soy vs. whey protein

[Rkatect]

A friend just gave me some EAS Advantage soy protein and I wanted to know what the major differences are besides milk vs soy? Tried a search but didn't really find anything. Any help would be appreciated. Also wanted to know if anyone really uses soy protein?

[armz_ha]

soy protein does help with fat loss if you're cutting!

[EgOtRiPpiN]

I thought soy was $hit..... from what I know about it, it only benefits women??

[RideDaLightin]

I thought soy was $hit..... from what I know about it, it only benefits women??

Heard the same as well. I read somewhere that it is actually detrimental to men because it increases estrogen levels. I'm not sure though I could be mistaken.

[drugzkill]

A friend just gave me some EAS Advantage soy protein and I wanted to know what the major differences are besides milk vs soy? Tried a search but didn't really find anything. Any help would be appreciated. Also wanted to know if anyone really uses soy protein?

Anyone that takes soy protien is doing their body a large injustice.

Soy protien conatins estrogen properties known as xenoestrogens. These estrogens cause water retention and bloating.

Soy protien also contains protien blockers! Yes, I said Protien blockers. This is one protien that blocks protien!

Remember not all food is created equal and people lose sight of that when they are consuming protiens. They think the more the better no matter what. This isnt always true.

I say stick with the whey, not unless you want to risk losing gains, retarding future gains, retaining water, and possibly enducing gynomastia to a certain level.

[SupremeDan]

Anyone that takes soy protien is doing their body a large injustice.

Soy protien conatins estrogen properties known as xenoestrogens. These estrogens cause water retention and bloating.

Soy protien also contains protien blockers! Yes, I said Protien blockers. This is one protien that blocks protien!

Remember not all food is created equal and people lose sight of that when they are consuming protiens. They think the more the better no matter what. This isnt always true.

I say stick with the whey, not unless you want to risk losing gains, retarding future gains, retaining water, and possibly enducing gynomastia to a certain level.

miths , miths miths..........shhhhhhhh

soy protein is aswome.......it actually has anti -estrogens properties....but believe in whatever you wanna believe....

[JamesToney]

Anyone that takes soy protien is doing their body a large injustice.

Soy protien conatins estrogen properties known as xenoestrogens. These estrogens cause water retention and bloating.

Soy protien also contains protien blockers! Yes, I said Protien blockers. This is one protien that blocks protien!

Remember not all food is created equal and people lose sight of that when they are consuming protiens. They think the more the better no matter what. This isnt always true.

I say stick with the whey, not unless you want to risk losing gains, retarding future gains, retaining water, and possibly enducing gynomastia to a certain level.

ahahahhahahah protein blockers ahahhahahahahhahahaha

You've got to love the psuedo-science of some of the members here.

[PowerSwede]

Anyone that takes soy protien is doing their body a large injustice.

Soy protien conatins estrogen properties known as xenoestrogens. These estrogens cause water retention and bloating.

Soy protien also contains protien blockers! Yes, I said Protien blockers. This is one protien that blocks protien!

Remember not all food is created equal and people lose sight of that when they are consuming protiens. They think the more the better no matter what. This isnt always true.

I say stick with the whey, not unless you want to risk losing gains, retarding future gains, retaining water, and possibly enducing gynomastia to a certain level.

I have no idea what soy protien is but i have more than 100 studies on soy protein that says otherwise.

Do a search for soy protein and my name, i posted ~30 of them in one thread.

[armz_ha]

miths , miths miths..........shhhhhhhh

soy protein is aswome.......it actually has anti -estrogens properties....but believe in whatever you wanna believe....
soy protein is good in moderation.

[drugzkill]

ahahahhahahah protein blockers ahahhahahahahhahahaha

You've got to love the psuedo-science of some of the members here.

Yes blocks protien. Glad to see that you can laugh at me, when you know absolutely nothing of science.

Want some science here ya go:

"Soy products contain:

* Phytoestrogens: (isoflavones) genistein and daidzein, which mimic and sometimes block the hormone estrogen
* Phytates: which block the body's uptake of minerals
* Enzyme Inhibitors: which hinder protein digestion
* Haemaggluttin: which causes red blood cells to clump together and inhibits oxygen take-up and growth. "

"Perhaps the most disturbing of soy's ill effects on health has to do with its phytoestrogens that can mimic the effects of the female hormone estrogen. These phytoestrogens have been found to have adverse effects on various human tissues, and drinking even two glasses of soy milk daily for one month has enough of the chemical to alter a woman's menstrual cycle."

"Pediatricians are reporting more and more cases of emasculated boys reaching puberty with breasts and tiny penises. Undescended testicles are also far more common than they were in the past."

"Remember too that soy estrogens damage far more than the reproductive system. The thyroid is usually hurt first, leading to loss of energy, weight gain, depression, lethargy, and a host of other symptoms.

In mature adults soy lowers testosterone and sperm production in males and increases fat deposits in most females. Almost every soy product available (soy protein products too) contains phytoestrogens. (Supplemental bitch status. Yikes!)"

- http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/author25.htm

Here is a roundatable discussion on protien:
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/berardi77.htm

Hey JamesToney if you have trouble understanding all of that, I'll help dumb it down for ya sometime with some pseudo-science

[bofeity]

My premier protein bars have some soy isolate in them (2nd after calcium caseinate though)... those sons of bit*ches!

[toughnuts]

Hey JamesToney if you have trouble understanding all of that, I'll help dumb it down for ya sometime with some pseudo-science
He got owned:D!

[kendog]

I hear it's good for post menopausal women. I don't see why it would be worth taking at all. It's not like it's really cheap. There is a huge variety of good proteins out there besides soy, you can have it.

