Derek A Question

[n0 liMitZ]

Hi, I am a 16 year old bodybuilder at 175. I want to go up to 200-215 pounds but I don't have a good bulking diet. Is there any ways you could give me yours? I would really appreciate it. I will take creatine/whey protien.

[Beast]

Tell me what time you wake-up, workout, and go to bed, and I will make you one.

[n0 liMitZ]

Yes! Thank you so much.

During a regular day Monday-Friday I wake up at 7:05. Then, I have my first two class periods I am willing to bring protien/creatine to school along with food for in between classes.

I eat breakfast right when I get up which is 7:05. I leave for school around 8:00. My first period class starts at 8:30 ends at 9:45. Then, I go to my second period class 9:50 - 11:05. That is lunch time, then I have lunch until 12:00 and start my third period class at 12:05 - 1:10. And then My forth period class 1:10-2:30.

I ride my bike to school and back usually. I work out at 6:00 P.M each night and go to bed at 10:00 each night I don't usually get back until 9-10 from the gym.

So to sum it up it basically goes like this:

Wake up: 7:05
Go to school: 8:00
1st Period: 8:30 - 9:45
2nd Period: 9:50 - 11:05
Lunch: 11:05 - 12:00
3rd Period: 12:05 - 1:10
4th Period: 1:10 - 2:30

After that you can set specific times on when to eat after school.

Please remember I will take creatine and protien powder so please add them into the diet. I will take as much food as possible to school and eat it even if it is in class

I am not a vegitarian I am willing to drink eat whites, eat tuna out of the can the whole deal. Just tell me the food I will buy it and eat it.

On weekends, just tell me the times to get up I will probably go to bed at 11 - 12 and get up around 9-10.

I really appreciate you doing this. Thanks a lot man.

[c_rood]

no limitz- i know this thread is directed towards derek, but from reading it i couldn't help to mention something,, i don't know if i read it wrong or it was a typo. but you said you went to workout at 6, and didn't get home till 9 or 10? so let me know if i'm wrong,, but that is 3-4 hours of training? there is no reason your training should last that long. if this is the case, overtraining may be your main problem for not gaining size

[Harland]

From the time i leave my house to the time i get back it is like 1:15 or 1:30 and i time each workout and then all are around 40 minutes long. Some times you spend time driving to the gym, hanging around the gym and stuff like that.

[sword chucks]

n0 limitz, why do you work out so late?

[n0 liMitZ]

I live right beside the gym :p And I do more than one body part. For bulking I am going to slow it down a bit and spread it out more.

6:00 is late? Its because I have school till 3 and I like to eat before I go.

[sword chucks]

I dont mean that 6 is late, but its easy to get distracted by stuff in the 3 hours before you hit the gym. I always work out right after school because Im pretty much a machine at that time- I am always really focused right after a day of school.

But its best to do what works for you. I was just wondering.

[Budha01]

Originally posted by sword chucks
I dont mean that 6 is late, but its easy to get distracted by stuff in the 3 hours before you hit the gym. I always work out right after school because Im pretty much a machine at that time- I am always really focused right after a day of school.

But its best to do what works for you. I was just wondering. That's the same for me. I do it right after school and that's the way I like it most.

[Heisman]

I usually start my workouts at 7:30 or 8:00 and don't end up finishing to past 9:00 (warmup, stretching afterward), so 6:00 really isn't that bad.

[Fletch]

Here's how I would divide up your day since this is very similar to my typical day at work. :D

Breakfast: 7:05am
Mid-Morning Snack: 9:45am
Lunch: 11:05am-12:00pm
Mid-Afternoon Snack: 2:30pm
Preworkout Meal: 4:30pm
During workout: 6pm
Postworkout: When you get home
Before Bed Meal: 10pm

Given a meso bodytype, I multiplied your bodyweight x 17 = 3,000 calories.

Total Macronutrient Ratio for the day should be around...

