me, what I don't use gets donated to soup kitchens and needy families in my county.

I especially like spotted deer!! :D Nice and tender.

[Hartski]

I feel that is wrong. You are not giving them a chance to mature and produce other large bucks. So in a sense you are actually loosing meat my shooting the small bucks and not letting them get big so you have large bucks to eat.

Right now there are alot of small buck and not alot of large buck. With a few years of not shooting the small bucks they will mature and there will be a ton of large buck around.

The thing is, I don't care if there are a ton of large bucks around. That just causes alot more trophy hunters to come around, and I'm not a fan of trophy hunting. I'm not saying I'll shoot a baby, but if it's a good sized deer and will produce a good amount of meat, it's dead.

Besides, we're so overpopulated with deer down here, the bucks should be taken out young, so they don't have the chance to produce dozens of offspring.

[Nainoa]

The thing is, I don't care if there are a ton of large bucks around. That just causes alot more trophy hunters to come around, and I'm not a fan of trophy hunting. I'm not saying I'll shoot a baby, but if it's a good sized deer and will produce a good amount of meat, it's dead.

Besides, we're so overpopulated with deer down here, the bucks should be taken out young, so they don't have the chance to produce dozens of offspring.


You know one perspective that flitters into my mind...

Northern Minnesota, is rather discerning with it's Deer permits... Granted still pretty loose by conservation standards, but not the "Free-For-All" that I'm hearing some of you other midwestern hunters describing...

One factor that's come into play in northern MN is the return of the Timberwolf... Where the T-wolf population is thinning out the weak, and the old in the deer population, and helping to cull them from the explosive numbers some of you describe...

So it brings up the question now... "For you guys in these other parts of the midwest, what is the state of the natural predators... And/or are the natrual predators gone, and it's just up to man to fill the role of the wolf etc...?"

[Hartski]

There are some mountain lion and bobcats in Iowa, and Timberwolves are just starting to come back into western iowa, but that's it. The car is still the deer's most fearsome natural enemy.

And it's not really a free-for-all. You can get certain tags, some seasons are antlerless only, ect.

[Budweiser]

well mostly in my area of southeastern MN it is the coyote and they don't take much of the population at all. There really isn't a huge natural predator of the deer down here.

[bbowen32006]

I look at it like this. Born and raised in Alabama, killing things is some peoples lives there. So hunting is not a bad thing, BUT some people are careless about what and how many they kill a year. (deer) As long as they can say they got a deer this weekend the will be happy, 6 point or doe.

If your a smart hunter, theres no prob. with killing a couple of animals here and there.

[Budweiser]

Another topic that came to my mind while I was trout fishing this weekend. Fish and slot limit.

In Southeastern MN Trout is the main game fish and rightly so there are a ton of trout streams and the DNR has a fishiery that releases thousand of them every year around the area.

With that in mind I noticed something different this season with the rules and regs on diffenent creeks. Alot of the creeks will only allow you to use artifical lures and baits (doesn't bother me, I'm a spinner type of guy) and barbless hooks (this bothers me), also a slot limit that says you need to release any trout between 12"-16" (the best eating size is 10"-14"). All of these rules come from trout unlimited which is basically run by fly fisherman, all they do is catch and release. But for someone who wants to keep some fish and eat them they are making it alot tougher to keep your catch.

I guess if they want the population to rise then why require them to only use artifical lures? I can see the reasoning for the barbless hooks as they are much less harmful to the fish, but regulation of the live vs artifical bait is well stupid IMO. If you take your 5 year old son out and want to him to catch some fish he is not going to be able to constantly cast and reel in a spinner. What you do for them is cast out a worm and a hook and wait and let them reel it in, much more fun for a child then to make then cast and reel constantly.

Sorry for the lenghy post, but needed to get the point across.

[Nainoa]

Another topic that came to my mind while I was trout fishing this weekend. Fish and slot limit.

In Southeastern MN Trout is the main game fish and rightly so there are a ton of trout streams and the DNR has a fishiery that releases thousand of them every year around the area.

