The Push: Eric Helms 2011 Contest Season

[DREhova 87]

Interesting info on occlusion training... I have always been curious about it, but never actually tried it.

tried it for the first time today.. holy crap...seriously...holy crap.

[Quelly]

with all the interest here...I will say, make sure if you do do occlusion training that you never have a muscle group occluded for 10 minutes or more don't want any tissue necrosis going on with anybody...that's no good lol

[DREhova 87]

with all the interest here...I will say, make sure if you do do occlusion training that you never have a muscle group occluded for 10 minutes or more don't want any tissue necrosis going on with anybody...that's no good lol

Yeah...and do the sets all the way through. My dumb arse switched legs back and forth after each completion of sets instead of waiting to complete the total required 12 sets. LOL...but I'm still feeling the after effects. I probably wouldnt be able to walk very well if I would have done it right anyways. haha

[CHRIS925]

Eric... Lemme be the noob here.. could you give me the concept of occlusion training in one simplified sentence? I'm thinking of incorporating depending on the benefits...

[str8flexed]

brb encompasing a complex concept in a simple sentence :rolleyes:

please read the articles dude, really it won't take you that long

[Quelly]

Eric... Lemme be the noob here.. could you give me the concept of occlusion training in one simplified sentence? I'm thinking of incorporating depending on the benefits...


brb encompasing a complex concept in a simple sentence :rolleyes:

please read the articles dude, really it won't take you that long

yeah the articles are probably the best way to go...mind you I didn't consider doing this stuff until I'd conferred with somebody who has been published doing studies on this stuff and until I read through the full text of multiple studies and a big review...

but yeah....I pretty well explained its concepts in my log post that day I went off about it....

but key points:
cut off blood flow to muscle to pre fatigue Type I (aerobic) fibers
preferentially recruits Type II (anaerobic) fibers
as effective as heavy training in studies, without wear and tear of heavy loads
MAY have unique effects on endothelial (blood vessel) growth and glycogen stores locally in the muscle AKA sacrcoplasmic hypertrophy

I'll be testing out that last data point starting 8 weeks out from my first show

[adamrochester]

occlusion ftw ! def not stoping now might do it for my calfs as they need bringing up !

[Justin-27]

occlusion sounds like a level of pain I'm not ready for.
props to those that utilize it.

[CHRIS925]

brb encompasing a complex concept in a simple sentence :rolleyes:

please read the articles dude, really it won't take you that long

brb would read if I had the link.. your articles have helped me to understand lots btw.. thanks for that


yeah the articles are probably the best way to go...mind you I didn't consider doing this stuff until I'd conferred with somebody who has been published doing studies on this stuff and until I read through the full text of multiple studies and a big review...

but yeah....I pretty well explained its concepts in my log post that day I went off about it....

but key points:
cut off blood flow to muscle to pre fatigue Type I (aerobic) fibers
preferentially recruits Type II (anaerobic) fibers
as effective as heavy training in studies, without wear and tear of heavy loads
MAY have unique effects on endothelial (blood vessel) growth and glycogen stores locally in the muscle AKA sacrcoplasmic hypertrophy

I'll be testing out that last data point starting 8 weeks out from my first show

Oh wow awesome thanks for the main concept.. I would definitely read the studies and articles.. I'll just have to find the link.. I would assume that occlusion can be beneficial for any bodypart.. correct me if I'm wrong

[Flynn]

...I would definitely read the studies and articles.. I'll just have to find the link

Here's one to start:

http://www.ironmanmagazine.com/index.cfm?page=article&go2=1489

[chuckles_345]

yeah the articles are probably the best way to go...mind you I didn't consider doing this stuff until I'd conferred with somebody who has been published doing studies on this stuff and until I read through the full text of multiple studies and a big review...

but yeah....I pretty well explained its concepts in my log post that day I went off about it....