Calories: 3,000
Protein: 200g
Carbs: 390g (50g breakfast/ 90g preworkout/60g during/100g post....the other 90g is spread throughout the other meals.)
Fat: 70g

Derek can help you with the rest....this is just a framework to start from.

- Fletch

[Beast]

That is pretty close to what I PM'ed him.

Nutrient Timing anyone?

[Sp1ke]

Hmm WOuld you make a schedule for me? I know you must be busy with your stuff but couldnt resist asking........


Just turned 17, Bulked from 130 to 160 in 6 months , Im 5"7 and around 13%bf.

Wake up at 5:45am

leave for school at 7:00am
school lunch at 12:05pm
come from school at 3:00pm

Go to gym around 7:30/8:00pm to 9:30pm (two muscle groups per day, take that long coz sometimes i have to wait for equipment or doing max-ot rest)

I take whey protein, creatine and green tea :)


edit: im trying to lower bf right now and then back to bulk

[MAVEN]

30lbs in 6 monthes , good job , u seem to already be on the right track

[The Apocalypse]

Originally posted by sword chucks
I dont mean that 6 is late, but its easy to get distracted by stuff in the 3 hours before you hit the gym. I always work out right after school because Im pretty much a machine at that time- I am always really focused right after a day of school.

But its best to do what works for you. I was just wondering.

Yeah I workout Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, and Friday. And I like to train either in the morning or late at night like at around 7-8. My favorite time is at the nighttime because it's dark out and the gym is nearly empty. So me and my training partner just tear it up in there. We train legs at night always because the guy at the gym blasts the music real loud for us during heavy squats.

[lucubration]

Originally posted by Beast
That is pretty close to what I PM'ed him.

Nutrient Timing anyone?

What the **** is this?

I thought this was a forum. LMAO

This guy really kisses his own ass :D
This is so people will pay him for "expert" advice?

[Beast]

Originally posted by lucubration
What the **** is this?

I thought this was a forum. LMAO

This guy really kisses his own ass :D
This is so people will pay him for "expert" advice?

Hello? I made him a routine and PM'ed it to him. It was a routine FOR HIM.

[Wheelies]

Originally posted by Fletch
Here's how I would divide up your day since this is very similar to my typical day at work. :D

Breakfast: 7:05am
Mid-Morning Snack: 9:45am
Lunch: 11:05am-12:00pm
Mid-Afternoon Snack: 2:30pm
Preworkout Meal: 4:30pm
During workout: 6pm
Postworkout: When you get home
Before Bed Meal: 10pm



I think he needs alot more carbs after working out, he should be taking in at least 3 small meals all within 3 hours after working out, lots of carbs, Im not going to debate whether they should be low GI or high GI, but all I know is that only one postworkout meal, and then only one more meal 3 hours later is not going to be enough carbs.

[str8flexed]

Originally posted by Wheelies
I think he needs alot more carbs after working out, he should be taking in at least 3 small meals all within 3 hours after working out, lots of carbs, Im not going to debate whether they should be low GI or high GI, but all I know is that only one postworkout meal, and then only one more meal 3 hours later is not going to be enough carbs.

why? care to provide some evidence?

[lucubration]

Originally posted by Beast
Hello? I made him a routine and PM'ed it to him. It was a routine FOR HIM.

interesting. I suppose everyone else in this thread must be referring to his alter ego then? and not him....

give me a break.

[str8flexed]

here we go :rolleyes:

[Younglifter14]

Originally posted by str8flexed
why? care to provide some evidence? \

get em :D

[LostProphet]

Originally posted by lucubration
interesting. I suppose everyone else in this thread must be referring to his alter ego then? and not him....

give me a break.


Stop looking for trouble.

[Wheelies]

Originally posted by str8flexed
why? care to provide some evidence?

Sure buddy...

First to start off, I dont know if you misunderstood my comment, sure, you could take in a ton of carbs in one meal , so technically you could take in ENOUGH carbs during this period, but it wouldnt be a steady supply to manage insulin, your insulin levels are just gonna drop again, which isnt good for muscle growth during this period. Would you only take in 2 huge meals a day? Sure you could take in 200 grams of protien per sitting, but this wouldnt be as effecient.