With that in mind I noticed something different this season with the rules and regs on diffenent creeks. Alot of the creeks will only allow you to use artifical lures and baits (doesn't bother me, I'm a spinner type of guy) and barbless hooks (this bothers me), also a slot limit that says you need to release any trout between 12"-16" (the best eating size is 10"-14"). All of these rules come from trout unlimited which is basically run by fly fisherman, all they do is catch and release. But for someone who wants to keep some fish and eat them they are making it alot tougher to keep your catch.

I guess if they want the population to rise then why require them to only use artifical lures? I can see the reasoning for the barbless hooks as they are much less harmful to the fish, but regulation of the live vs artifical bait is well stupid IMO. If you take your 5 year old son out and want to him to catch some fish he is not going to be able to constantly cast and reel in a spinner. What you do for them is cast out a worm and a hook and wait and let them reel it in, much more fun for a child then to make then cast and reel constantly.

Sorry for the lenghy post, but needed to get the point across.


Well on the one hand... I'm not a trout or fly fishing guy...

On the other hand, once I really got to understand how slot limits work, I've become a HUGE proponent of them...

Best example is Lake Winni (Winnibigoshish) in Northern MN... Since they imposed a Walleye slot of 17-26 must be released... The quality of that fishery is continuing to bloom...

So much to the point where starting in a couple of days they will begin stripping and Milking the Larger Walleye for rearing ponds and re-stocking!

What happens is that by allowing "The Big Mothers" to keep on year after year, you start getting more and more successful reproduction of fish that are in that "Prime Eater" zone... So much to the point where fishing pressure can't damage a year class significantly...

Since playing around with Slot limits on Walleye over the last Decade and change, and the high success rates they've seen because of it... The DNR is now extending this to select lakes with Pike population and stunting problems... Last I heard they were thinking about applying these same kind of slot management to other species... It appears that they're also extending it to Trout...

***
As for the Lure restrictions...

Now Granted I'm not a Trout guy, so I can't say for sure...

But I have fished Barbless and other lure restricted lakes once every blue moon or three... And one of the reasons they implement these kinds of restrictions for other species on a lake by lake basis, is to encourage only the anglers with a higher skill level to fish those lakes, because the population of those lakes is threatened in some way or another... And often it's the mis-handling of inexperienced anglers that causes the higher side averages of death in CR situations...

I would suspect that they are doing the same thing here for trout streams... They're probably just trying to get that population up, and it's their way of saying "Hey... Take your kids somewhere else to let them cut their teeth, and make their mistakes."
Or "This is not a learning stream."

[King Crush]

Bud,
Did you make this thread, cuz of what I said about how we don't shoot a buck unless it's got a big rack on it? What I'll do, if I've got a buck tag is I'll hunt all through out the season, and pass up the small bucks I see, but if the last day of my season, and I still don't see any big bucks, I will shoot a small buck if I see one. I don't wanna go home with no meat, and a wasted $35 on a tag! I'm not like most people, and go out hunting ,and the first buck I see I shoot it, I wait, and hope for a monster to come around! If everyone did this there would be a hell of a lot more trophy Bucks out there! The feeling of shooting a monster buck is awesome?:)

[Budweiser]

Bud,
Did you make this thread, cuz of what I said about how we don't shoot a buck unless it's got a big rack on it? What I'll do, if I've got a buck tag is I'll hunt all through out the season, and pass up the small bucks I see, but if the last day of my season, and I still don't see any big bucks, I will shoot a small buck if I see one. I don't wanna go home with no meat, and a wasted $35 on a tag! I'm not like most people, and go out hunting ,and the first buck I see I shoot it, I wait, and hope for a monster to come around! If everyone did this there would be a hell of a lot more trophy Bucks out there! The feeling of shooting a monster buck is awesome?:)
No it was a discussion between fitnessman Nainoa and myself last week. But you situation applies and I whole heartedly agree with you, if everyone only shot quality bucks then there would be a ton more quality bucks around. Doe's come a dime a dozen and are all over the place, but a nice buck is hard to find.

[fitnessman]

A Doe just tastes better IMO.

[Hartski]

No it was a discussion between fitnessman Nainoa and myself last week. But you situation applies and I whole heartedly agree with you, if everyone only shot quality bucks then there would be a ton more quality bucks around. Doe's come a dime a dozen and are all over the place, but a nice buck is hard to find.