but key points:
cut off blood flow to muscle to pre fatigue Type I (aerobic) fibers
preferentially recruits Type II (anaerobic) fibers
as effective as heavy training in studies, without wear and tear of heavy loads
MAY have unique effects on endothelial (blood vessel) growth and glycogen stores locally in the muscle AKA sacrcoplasmic hypertrophy

I'll be testing out that last data point starting 8 weeks out from my first show

Sorry to jump in, but a couple other key points of note:
-May increase mitochondrial biogenesis through AMPK
-Increases GH and IGF-1
-Occluded cardio has been shown to also result in increases in size and strength
-It has been shown to be safe in healthy populations in this country, however, in Japan they have done it in all types of populations. In fact, a study of Japanese rehab centers that use KAATSU training has shown that the rate of deep vein thrombosis form KAATSU training is less than the rate of DVT in the asian population.
-It will cause more pain and discomfort while doing it, but the DOMS following may actually be less than from heavy load training. Also, the DOMS appears to occur more so from the concentric than the eccentric portion of the movement due to the low loads used.


Loving the discussion in here.

Chuckles

[Bnizzle163]

with all the interest here...I will say, make sure if you do do occlusion training that you never have a muscle group occluded for 10 minutes or more don't want any tissue necrosis going on with anybody...that's no good lol

**Makes mental not to set alarm on stopwatch for 9:59** :p

[str8flexed]

I kind of doubt occluding more than 10 minutes is THAT dangerous. I've seen studies occlude for longer than that, I've personally done 20 minutes of occluded cardio and my leg hasn't fallen off yet :)

[AllGenetix]

i think occluded leg terminal knee extensions (sled dragging) would be rediculous! talk about a pump...

[toddbz]

I'll be testing out that last data point starting 8 weeks out from my first show

Why at 8 weeks and not now?


i think occluded leg terminal knee extensions (sled dragging) would be rediculous! talk about a pump...

What about during HIIT? Would that have benefit?

[str8flexed]

Why at 8 weeks and not now?



What about during HIIT? Would that have benefit?

i consider myself to have a high pain tolerance.

HIIT would be impossible. You would be in so much pain you literally would not be able to move after an interval or two.

If you've never done occlusion I cannot articulate in words how painful it is if done properly

[toddbz]

i consider myself to have a high pain tolerance.

HIIT would be impossible. You would be in so much pain you literally would not be able to move after an interval or two.

If you've never done occlusion I cannot articulate in words how painful it is if done properly

Ahhh

Like 'smash your nuts in a door' painful...got it.

[Quelly]

Sorry to jump in, but a couple other key points of note:
-May increase mitochondrial biogenesis through AMPK
-Increases GH and IGF-1
-Occluded cardio has been shown to also result in increases in size and strength
-It has been shown to be safe in healthy populations in this country, however, in Japan they have done it in all types of populations. In fact, a study of Japanese rehab centers that use KAATSU training has shown that the rate of deep vein thrombosis form KAATSU training is less than the rate of DVT in the asian population.
-It will cause more pain and discomfort while doing it, but the DOMS following may actually be less than from heavy load training. Also, the DOMS appears to occur more so from the concentric than the eccentric portion of the movement due to the low loads used.


Loving the discussion in here.

Chuckles
Beautiful, don't even need to type with braniacs like you following my thread...although I have a feeling someone asking "sum this up in one simple sentence for me" probably won't get a whole lot out of your post lol

I kind of doubt occluding more than 10 minutes is THAT dangerous. I've seen studies occlude for longer than that, I've personally done 20 minutes of occluded cardio and my leg hasn't fallen off yet :)
call me conservative :)....well unless you mean socially conservative in a political sense...fiscally, yeah...maybe call me a libertarian more accurately...what are we talking about again?
anyway, I'm sure I'll get more experimental with it once I have more experience and less reservations...but the whole tissue necrosis thing scared me a bit lol

Why at 8 weeks and not now?