Its pretty much common knowledge that glycogen levels are depleted after intense training sessions. This combined with the fact that cotisol secretion is high should be reason enough to take in some type of carbs for this period. From what Ive researched High Gi carbs are the best for replinishing clycogen levels and shutting off cortisol secretion. Your body is craving nutrients after training, why would you only give it one meal, and then starve it for another 3 hours? Also your glycogen levels are going to be low for the next days training session if they arent restored for this training session.

I personally take in about 4 postworkout "meals" all withing a 3 hour period, I have seen great results and feel much better and fuller(muscle wise) doing this. But he at least needs to take in another carb meal an hour after his first post workout meal to keep his levels steady and make sure all the protien is going to muscle building and not energy restoration.

[Wheelies]

Originally posted by Younglifter14
\

get em :D

Wow, are you kidding me, did you and Fortified Iron break up or something:rolleyes:

[Younglifter14]

Originally posted by Wheelies
Wow, are you kidding me, did you and Fortified Iron break up or something:rolleyes:

who are you again?

[bhman6]

Young, you are acting like a 10yr. old boy who wants his older brother and his friends to beat up a bully because he's afraid to fight him himself.

The reason why you would want to eat sooner after your post workout meal has several reasons.

1.) True, you could combine fast and slow digesting proteins and both low and high GI carbs post workout for both fast and sustained release of nutrients, but the slower digesting nutrients will slow down the absorption of the faster ones, hence less glycogen replenishment and protein synthesis immediately after your workout. This is also too high an amount of nutrients to consume in one sitting. Like Wheelies said, you wouldn't consume 200g protein in one meal would you?

2.) If you eat your fast digesting protein and high GI carbs, they will very quickly be digested and pulled into the muscle. When this happens, blood sugar will soon crash, causing catabolism because the body will utiliize amino acids to further replenish glycogen. Consuming a small solid or liquid meal within an hour after your post workout shake will ensure that protein synthesis rates stay high and blood sugar levels remain stable. This will not only increase glycogen replenishment but will also have an anticatabolic effect because of a steady stream of amino acids to the muscles.

3.) You wouldn't want to consume fast digesting protein and carbs for a normal meal during the day correct? This is because they will empty from the gut at too quick a rate and cause blood sugar crashes and lack of available amino acids.

4.) The best method is to consume both faster and slower digesting proteins and carbs for normal meals as this will ensure the most steady stream of these nutrients into the bloodstream. You don't, however, want to do this post workout because during this time rapid absorption is of utmost importance. During meals, supid rapid digestion isn't the #1 priority.

[nitsux]

I agree with wheelies everything I've read seems to indicate that there should be C/P meal about 1hr after after the PW Shake is consumed. I don't totally understand the science of it but I think it makes sense to keep your body getting carbs after you've worked out.

Also layne is it really neccessary to take in such huge ammounts of carbs in the hour of training, 250g over 1hr seems like a huge ammount to take in. Also what would be the break up of these carbs, simple v. complex? Thanks for your help I appreciate all the input to this thread.

[Younglifter14]

Originally posted by bhman6
Young, you are acting like a 10yr. old boy who wants his older brother and his friends to beat up a bully because he's afraid to fight him himself.

uhh, i don't know if you noticed or not, but it was a joke...

yes you see the ":D" in the post? generally it means someone is not serious

2nd of all, if you been reading mine and wheelies posts towards each other, you see we joke around quite alot.

3rd of all, your the one acting as if you must be there to help your gay lover out when ever you can.

and uh, oh yeh, every single time this "bully(s)" has said something to me, " i have "thrown my fists up to it".

ps i bet it feels great taunting teens over the internet =]

[Wheelies]

Originally posted by Younglifter14
uhh, i don't know if you noticed or not, but it was a joke...

yes you see the ":D" in the post? generally it means someone is not serious

2nd of all, if you been reading mine and wheelies posts towards each other, you see we joke around quite alot.