Well, you are assuming every small buck will grow up to be a monster, and that just isn't true. You can have 3 bucks the same age standing there, and one will be a tiny 6 pointer, the other will have one broken antler, and the 3rd will be a massive 12 pointer.

[Budweiser]

Well, you are assuming every small buck will grow up to be a monster, and that just isn't true. You can have 3 bucks the same age standing there, and one will be a tiny 6 pointer, the other will have one broken antler, and the 3rd will be a massive 12 pointer.
If you don't give them a chance to grow, how will you ever know how big it was going to get?

[bbowen32006]

A Doe just tastes better IMO.I think so also, every time a buddy makes links or whatever (hameburgers, pasta, ect.)
the doe always taste 10 times better, than a male. I wonder why that is? It could have something to do with the person who processed it.

OMG I would kill for a huge peice of deer meat right now!!!!! That would be the best lunch at work! Everyone would look at you and ask what you are eating and i would say bambie..................(I can see the look on there faces now)

[Hartski]

If you don't give them a chance to grow, how will you ever know how big it was going to get?

Well, I don't have their heads mounted, so it's pointless to let the rack get huge. A young buck has enough meat for me, and the less huge bucks there are, the less pure trophy hunters will be out there wasting a deer just for the "glory" or whatever.

[Budweiser]

Well, I don't have their heads mounted, so it's pointless to let the rack get huge. A young buck has enough meat for me, and the less huge bucks there are, the less pure trophy hunters will be out there wasting a deer just for the "glory" or whatever.
I consider myself a trophy hunter, but also a meat hunter. I don't waste a deer just for the glory, but if I see a large buck I will shoot it and also process the meat and eat it. There are plenty of doe's around so why waste a young buck.

[fitnessman]

the doe always taste 10 times better, than a male. I wonder why that is? It could have something to do with the person who processed it.


The males hormones are raging during most of the season..This is why.

[Hartski]

It's not wasting a young buck when you take him for the meat. You are fulfilling his purpose in life. I'm not saying I wouldn't shoot a large buck if he gets in my sights, but that's not my only criteria.

[Budweiser]

It's not wasting a young buck when you take him for the meat. You are fulfilling his purpose in life. I'm not saying I wouldn't shoot a large buck if he gets in my sights, but that's not my only criteria.
well different strokes I guess, different strokes.

[bbowen32006]

The males hormones are raging during most of the season..This is why.

Sure, But I didn'y know this would effect the taste of the meat. Still deer meat is a great change from just a peice of chicken or steak.

On another note, Why, when i tell people I love deer meat and want some their like, I can't belive you eat deeer man thats gross, while their eating a 2/3 burger from hardees. Uhhh the same reason you eating that f*cking huge cow burger, made with COW, a living thing at one time too. I just don't understand how these people think. Sorry for the slight rant.

[Budweiser]

Sure, But I didn'y know this would effect the taste of the meat. Still deer meat is a great change from just a peice of chicken or steak.

On another note, Why, when i tell people I love deer meat and want some their like, I can't belive you eat deeer man thats gross, while their eating a 2/3 burger from hardees. Uhhh the same reason you eating that f*cking huge cow burger, made with COW, a living thing at one time too. I just don't understand how these people think. Sorry for the slight rant.
Seems like the further into the city that you go the more you look like a hick because you hunt

[Hartski]

Seems like the further into the city that you go the more you look like a hick because you hunt

One of the many reasons I'll never live in a city.

[jamieo]

I have mixed feelings about hunting and fishing. I do think that strict regulation is necessary because over hunting / over fishing can cause a whole lot of problems to the local ecosystems. Since we humans have had such a huge impact on the environment, the natural predator/prey system does not really exist in the wild in a lot of places within the US. Either we have destroyed all of the predators and the prey animals have become overpopulated or we have killed off all of the prey animals and the predators died out or left for greener pastures. I grew up near LBL (Land Between the Lakes)- a large national forest. They have a good program of wildlife management there and allow hunting to control the animal population.

I grew up in the country and did do a little hunting as a kid and I also went fishing quite a lot. I never liked eating wild meat though, so I basically quit when I was about 13 or so. Most of my family likes wild meat but they don't hunt that much anymore. Given the pollution in many rivers and streams in this area, I can't say that I would eat any wild-caught fish anymore, so I stopped going fishing as well.