What about during HIIT? Would that have benefit?
a) the study I looked at with the rugby players was 8 weeks, I'm just gonna "go by the book" and replicate the study as best I can
b) that statement makes it apparent you've never done any occluded training....seriously I think Rumsfeld and Cheney would be more willing to call that idea torture than waterboarding lol

i consider myself to have a high pain tolerance.

HIIT would be impossible. You would be in so much pain you literally would not be able to move after an interval or two.

If you've never done occlusion I cannot articulate in words how painful it is if done properly
there ya go

Ahhh

Like 'smash your nuts in a door' painful...got it.
HIIT is painful, Occluded leg training is very painful, occluded HIIT is insane...
that'd be like lighting your legs on fire, and then trying to put it out with acid lol

[WhiteFiberz]

If I can compare occluded training to another experience I wo...

I can't.

[Flynn]

If you've never done occlusion I cannot articulate in words how painful it is if done properly


Ahhh

Like 'smash your nuts in a door' painful...got it.


HIIT is painful, Occluded leg training is very painful, occluded HIIT is insane...that'd be like lighting your legs on fire, and then trying to put it out with acid lol

LMAO! I've done occlusion (arms) w/Layne and it was very painful. I usually don't swear but a few f-bombs were inadvertently thrown around. BUT, I cannot imagine it being worse than "smashing your nuts in a door" :p.

[proud_polack]

call me conservative :)....well unless you mean socially conservative in a political sense...fiscally, yeah...maybe call me a libertarian more accurately...what are we talking about again?

Repped for being Libertarian!

[str8flexed]

Repped for being Libertarian!

Good to see others :)

[Quelly]

Repped for being Libertarian!


Good to see others :)

not that I want this to to turn into a political thread but I personally like political consistency...personally makes more sense to be a communitarian to me (even though I don't share that philosophy) than either "liberal" or "conservative" (and yes I know people don't always have the same definitions for those terms)

but anyway....OCCLUSION!

[devinh]

I've also done quite a bit of occlusion. Many occluded leg days as well as quite a few occluded LISS sessions for 10-20 minutes. No problems aside from super extreme pain, lol. Never considered occluded hiit, I've honestly never done hiit by itself. I will likely try it now that the idea is in my head though. I'm a sucker for pain and stupidity.

[Quelly]

I've also done quite a bit of occlusion. Many occluded leg days as well as quite a few occluded LISS sessions for 10-20 minutes. No problems aside from super extreme pain, lol. Never considered occluded hiit, I've honestly never done hiit by itself. I will likely try it now that the idea is in my head though. I'm a sucker for pain and stupidity.

it makes no sense to do occluded hiit, the benefit of hiit is the high caloric expenditure, which you couldn't accomplish occluded, it would limit speed, power, and endurance. That's why you do occluded lifting OR heavy lifting, occluded heavy lifting is silly....if your a sucker for pain and stupidity just get a hammer and hit your hand lol

[devinh]

it makes no sense to do occluded hiit, the benefit of hiit is the high caloric expenditure, which you couldn't accomplish occluded, it would limit speed, power, and endurance. That's why you do occluded lifting OR heavy lifting, occluded heavy lifting is silly....if your a sucker to pain and stupidity just get a hammer and hit your hand lol

Ah, good point. I'll save myself from that then and just stick with regular occlusion.
I've already got you beat on the hammer and hand thing. Todd may appreciate this story. When I was competitive in tennis I had a ganglion cyst on my hand that wouldn't allow me to play due to pain. I read online that back in the day they beat the cyst with a book. Tried the book, didn't break it up, but the hammer wrapped in a hand towel got it. I was back playing the next day. But talk about pain!