3rd of all, your the one acting as if you must be there to help your gay lover out when ever you can.

4th of all, i bet it feels great taunting teens over the internet =]

Your right, we had been joking, but the lasts couple posts you have made towards me have been disrespectful. I dont like how everyone takes Laynes advice as "Gospel" around here. He came across like he was the ****. "Got any evidence ya dumbass", obviously he didnt say that, but thats how implied it. He could have just said, "Hey, I dont think you need more carbs, can you explain your logic"

So why if we're all cool now, didnt you say "Get em" to me, do you really think hes right that you dont need to keep glycogen and insulin levels maintained after you workout?

[Younglifter14]

Originally posted by Wheelies
Your right, we had been joking, but the lasts couple posts you have made towards me have been disrespectful. I dont like how everyone takes Laynes advice as "Gospel" around here. He came across like he was the ****. "Got any evidence ya dumbass", obviously he didnt say that, but thats how implied it. He could have just said, "Hey, I dont think you need more carbs, can you explain your logic"

So why if we're all cool now, didnt you say "Get em" to me, do you really think hes right that you dont need to keep glycogen and insulin levels maintained after you workout?

um, please show me the posts :confused: . as far as im concerned i was kidding.

i didn't even see what the convo was about, but once i saw he said something to you, i decided to just say get em as a joke. otherwise I woulda posted something that had to due to carbs with it or something.

You guys call me a baby for liking HST but you guys get upset when I say get em? lol.

[str8flexed]

Originally posted by Wheelies
Sure buddy...

First to start off, I dont know if you misunderstood my comment, sure, you could take in a ton of carbs in one meal , so technically you could take in ENOUGH carbs during this period, but it wouldnt be a steady supply to manage insulin, your insulin levels are just gonna drop again, which isnt good for muscle growth during this period. Would you only take in 2 huge meals a day? Sure you could take in 200 grams of protien per sitting, but this wouldnt be as effecient.

Its pretty much common knowledge that glycogen levels are depleted after intense training sessions. This combined with the fact that cotisol secretion is high should be reason enough to take in some type of carbs for this period. From what Ive researched High Gi carbs are the best for replinishing clycogen levels and shutting off cortisol secretion. Your body is craving nutrients after training, why would you only give it one meal, and then starve it for another 3 hours? Also your glycogen levels are going to be low for the next days training session if they arent restored for this training session.

I personally take in about 4 postworkout "meals" all withing a 3 hour period, I have seen great results and feel much better and fuller(muscle wise) doing this. But he at least needs to take in another carb meal an hour after his first post workout meal to keep his levels steady and make sure all the protien is going to muscle building and not energy restoration.

well i think multiple meals post workout is advantagous but not b/c your body can't absorb large amount of food efficently. Rather b/c small meals manage blood glucose better, especially when dealing with high glycemic carbs. However, I used to think (like you) that protein would be better absorbed if evenly distributed over several meals, however every study I've come across on pub med has indicated that this is just not the case and the number of meals makes no difference in nitrogen retention and metabolic rate.
-Layne

[Wheelies]

Originally posted by Younglifter14
um, please show me the posts :confused: . as far as im concerned i was kidding.

i didn't even see what the convo was about, but once i saw he said something to you, i decided to just say get em as a joke. otherwise I woulda posted something that had to due to carbs with it or something.

You guys call me a baby for liking HST but you guys get upset when I say get em? lol.

Well, you should have read the posts first then. I was very suprised that Layne disagreed with me, alot of points that he makes I agree with, like the whole HIIT arguement he had with Bob Chick.

When did we call you a baby for liking HST?

[Younglifter14]

Originally posted by Wheelies
Well, you should have read the posts first then. I was very suprised that Layne disagreed with me, alot of points that he makes I agree with, like the whole HIIT arguement he had with Bob Chick.