I am not really a fan of trophy hunting at all. I think that if you are going to kill an animal, you should make use of it's body as best you can- something more than stuffing its head and hanging it on your wall. Trophy hunting and uncontrolled hunting has led to the endangerment or extinction of many wild animals- the American Bison, the Carolina Parakeet (yes we did have parrots in North America) and others.

[Budweiser]

I have mixed feelings about hunting and fishing. I do think that strict regulation is necessary because over hunting / over fishing can cause a whole lot of problems to the local ecosystems. Since we humans have had such a huge impact on the environment, the natural predator/prey system does not really exist in the wild in a lot of places within the US. Either we have destroyed all of the predators and the prey animals have become overpopulated or we have killed off all of the prey animals and the predators died out or left for greener pastures. I grew up near LBL (Land Between the Lakes)- a large national forest. They have a good program of wildlife management there and allow hunting to control the animal population.

I grew up in the country and did do a little hunting as a kid and I also went fishing quite a lot. I never liked eating wild meat though, so I basically quit when I was about 13 or so. Most of my family likes wild meat but they don't hunt that much anymore. Given the pollution in many rivers and streams in this area, I can't say that I would eat any wild-caught fish anymore, so I stopped going fishing as well.

I am not really a fan of trophy hunting at all. I think that if you are going to kill an animal, you should make use of it's body as best you can- something more than stuffing its head and hanging it on your wall. Trophy hunting and uncontrolled hunting has led to the endangerment or extinction of many wild animals- the American Bison, the Carolina Parakeet (yes we did have parrots in North America) and others.

I agree that you should use the animal for meat, unless of course it has CWD. But you can still use all of the meat even if you stuff the animal and put it on the wall.

[Nainoa]

I have mixed feelings about hunting and fishing. I do think that strict regulation is necessary because over hunting / over fishing can cause a whole lot of problems to the local ecosystems. Since we humans have had such a huge impact on the environment, the natural predator/prey system does not really exist in the wild in a lot of places within the US. Either we have destroyed all of the predators and the prey animals have become overpopulated or we have killed off all of the prey animals and the predators died out or left for greener pastures. I grew up near LBL (Land Between the Lakes)- a large national forest. They have a good program of wildlife management there and allow hunting to control the animal population.

I grew up in the country and did do a little hunting as a kid and I also went fishing quite a lot. I never liked eating wild meat though, so I basically quit when I was about 13 or so. Most of my family likes wild meat but they don't hunt that much anymore. Given the pollution in many rivers and streams in this area, I can't say that I would eat any wild-caught fish anymore, so I stopped going fishing as well.

I am not really a fan of trophy hunting at all. I think that if you are going to kill an animal, you should make use of it's body as best you can- something more than stuffing its head and hanging it on your wall. Trophy hunting and uncontrolled hunting has led to the endangerment or extinction of many wild animals- the American Bison, the Carolina Parakeet (yes we did have parrots in North America) and others.

Minnesota has a pretty big "Triple Dichotomy."

We're the only state in the union that has both hardwood forest, coniferous forest, and prairie... Add to that 10,000 lakes 5,700+ of which are fishable, and a lot of hunting opportunities, and it kind of is a Land Management nightmare.

The Rural farm guys from the prairie, or intruded forest, pollute the water with Agricultural run-off... While the Urban area's keep pushing into the Forests driving game and predators further a field...

Through out the course of the late 1960's through the Early 1980's, Anglers and hunters kind of raped our natural resources... Then we started realizing what's been going on, and since then we've been at the forefront of intelligent conservation...

Granted there's still Gaps... But we're working on closing them...

But what's happening for us now, is that the people who live in these "Wild Area's." have learned better management of natural resources... Unfortunately the people who come from the Urban areas, especially those who were raised by that same generation that raped the resources... Those guys are spoiling a lot of stuff with their uneducated practices...

And what's really going to be called for, in order for my state to really "Get it right" is to start educating those Urban based weekend warriors, so when they come north to enjoy the beautiful forrests, and lakes, they aren't just littering Starbucks cups, and taking out Giant breeding stock for glory hunts/fish.

Really...

