Best way to retain new muscle after cycle

[MentalMuscle]

I like the response I have recieved from my last post, everyone has been very helpful thank you... So my next question would be in your opinions or from experince.....what is the best way to retain your newly gain muscle after a cycle???? I have read that clen. can work as a great anticatabolic, and the key is to raise your natural levels of test up to retain muscle and peformance.... Any help would be great!! thanks

[RetiredMod]

1) Keep protein intake high

2) Keep calories high (clean if possible to avoid fat gain)

3) Lower training volume somewhat, but dont stop working out, maybe take an extra day or so off the first few weeks of post cycle

4) Still stick with low reps high weight and fairly low volume

5) Creatine, 5-10g per day

6) Glutamine 10-20g per day

7) HCG (huge difference IMO in post cycle recovery)

8) Clomid, nolvadex

9) Lots of sleep

10) Avoid alcohol, and other recreational drugs (especially drugs like mdma, coke, speed, ritalin, adderall, etc. although if hopefully this isnt even an issue with you, but I figured I'd mention it).

11) Avoid much cardio

12) Don't let yourself go very long without a meal (always include protein in that meal whether it be from food or a shake...food is always better though)

13) Take ZMA on a nightly basis. This difference is prob minor but isn't a bad idea as I find I get a better night sleep on it, and insufficient zinc in one's diet can cause low testosterone levels.

I know some say clen is useful for anticatabolic purposes post cycle, but I've never used it personally so I won't comment on its effectiveness.

[furmanranger]

using winstrol at the end of a cycle. ie, a 10 week cycle of Test E and EQ, run winn weeks 7-12. helps solidify gains imo

[Pirate50]

bump what bain said...but you know ive been ending my cycles with stanabols(winny) that seems to help keep gains. i started at 205 before my second cycle, and had to cut short at 5 wks because i had to go out of state. But in the 5wks i managed to gain 20lbs (dbols me thinks), and kept 10 of it. Weigh in at heavy 215 now and only about 9% bf

[RetiredMod]

good point, it is always best if running long esters to run a short ester at the end (not tren though, as tren towards the end of cycles usually makes recovery harder) past the long ester so you can go right into post cycle. Basically the goal being as little time in between last shot/last pill of AAS and the start of post cycle recovery.

winny is a good choice though because it is a very mild AAS in terms of its affect on HTPA, plus it'll help you lean out a bit at the end (get rid of some water retention, etc.)

[MentalMuscle]

very good, as with my 1st question.... I am very pleased with th responses you guys have given me...thanks, I am pretty sure i'm all set but as they say, its best to hear opinions from others.... As far as post recovery goes, I don't drink or do drugs.....it's seems pointless to work hard at achieving my goals to waste it on cheap thrills.... anyways, I am a competitive bodybuilder ready to step up my game at a national level...... So your opinions are very helpfull..thanks again! I like the idea glutamine, creatine and sleep...that will be a piece of cake for me to do! I guess sometimes common sense is the answer to many of my own questions!

[StillWorkin]

Should you use Nolva, Clomid, and HCG after doing Test and Deca stack?

[Big Vince]

damn, mcbain pretty much summed up everything... great post bro!

-big vince

[THEWOLVERINE]

McBain hit it on the head.

Also, like mentioned above, clen works good as well.

[raybravo]

yep , he pretty much covered it all :) , jobless biatch :D :)
and yes , ephedrine/clen is useful , beta agonism in the muscles helps increase protein synthesis .

[Pie-Bald]

This would be good information to have in the "best of" forum.

[raybravo]

yeah , but there has to be a thread with collective info , not every thread which people like going in there . simply too much space to be wasted that way .

[jediclampet]

Is there any correlation between length of cycle and the % of gains you will keep?

Some say that you will keep more gains from a long cycle.

I have also read where others say that you will loose more gains from a long cycle because recovery is more difficult.

[raybravo]

depends on so many factors , first of all , the drugs used . then the cortisol and the estrogen levels which the indivudual might have to deal with would differ for each indivudual , again what drug u use also comes into the picture here .
then comes how u go about the post cycle routine , there are many ways to go about it , so thats another thing to consider .
but generally , if u dont know what ure doing , and how ur body will react , stay away for the 16 week cycles , u'll stop gaining after a while , and simply start getting fat , bumping up the doses unnecessarily etc etc . stick to the plan , and let htat plan be smart enough to work for u in the first place .

[RetiredMod]

Originally posted by raybravo
yep , he pretty much covered it all :) , jobless biatch :D :)
and yes , ephedrine/clen is useful , beta agonism in the muscles helps increase protein synthesis .
hey I just finished work I'm on vacation bro :D well until next week when school starts and then its back to work too unfortunately..summer has gone by too quickly

btw anyone have much experience with using cytadren post cycle? Voodoo posted a thread which talked about using cytadren post cycle to reduce cortisol levels so one wouldnt be in as catabolic of a state. You don't see too many people using it though so I'd like to hear some feedback on it

[raybravo]

Originally posted by McBain
hey I just finished work I'm on vacation bro :D well until next week when school starts and then its back to work too unfortunately..summer has gone by too quickly

btw anyone have much experience with using cytadren post cycle? Voodoo posted a thread which talked about using cytadren post cycle to reduce cortisol levels so one wouldnt be in as catabolic of a state. You don't see too many people using it though so I'd like to hear some feedback on it
lol , yeah same here , vacation till sep 8th , then back to college .
and cytadren inhibits the synthesis of endo testosterone production too , so people dont use cytadren post cycle . or rather , its not suitable for post cycle use . and btw , lol , good luck finding cytadren lol , cos i havent had any luck :) .