When did we call you a baby for liking HST?

go back to the HST/max-ot thread. I was a baby/kid for being misinformed about HST.

and I don't want to argue in derek's sub forum either. so if you got offended from that, then grow up

[str8flexed]

Originally posted by Wheelies
Well, you should have read the posts first then. I was very suprised that Layne disagreed with me, alot of points that he makes I agree with, like the whole HIIT arguement he had with Bob Chick.

When did we call you a baby for liking HST?

didn't nessecarily disagree with you... just wanted to hear your rational behind it.

[Wheelies]

Originally posted by str8flexed
didn't nessecarily disagree with you... just wanted to hear your rational behind it.

Well, maybe you should try and come off better next time, I took it as you though I was a dumbass for thinking that.

Here is a pubmed search I did via the AST site, it seems to imply that multiple meals post workout rich in medium to high Gi carbs is best...

http://www4.infotrieve.com/newmedline/detail.asp?NameID=14971430&Session=&searchQuery=post+workout&count=11

[Wheelies]

Originally posted by Younglifter14
go back to the HST/max-ot thread. I was a baby/kid for being misinformed about HST.

and I don't want to argue in derek's sub forum either. so if you got offended from that, then grow up

This thread is worthless anyways, some kid asked exactly what Derek didnt want to do anymore, give complete eating and training advice out for free, so I dont think he would mind.

I dont think you are misinformed about HST, I think you are misinformed about Max OT. You layed out blanket statements and assumed you knew everything. But anyways, im not gonna start that whole HST vs. Max OT thing again, fi you notice, those kids are still going on about it. I have stayed out of it. And just so you know, my next bulking cycle, Im probably going to try one of these periodization programs like HSt or DFHT.

[Younglifter14]

Originally posted by Wheelies
This thread is worthless anyways, some kid asked exactly what Derek didnt want to do anymore, give complete eating and training advice out for free, so I dont think he would mind.

I dont think you are misinformed about HST, I think you are misinformed about Max OT. You layed out blanket statements and assumed you knew everything. But anyways, im not gonna start that whole HST vs. Max OT thing again, fi you notice, those kids are still going on about it. I have stayed out of it. And just so you know, my next bulking cycle, Im probably going to try one of these periodization programs like HSt or DFHT.

I'm not going to bother looking through the HST/max-ot thread. I meant misinformed in a sense that you guys thought I was misinformed thinking HST was the best and everything else was crap. But if you look at the thread and my posts, you'll see its not the case.

If it was worthless I dont see how the:


10yr. old boy who wants his older brother and his friends to beat up a bully because he's afraid to fight him himself.

and


did you and Fortified Iron break up or something:rolleyes:[

came up against me

but as I said earlier im done with this post.

[Wheelies]

Originally posted by str8flexed
well i think multiple meals post workout is advantagous but not b/c your body can't absorb large amount of food efficently. Rather b/c small meals manage blood glucose better, especially when dealing with high glycemic carbs. However, I used to think (like you) that protein would be better absorbed if evenly distributed over several meals, however every study I've come across on pub med has indicated that this is just not the case and the number of meals makes no difference in nitrogen retention and metabolic rate.
-Layne

DOnt get me wrong, Im not in the school of thought that "your body can only absorb 30 grams of protien per sitting". If this was true, then the big 250-300lb boys would have to eat 20 meals a day. But there has to be a cut off point, do you have any links to any studies that show that your body can utilize extreme amounts(200 grams) of protien at one sitting?

[nitsux]

Either of you who can answer my question about the 250g of carbs in 1hr pre/during/post, it just seems like a huge amount and I want to know the breakdown complex/simple and quite honestly how you would ingest such a large amount of carbs in 1 hour, I can't imagine any of it would be whole foods. At the moment i'm cutting and I only eat 180g of carbs for the whole day :O

[str8flexed]

Originally posted by Wheelies
DOnt get me wrong, Im not in the school of thought that "your body can only absorb 30 grams of protien per sitting". If this was true, then the big 250-300lb boys would have to eat 20 meals a day. But there has to be a cut off point, do you have any links to any studies that show that your body can utilize extreme amounts(200 grams) of protien at one sitting?