[King Crush]

If you don't give them a chance to grow, how will you ever know how big it was going to get?
Very true!:D

[jamieo]

But what's happening for us now, is that the people who live in these "Wild Area's." have learned better management of natural resources... Unfortunately the people who come from the Urban areas, especially those who were raised by that same generation that raped the resources... Those guys are spoiling a lot of stuff with their uneducated practices...




I agree ... also, I really hate when I hear the average person talking about "natural areas". Most often, a "natural area" to them is a park like setting with trees, wild flowers and song birds chirping away. A truly natural area has those things but it also has ticks, snakes, spiders, poison oak, etc, haha. It's not always a totally picturesque setting.

I was listening to a woman protesting a city removing some older trees to make room for sewer construction (in a newly contstructed neighborhood she was moving into). She wanted the trees to be there for the birds and went on to talk about how much she loved nature and wanted that area to remain "natural". A few sentences later she was complaning about deer spreading ticks and eating plants and said they should all be exterminated. It just makes me wonder what it would take to truly educate the average person about what "nature" really is and what it isn't.

I think I am getting a little off-topic, however. :D

[jamieo]

I agree that you should use the animal for meat, unless of course it has CWD. But you can still use all of the meat even if you stuff the animal and put it on the wall.

True, and I don't have a problem with that. I just don't like the idea of killing an animal and taking only it's head/horns/feet whatever and leaving the rest to rot. Of course, haha, one could say that the rest does get put to some use- buzzards and other carrion feeders do need to eat also. But now, I am arguing with myself :)

[King Crush]

I also heard that the young bucks do most of the reproducing, so if you kill all them less deer for the future.

That just pisses me off when someone shots a little spike buck, that buck could of grown into a monster.:(

Yes, doe meat does taste better, but not that much better. I would rather have a trophy hanging up on my wall with more meat in my frezzer, than shooting a doe. Remember the does are the reproducers, if everyone shot the does there would be NO DEER around. It only takes one buck to inpregenate lots of does.

I just wish people wouldn't get so trigger happy, and shoot the first buck in sight.

Here is a great phrase, when it comes to hunting for a trophy buck:

Good things come to he who waits... But only what's left over by those who got there first!:D

Everyone if you see a small buck control your index fingure, and don't pull the trigger, let the young bucks mate, eat, get big, and try to find a monster out there. In a few years those young bucks might be some record bucks.:D I almost shoot a small buck, but I waited, and ran into a monster, in the end it all paid off. And I was so happy at my self, that I controlled my right index fingure!:)

[Budweiser]

I also heard that the young bucks do most of the reproducing, so if you kill all them less deer for the future.

That just pisses me off when someone shots a little spike buck, that buck could of grown into a monster.:(

Yes, doe meat does taste better, but not that much better. I would rather have a trophy hanging up on my wall with more meat in my frezzer, than shooting a doe. Remember the does are the reproducers, if everyone shot the does there would be NO DEER around. It only takes one buck to inpregenate lots of does.

I just wish people wouldn't get so trigger happy, and shoot the first buck in sight.

Here is a great phrase, when it comes to hunting for a trophy buck:

Good things come to he who waits... But only what's left over by those who got there first!:D

Everyone if you see a small buck control your index fingure, and don't pull the trigger, let the young bucks mate, eat, get big, and try to find a monster out there. In a few years those young bucks might be some record bucks.:D I almost shoot a small buck, but I waited, and ran into a monster, in the end it all paid off. And I was so happy at my self, that I controlled my right index fingure!:)

In my area there are so damn many doe it is pathetic. **** last night when I was driving I almost hit a group of 3 deer standing in the road and two off to the other side. They are ****ing thick here and need to be shot.

[Hartski]

The young bucks don't do the mating, it's the monster "Alpha" Bucks that get laid. Same with damn near any animal. It's always the biggest and strongest males that get the females.

[Budweiser]

The young bucks don't do the mating, it's the monster "Alpha" Bucks that get laid. Same with damn near any animal. It's always the biggest and strongest males that get the females.
yep so you need those bucks to grow up big and strong so they can pass on their quality genes :)

[fitnessman]

The young bucks don't do the mating, it's the monster "Alpha" Bucks that get laid. Same with damn near any animal. It's always the biggest and strongest males that get the females.


And people wonder why we lift weights........

[Budweiser]

And people wonder why we lift weights........
so we can spread our seed!