[kbickham]

miths , miths miths..........shhhhhhhh

soy protein is aswome.......it actually has anti -estrogens properties....but believe in whatever you wanna believe....

first off, no it does not. and soy is not a complete protein, so no it is NOT awesome

[Zirus]

Stay away from Soy.......he's right, it has Protein Blockers. Do your research.

Whey is the only way to go.

[Black_Spit]

first off, no it does not. and soy is not a complete protein, so no it is NOT awesome
Soy IS a complete protein(among the only complete proteins from vegetable sources) and has among the highest concentration of glutamine of any protein source(save hydrolized wheat... an incomplete protein). Soy is fine, and a great protein for vegan vegeterians. Bill Pearl used soy protein... as did other bodybuilders of their time. Damn shame what that estrogen did to his championship physique, lol.

For the average bb'er though, go with whey, milk, egg protein powders etc...

[Maki_Man]

Why do so many people think whey is the "only" choice? Each protein has its benefits and applications. My philosophy is to use the right protein(s) for the job.

[irish evolution]

Soy is not a complete protein. It does not contain a full amino acid profile. Guys, do some searching through pubmed.com and look over at t-nation that has actually done the soy bad vs. good using documented, peer reviewed research.

[Pooh Bear]

Soy is the cause for tiny wee wee's?

Well, I guess that explains a lot about the Japanese.

[italianbencher]

Heard the same as well. I read somewhere that it is actually detrimental to men because it increases estrogen levels. I'm not sure though I could be mistaken.

It does. When a girl looses their ovaries, due to cancer or w/e the doctors ALWAYS say take soy pills, drink soy milk, eat soy beans ect ect. It is because it produces estrogen. So if you are a male taking soy, I would stop.
But just my 2 cents.

[toughnuts]

http://www.t-nation.com/findArticle.do?article=185soy

[MrMel]

Holy Crap!
I read that article!

This sucks cuz right now I eat about 2/3 cup of roasted soy nuts everyday for the protein(28g) and fiber(8g)...then I eat about 1 cup of silken tofu. This stuff keeps me regular and takes good.

When I lost about 90 lbs a year ago, i had tofu everyday as well!

[punkdave]

Hahaha, some of this stuff is funny. Shrinkage? Depression?

I've been eating lots of soy protein since I started being a vegetarian about 5 years ago. That was back when I was 15. I have noticed none of these side-effects yet to date. No "breast growth", no stunting of growth (if you know what I mean), and no depression (I'm happier now than I've been).

Maybe I'm just not part of the small percentage that experiences those side-effects, but everything you eat has a chance of being bad for you.

[irish evolution]

The fact is that soy reduces testosterone levels in men. Here is a peer reviewed article from pubmed.com

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=15735098

There are more...do the research and come to your own conclusion.

[bigmcg]

I am reading a lot of back and forth arguements saying it's good and bad. What is the real deal? Since the Atkins craze, a lot of High Protein products have emerged on the market. Hell, we don't even need to go to a supp store, we can just go to Wal-Mart. Through my research, I have found that 90% of the bars out there have Soy Protein on them, in some way or the other. I am on a budget, so it's hard to spend the money on many of the popular name brands. If I eat say one or two of these bars a day, with the soy, am I hurting or helping myself. Right now I am around 205 and am trying to cut down to around 185-190. I need to use bars or shakes to supplement my diet because I am deployed to Iraq. While I was home on leave I picked up some bars that have a mix of Whey and Soy, and some that just have Whey. Unfortunately, money is a deciding factor in the products I buy. Can someone please give me the real deal answer. Is soy okay in moderation for men? Does it hurt your gains?

Thanks Everyone,
BM

[BringnIt]

Yes it's ok for you, a lot of what we do is just splitting hairs. Just get enough total protein and you'll be fine.

[Andrew69]

Whey is the only way to go.
Actually, if I had to pick one protein it would be casein, but thats for another thread.

[BringnIt]

I'd go with egg, then casein, then whey. If I only had to pick one, that is. But fortunately I don't.

[LiftingIsLife]

let's hear some discussion on egg protein, since thats the one i prefer....

well??

-lifer

[cakedonkey]

The BEST protein is actually a blend of all three (whey/egg/casein)... they all have their own beneficial properties. For example, whey is extremely fast absorbing but not very anti-catabolic, where casein is (but casein absorbs much more slowly). And egg is known to be the most complete whole food protein source out there (in terms of an amino acid profile).

[BringnIt]

No one is disputing that--yet--but he said if he had to pick one, so making your own proprietary blend is cheating!

[4amWorkouts]

Guys, we are forgetting the key to all of this - moderation. Soy is a good protein when taken in moderation. It should not be your only source and chances are that no one is taking enough in to block their whey/cassien/egg protein. Just keep it in moderation, as it will stay in your system the longest which is why it is used in most nightime protein formulas.

For speed of delivery and price, you really can't beat whey. But speed is also the draw back as you can go catabolic quicker on straight whey...

[hyndu113]

The BEST protein is actually a blend of all three (whey/egg/casein)... they all have their own beneficial properties. For example, whey is extremely fast absorbing but not very anti-catabolic, where casein is (but casein absorbs much more slowly). And egg is known to be the most complete whole food protein source out there (in terms of an amino acid profile).

Exactly, I'm glad someone got it right...whey is the fastest digesting, soy is a medium, and caseinate is slow. A blend is the best way. The main difference between whey and soy... whey is in your body for about 1-4 hrs, soy - about 3-8 hrs. Thats why you shouldn't use it after a workout...your muscles need protein fast and soy is going to take a few hours to deliver.