Br J Nutr 1997 Apr;77 Suppl 1:S57-70

Meal frequency and energy balance.

Bellisle F, McDevitt R, Prentice AM.

Several epidemiological studies have observed an inverse relationship
between people's habitual frequency of eating and body weight,
leading to the suggestion that a 'nibbling' meal pattern may help in
the avoidance of obesity. A review of all pertinent studies shows
that, although many fail to find any significant relationship, the
relationship is consistently inverse in those that do observe a
relationship. However, this finding is highly vulnerable to the
probable confounding effects of post hoc changes in dietary patterns
as a consequence of weight gain and to dietary under-reporting which
undoubtedly invalidates some of the studies. We conclude that the
epidemiological evidence is at best very weak, and almost certainly
represents an artefact. A detailed review of the possible mechanistic
explanations for a metabolic advantage of nibbling meal patterns
failed to reveal significant benefits in respect of energy
expenditure. Although some short-term studies suggest that the
thermic effect of feeding is higher when an isoenergetic test load is
divided into multiple small meals, other studies refute this, and
most are neutral. More importantly, studies using whole-body
calorimetry and doubly-labelled water to assess total 24 h energy
expenditure find no difference between nibbling and gorging. Finally,
with the exception of a single study, there is no evidence that
weight loss on hypoenergetic regimens is altered by meal frequency.
We conclude that any effects of meal pattern on the regulation of
body weight are likely to be mediated through effects on the food
intake side of the energy balance equation.

============================================

Int J Obes Relat Metab Disord 1993 Jan;17(1):31-6

Frequency of feeding, weight reduction and energy metabolism.

Verboeket-van de Venne WP, Westerterp KR.

Department of Human Biology, University of Limburg, Maastricht, The
Netherlands.

A study was conducted to investigate the effect of feeding frequency
on the rate and composition of weight loss and 24 h energy metabolism
in moderately obese women on a 1000 kcal/day diet. During four
consecutive weeks fourteen female adults (age 20-58 years, BMI 25.4-
34.9 kg/m2) restricted their food intake to 1000 kcal/day. Seven
subjects consumed the diet in two meals daily (gorging pattern), the
others consumed the diet in three to five meals (nibbling pattern).
Body mass and body composition, obtained by deuterium dilution, were
measured at the start of the experiment and after two and four weeks
of dieting. Sleeping metabolic rate (SMR) was measured at the same
time intervals using a respiration chamber. At the end of the
experiment 24 h energy expenditure (24 h EE) and diet-induced
thermogenesis (DIT) were assessed by a 36 h stay in the respiration
chamber. There was no significant effect of the feeding frequency on
the rate of weight loss, fat mass loss or fat-free mass loss.
Furthermore, fat mass and fat-free mass contributed equally to weight
loss in subjects on both gorging and nibbling diet. Feeding frequency
had no significant effect on SMR after two or four weeks of dieting.
The decrease in SMR after four weeks was significantly greater in
subjects on the nibbling diet. 24 h EE and DIT were not significantly
different between the two feeding regimens.

============================================

Int J Obes Relat Metab Disord 1995 Jan;19(1):11-6

Food intake and energy expenditure in obese female bingers and non-
bingers.

Alger S, Seagle H, Ravussin E.

Clinical Diabetes and Nutrition Section, National Institute of
Diabetes and Digestive and Kidney Diseases, National Institutes of
Health, Phoenix, Arizona 85016, USA.