[NuggzTheNinja]

And people wonder why we lift weights........

Girls these days go for flaming 80's-man metrosexual shirt buttons, it's part of the MTV culture.

[Hartski]

yep so you need those bucks to grow up big and strong so they can pass on their quality genes :)

You must not have too many deer where you are. Where I live they are EVERYWHERE, and we need to kill as many as possible just to keep the population under control. There are 8-10 deer on my lawn every evening and sometimes in the morning, too. And there's quite a few monstrous bucks around. They are smart enough to hole up in the state park during hunting season, so no-one ever gets them.

[Budweiser]

You must not have too many deer where you are. Where I live they are EVERYWHERE, and we need to kill as many as possible just to keep the population under control. There are 8-10 deer on my lawn every evening and sometimes in the morning, too. And there's quite a few monstrous bucks around. They are smart enough to hole up in the state park during hunting season, so no-one ever gets them.
Oh no there are plenty of deer around here. Each hunter can shoot up to 7 deer per season. To me it's not about breeding its just about shooting a nice rack. I'll take as many doe as I can but will save the bucks until they are larger.

[One More Time]

I feel that is wrong. You are not giving them a chance to mature and produce other large bucks. So in a sense you are actually loosing meat my shooting the small bucks and not letting them get big so you have large bucks to eat.

Right now there are alot of small buck and not alot of large buck. With a few years of not shooting the small bucks they will mature and there will be a ton of large buck around.


I agree. Yes the small bucks will mature, but the does must be harvested heavy. If you look at all the ranches where people pay to hunt, they have buck/doe ratios of 2/1, 3/1, 4/1 or even more. What that means is that every doe in estrus is going to have several bucks after her. They have heavy doe and cull buck harvests. However, for such a management program to work in a state hunters would have to work together. I personally only shoot what I consider as trophies anymore. If I want meat, I will kill a doe. The problem is that people, as you say, kill the 4 pointer instead of the doe standing right next to him.

[One More Time]

The young bucks don't do the mating, it's the monster "Alpha" Bucks that get laid. Same with damn near any animal. It's always the biggest and strongest males that get the females.


Except for the sneaky ones that slip in while big boy ain't watching....LOL!

[The Experiment]

I'm a liberal and I support hunting and fishing to a logical degree.

I live in the country. We have a nice garden planted. Then some ass hole deer and rabbits start eating some of our fruit tree leaves and gnaw at the bark. So we put tinfoil around the base of the tree. Gets rid of the rabbit problem but not the deer. We have to shoot the deer or get an electric fence.

The truth is that in that part of the country, there's an excess of deer with not a whole lot of food. So we see a lot of skinny, starving deer that roam around and the alpha bucks obviously are well fed. So by killing deer, we're improving the lives for all: less deer so we can eat and less deer so the remaining deer can eat.

I do not support hunting endangered animals or animals for sport. There needs to be some necessity to it, some purpose.

[fitnessman]

I do not support hunting endangered animals or animals for sport. There needs to be some necessity to it, some purpose.

Noone who considers themselves a Sportsman would.

Selective harvest is what it is all about.

[King Crush]

About what I heard, about the younger smaller bucks doing most the mating, I did not agree with it at all, that's just what I heard! I'm sure the younger buck are way more hornier, cuz they are tennagers, and there hormones are going crazy like us when we were in our teen years. That's sad the poor young bucks are going around horny all the time, and not gettin' any!:( Man I wish the human world worked like the animal world works, cuz I would be gettin' laid all the time!:)

This is the way the animal world works, always has worked this way, and always will work this way! The Bigger, and Stronger the male is, most likely he's the one that's gonna be gettin' some!:D

I wish the human world worked that way, It would motivate me to workout harder.:D I don't get it, I liked this girl a lot, and she choose me over some skinny 130 lbs kid that probably never touched a weight in his life! If it was the animal world, she would of been mine!:D

[King Crush]

I'm a liberal and I support hunting and fishing to a logical degree.

I live in the country. We have a nice garden planted. Then some ass hole deer and rabbits start eating some of our fruit tree leaves and gnaw at the bark. So we put tinfoil around the base of the tree. Gets rid of the rabbit problem but not the deer. We have to shoot the deer or get an electric fence.