[Quelly]

Ah, good point. I'll save myself from that then and just stick with regular occlusion.
I've already got you beat on the hammer and hand thing. Todd may appreciate this story. When I was competitive in tennis I had a ganglion cyst on my hand that wouldn't allow me to play due to pain. I read online that back in the day they beat the cyst with a book. Tried the book, didn't break it up, but the hammer wrapped in a hand towel got it. I was back playing the next day. But talk about pain!

lol that's funny because i have a ganglion cyst too that pops up every year or so....i normally smash my wrist into a barbell or wall....boom...good to go for like a year lol

[pirateofitaly]

Been lurking, but I gotta say, every time someone mentions smashing nuts in a doorway, I flinch. Oh well. Back to lurking. Carry on with the dispersion of high-caliber knowledge.. :p

[triplewhammy]

Knowledge bombs have been dropped ITT...

[tonsti]

Knowledge bombs have been dropped ITT...
True dat!Got me a wicked headache after reading all that :)

[healthybodies]

I read one post and I'm going hmmmmm...... very interesting. Then in the next I am splitting a gut laughing out loud. Eric your thread has got it all. Much more entertaining than Jamie's "Biggest Loser."

[Quelly]

Intro

196.2 two days after my refeed, sodium has been a little high so hopefully we'll see that drop down. We're gonna need to drop 3lbs by saturday morning to see a new low...that hasn't been the trend yet lol...but here's hoping.
Shadowed the morning certification prep teacher today, and did some leadership training at Bryan College. Next week on monday I'll be guest lecturing for the morning certification prep class on balance and reactive training. So that'll be cool, my first classroom instruction with students :) excited and nervous, but also confident.
Had a great workout today too.

Nutrition

60/250/250

Training

Shoulders and Arms Strength(warm ups excluded)

Standing Overhead Press
135 x 6 (4 sets)

Seated DB Press
70's x 6
Standing DB Press (just to see how much more delt I could get...didn't get much more, but a lot more stability required lol)
70's x 4

Alternating DB Curls
50's x 5 (3 sets)

Alternating DB Hammer Curls
60's x 5
55's x 5
50's x 6

Close Grip Bench Press
225 x 7 pr? equal to pr? I dunno but the most I've done in a while
225 x 6
225 x 5

Tricep Pushdowns
70 x 5 maybe 6....damn memory
60 x 7, 6

Debrief

I have a feeling with the BIG drop last week of 1.6lbs, and the higher than I expected weigh in today that we might only see minor drop this week, as long as it averages out in the end to 1lb/week I'm cool with it, but if not might be time to make my first adjustment. That's means we'll need to see 193.0 or lower.

[Quelly]

Been lurking, but I gotta say, every time someone mentions smashing nuts in a doorway, I flinch. Oh well. Back to lurking. Carry on with the dispersion of high-caliber knowledge.. :p


Knowledge bombs have been dropped ITT...


True dat!Got me a wicked headache after reading all that :)


I read one post and I'm going hmmmmm...... very interesting. Then in the next I am splitting a gut laughing out loud. Eric your thread has got it all. Much more entertaining than Jamie's "Biggest Loser."
smashed nuts, bombs being dropped, wicked headaches, split guts....my thread needs liability insurance

[Quelly]

ooQKUYQ_WgQ

[adamrochester]

i consider myself to have a high pain tolerance.

HIIT would be impossible. You would be in so much pain you literally would not be able to move after an interval or two.

If you've never done occlusion I cannot articulate in words how painful it is if done properly

lol this ^^ me and my client hes a big kiwi hes a quite man and he droped the f bombs couple of times he didnt look happy but loved it after words :) occlusion kills ! but i love challenging my body to pain !

[healthybodies]

Not that you need more to do, but here is a topic of discussion I would like to see your opinion on in your next 3DMJ article. It's mostly theory, but it's a theory I believe in and have been using for 5 years or so.


let me turn it around on you....why cycle creatine?

http://ast-ss.com/information/?p=1983

http://ast-ss.com/information/?p=1989

[chuckles_345]

Beautiful, don't even need to type with braniacs like you following my thread...although I have a feeling someone asking "sum this up in one simple sentence for me" probably won't get a whole lot out of your post lol


Idk if I would consider myself a brainiac, but thanks for the complement. I don't get a tun of time to get on the boards since I'm working on my PhD in nutritional science, but when I do, I try to always follow your thread because there is a lot of good discussion always in here.