Since compulsive eating occurs in approximately 30% of obese females
and is associated with earlier relapse following weight loss, we
compared daily energy intake, dietary composition and energy
expenditure among obese binge eaters and obese non-bingers. Nine
obese bingers (33 +/- 4 yrs, 95 +/- 6 kg, 39 +/- 1% fat) and nine
obese non-bingers (47 +/- 3 yrs, 93 +/- 5 kg, 40 +/- 1% fat) were
admitted for 12 days to a metabolic unit. Binge eaters were defined
as scoring > 25 on the binge eating scale (BES). During the initial 8
days, subjects ate ad libitum from two computerized vending machines
offering a variety of foods and beverages. A weight maintenance diet
was then provided for the next 4 days. Twenty-four hour energy
expenditure (24EE) and respiratory quotient (24Q) were measured on
the last day of both feeding periods in a respiratory chamber. Obese
bingers showed a wider range of energy intake compared to non-
bingers, but the mean daily energy intake was similar between the two
groups (2587 +/- 454 vs 2386 +/- 201 kcal/d) during 8 days of ad
libitum intake. 24EE was not different between bingers and non-
bingers after 8 days of ad libitum intake (2298 +/- 147 vs 2109 +/-
97 kcal/d, P = 0.3) or 4 days of weight maintenance diet, even more
so after adjustment for differences in fat-free mass, fat mass and
age. Resting metabolic rate, sleeping metabolic rate, and
macronutrient intake and oxidation were also similar between groups.


I would recommend following this link and reading this thread... some very good discussion here

http://forum.avantlabs.com/?act=ST&f=12&t=1083&hl=meal+frequency&

[Wheelies]

Originally posted by nitsux
Either of you who can answer my question about the 250g of carbs in 1hr pre/during/post, it just seems like a huge amount and I want to know the breakdown complex/simple and quite honestly how you would ingest such a large amount of carbs in 1 hour, I can't imagine any of it would be whole foods. At the moment i'm cutting and I only eat 180g of carbs for the whole day :O

You should try to ingest .5 g of carbs per kilogram of body weight immediately post workout. Then you should follow this up with a whole food meal 30 minutes later. So unless you weigh a whole lot, 250g in 1 hr is pretty much overkill IMHO. Thats alot of peoples toatl intake per day of carbs. But a large percentage of your carbs should be in the 3 hours post workout. Go on the AST site and research nutrien timing.

[Wheelies]

Originally posted by str8flexed


I would recommend following this link and reading this thread... some very good discussion here

http://forum.avantlabs.com/?act=ST&f=12&t=1083&hl=meal+frequency&


Thanks for the studies and link. The one study was kind of stupid though in my opinion, obviously anyone on a 1000 calorie a day diet is gonna lose significant weight, unless they only weigh 80lbs. So if you broke it up into 5 meals, or 2 meals, it would be hard to determine which one was a better method. I dont know, maybe I misinterperited it.

[str8flexed]

Originally posted by Wheelies
Thanks for the studies and link. The one study was kind of stupid though in my opinion, obviously anyone on a 1000 calorie a day diet is gonna lose significant weight, unless they only weigh 80lbs. So if you broke it up into 5 meals, or 2 meals, it would be hard to determine which one was a better method. I dont know, maybe I misinterperited it.

keep in mind these are sedentary individuals and the big thing being that the rate of fat loss was no different in either group

[Wheelies]

Didnt read the whole Avant link, and probably wont until tommorow,but one thing I did pickup in the first few paragraphs was this quote:

"Next, how would humans progress through evolution if protein broke down after a few hours of not eating it? Our muscle endured and adapted to long periods of famine. We don't become catabolic on an hourly basis, this happens on a larger scale."

Yes, normal humans dont become catabolic, but weight training individuals are a whole other ball game...

[str8flexed]

Originally posted by Wheelies
Didnt read the whole Avant link, and probably wont until tommorow,but one thing I did pickup in the first few paragraphs was this quote:

"Next, how would humans progress through evolution if protein broke down after a few hours of not eating it? Our muscle endured and adapted to long periods of famine. We don't become catabolic on an hourly basis, this happens on a larger scale."

Yes, normal humans dont become catabolic, but weight training individuals are a whole other ball game...

then do some searching around and see if you can find some evidence to support your belief :)

[Beast]

It's good to see things have become civil. I think there is some good discussion going on here. Let's keeping it rolling politely.