[RetiredMod]

Originally posted by raybravo
lol , yeah same here , vacation till sep 8th , then back to college .
and cytadren inhibits the synthesis of endo testosterone production too , so people dont use cytadren post cycle . or rather , its not suitable for post cycle use . and btw , lol , good luck finding cytadren lol , cos i havent had any luck :) .
yeah i've never seen it either, are there any other sorts of drugs that are similar in action to cytadren without inhibiting the synthesis of endo testosterone? I know clen is prob a good choice for reducing the catabolic state one's in post cycle but I just react badly to stimulants (even a cup of coffee and I'm shaking like a mother****er) so its not a plausible choice for me

[raybravo]

phosphatidylserine , 800 mg per day roughly reduces cortisol levels by 30 % , then add in 5 gms of vit c or so , decent combo :) .

[RetiredMod]

Originally posted by raybravo
phosphatidylserine , 800 mg per day roughly reduces cortisol levels by 30 % , then add in 5 gms of vit c or so , decent combo :) .
thanks ray I'll look into that for next cycle

[DRush]

Good info

[SImPLyHuGE]

why do you say not to use Adderal, im on concerta which i just started recenlty with my doctor to see if it can help with my attention span. Why would abusing adderal affect a cycle and why would people abuse it, what does it do for people with out attention problems. Does this aplly to me.

[RetiredMod]

Originally posted by SImPLyHuGE
why do you say not to use Adderal, im on concerta which i just started recenlty with my doctor to see if it can help with my attention span. Why would abusing adderal affect a cycle and why would people abuse it, what does it do for people with out attention problems. Does this aplly to me.
Well if you absolutely need it then take it...but it is an amphetamine basically and thus is catabolic, plus it suppresses appetite making it hard to get in the much needed calories. These two things combined just mean its harder to hold onto muscle.

You have to weigh the risks versus benefits. Some people CAN'T function without their ADHD or ADD meds and thus you should prob continue to take them but if you can function without them then I'd drop them for post cycle.....well in all honesty I'd prob recommend dropping them completely if you don't NEED them....but that's just my personal view. I personally think they are given out far too freely but thats a different topic all together that doesn't pertain to the topic at hand.

Hope that answers you make a decision, because there is no real answer to the question...sort of a personal call.

[SImPLyHuGE]

what is the benefit of abusing them, for energy?

[RetiredMod]

Originally posted by SImPLyHuGE
what is the benefit of abusing them, for energy?
yeah and its euphoric for some....some people like that speedy feeling........ not a good idea to abuse them though at all. I've heard a few stories of kids OD'ing on those things, not worth it.

[Ginobili]

For those of you who use clen post cycle how much do yall use?

[SImPLyHuGE]

macbain are there any other sides you know of with concerta.

[liftingchic]

Wow.. thanks.. always good stuff to know..

[Muscle_2_Hire]

Originally posted by McBain


7) HCG (huge difference IMO in post cycle recovery)



I used Clomid only post cycle, and the estrogen was taken care of but my test levels didn't come back to normal. It was a slow process even at using 150mg of clomid at first. I then read more about how you should stack clomid/nolva with HCG... I am hoping next time this will restore test levels to normal right away. Any thoughts?

[RetiredMod]

Originally posted by SImPLyHuGE
macbain are there any other sides you know of with concerta.
high BP, memory loss (due to low seritonin levels), suppressed appetite, increased irritability, insomnia and it will make it harder for you to put on weight without a doubt, just look at www.cvs.com they'll list more sides there

[Muscle_2_Hire]

So McBain, can you explain how HCG made a huge difference post cycle for you. I had trouble regaining natural test levels after my cycle, I was only using Clomid but at the reccomended dosages. I read an article stating that HCG and Clomid/Nolva combined are a sure fire way to restore natural test levels quickly and efficiently.

[RetiredMod]

hard to explain, just sort of a feeling. my sex drive was back to normal more quickly and being overly emotion went away more quickly plus like I said just an overall feeling of being back to normal....sorry that doesnt really help, but try it out and see for yourself

[Muscle_2_Hire]

It took me about three weeks on Clomid to start feeling normal again after my last cycle. Next time, I'll use HCG in conjunction with Nolvadex to get back into things. Thanks

[Seep]

7) HCG (huge difference IMO in post cycle recovery) <--- that one item is 65% of the 'recovery' term imho. And Clomid is 30% and Creatine/glutamine pooling is 5%.

what i have never realized is truely truely keeping gains after.
I know all of you will say its possible and you experience it regularly, but if the building 'bricks' are stacked end to end -then the body will (tear-down to the base) rebuild according to dna specs. The trick is to level off without dropping below the base level via rebound. Tapering off doesnt work because hypogonadalism has to occur before test raises to base and levels off.

Since cortisol is not elevated and just being static, it becomes the problem once axis is off. IMHO >I< would seek a mild cortisol suppressor as well. Any ideas or suggestions ? Am i nuts ? :)

[xxxfitness]

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