The truth is that in that part of the country, there's an excess of deer with not a whole lot of food. So we see a lot of skinny, starving deer that roam around and the alpha bucks obviously are well fed. So by killing deer, we're improving the lives for all: less deer so we can eat and less deer so the remaining deer can eat.

I do not support hunting endangered animals or animals for sport. There needs to be some necessity to it, some purpose.
So, since your a liberal that pretty much expalins why you negged me in my rabbit huntin' thread!:mad: You get all pissed off that I shoot rabbits, and eat them, but you call the rabbits A$$ holes! I respect the rabbits, I shoot em', than I eat em'! You are messed up man!:mad: So, you shoot the deer, just cuz they get into your garden, do you even eat em'? Or have you ever shoot a deer?

[2bbig]

Oh no there are plenty of deer around here. Each hunter can shoot up to 7 deer per season. To me it's not about breeding its just about shooting a nice rack. I'll take as many doe as I can but will save the bucks until they are larger.

WOW, seven deer per season? Where I am from we can only take 2 and each has to be from a different Region.
I agree with Hartski on several points
1. Meat is meat
2.depending on the winter, the wild game population explodes, with the hunting (poaching) of the wolf population the deer just keep multiplying.
3.The BIG Bucks are Big because they are smart.

I hunt for the meat, with all the chemicals they are now putting into today's beef and commercially produced meats wild game is the only way to go.

[skinnyme]

Tennessee = 3 per day. You are allowed up to 2 antlered with one type of weapon, and another antlered with another type of weapon. The rest of your kills must be antlerless. This is the statewide bag limit, but it is also subject to which unit of the state you hunt in. This bag limit does not include tags drawn for Wildlife Management Areas - those are seperate. It cost me $28 for my hunting/fishing combo, and $18 for my kill tag (which is good for deer, bear, turkey, or boar, in their seasons of course). You shoot up to three deer with the same tag, and when you check them in, they give you another kill tag for the next day. I don't shoot that many deer, but the deer population is so thick here where I live that some of them need to be killed. There isn't a lot of grain farms, so their food supply can run out really easy.
I'm with you FITNESSMAN on the selective hunting and using hunters to manage the wildlife. Hunters not only help with the management, but some states have programs that use hunters to gather information on wildlife activity in their specific hunting areas. This is very helpful to the wildlife agencies for measuring the effectiveness of their programs.
I grew up in Indiana, and I've seen the results of their careful management. The county I'm from has grown into one of the number one producers of large turkey and deer in the state, and the deer population has increased exponentially as well.
I fully support hunting, as well as fishing. What I don't condone is people who poach. I know some do it for food, and I guess if I were hard up and doing all I could do, and my family was starving, I would do what I had to do. But that isn't the case for most people who hunt out of season. And if I ever caught anyone doing it, I would definitly turn them in. This is not only unfair to those who hunt legally, but it is unfair to the wildlife as well. This throws off the numbers and therefore throws the management program out of whack as well. Not to mention that it usually isn't for meat, so that is a waste as well.
And another pet peeve of mine. Know how to use your weapon effectively, and know what the hell you're shooting at before you engage. I can't stand it when people wound animals and have to track them for hundreds of yards. For hunting, I've adopted the military sniper saying, "One shot, one kill." So far that has proven to be a good thing to follow. If you know your weapon, know your target, and line up your shot accurately, then you will avoid injuring your target and causing it undue suffering. That's just my thoughts on it...

[Budweiser]

So, since your a liberal that pretty much expalins why you negged me in my rabbit huntin' thread!:mad: You get all pissed off that I shoot rabbits, and eat them, but you call the rabbits A$$ holes! I respect the rabbits, I shoot em', than I eat em'! You are messed up man!:mad: So, you shoot the deer, just cuz they get into your garden, do you even eat em'? Or have you ever shoot a deer?
So that guy negged you for shooting a rabbit but them he bitches about the rabbits in his yard?

[King Crush]

So that guy negged you for shooting a rabbit but them he bitches about the rabbits in his yard?
Yes, that pu$$y hipcritacal liberal did neg me. Fu*king A$$ hole!:mad:

[PjzBoozer]

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[insomniac23]

grtngunmjtimkvmkjmvkjmjingtjnvijgmvjk
thanks for bumping a thread from 2006...dick