Chuckles

[str8flexed]

Idk if I would consider myself a brainiac, but thanks for the complement. I don't get a tun of time to get on the boards since I'm working on my PhD in nutritional science, but when I do, I try to always follow your thread because there is a lot of good discussion always in here.

Chuckles

slacker!

[pu12en12g]

Layne did agree with me, he also noticed more vascularity in his legs since he's been doing it...

I notice this effect with compression clothing

[bwelch1985]

what do you recommend we use to occlude arms? something thin like shoe string or thicker like wrist wraps?

[toddbz]

what do you recommend we use to occlude arms? something thin like shoe string or thicker like wrist wraps?

Looks like guys just use knee wraps just like you would on other body parts.
g-XoB-AIrYk

Figure using Benny is a good example since he's a big ol S.O.B.


Shoe string is way to WWE...brother.

[Flynn]

what do you recommend we use to occlude arms? something thin like shoe string or thicker like wrist wraps?

I believe Layne use knee wraps when I did it. But, it is hard to wrap both arms if you train alone, at least for me. An alternative is to use knee "choke straps".


Shoe string is way to WWE...brother.

LOL!

[toddbz]

Interesting functional study.
http://www.runblogger.com/2011/02/stride-rate-stride-length-speed.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Runblogger+%28Runblogger%29

My take on it is we've reached a turning point of sorts on performance footwear due to the fact that current technology produces a relatively high rate of injury in even moderately trained athletes.

Would that be considered ethics or trends since it has to do with manufacturing as well as functionality?

[proud_polack]

what do you recommend we use to occlude arms? something thin like shoe string or thicker like wrist wraps?
Could get elbow sleeves for pretty cheap. I personally might get them and try out some occlusion techniques.

[Quelly]

Not that you need more to do, but here is a topic of discussion I would like to see your opinion on in your next 3DMJ article. It's mostly theory, but it's a theory I believe in and have been using for 5 years or so.



http://ast-ss.com/information/?p=1983

http://ast-ss.com/information/?p=1989
Ok I backtracked all of the relevant studies he referenced in there. In the first article he basically had every creatine study ever done referenced lol, but in the second one, where he makes some rather controversial statements, he only references 4. That alone tells me something, that he is looking at outliers and not placing that information on the same level of importance as the greater body of research.
That being said, I still looked through them.
First one that is interesting is that they did a study showing that 2g/day of creatine monohydrate does not maintain supplemental levels of creatine in the body. This is the opposite result found in a study done right before it. Which is right? It depends, and likely has to do with how much activity is done and the level creatine degradation.
What's the solution? Take more lol, I'd say 5g/day or 5g/workout would probably do it. 2g/day is 14g/week. I workout 4 times a week and take 5g/workout, so I'm getting 20g/week.
The other study which was interesting basically looked at the creatine transporter downregulating....from that he is extrapolating that taking creatine for extended periods makes your body produce less and will result in it being ineffective if it is not cycled.

I think that is an extrapolation that is missing a key physiological point. Downregulation occurs when saturation is reached. For example, the glut 4 transporter is downregulated once muscle glycogen is topped out, sure, further glucose can't increase glycogen stores more...but that doesn't mean we should carb cycle to maintain muscle glycogen levels. It just means the body isn't going to fill them up anymore because it's full.
I imagine this is the same thing we are seeing with creatine. It downregulates its uptake once saturated is reached, and then yes, creatine won't be taken up as well...but who cares, the tank is full per say.
That being said, it would probably be prudent to take more than 2g/day once saturated to ensure that is enough considering the findings of the study I mentioned before.

Lastly he talks about the ideal time to take creatine, and how much sugar to take it with. Here is a key point All the creatine research available that looks at efficient uptake of creatine is looking at going from an unsaturated state, to a creatine saturated state once you have loaded creatine or supplemented with it for an extended period, how efficient the uptake is really doesn't matter, you are just trying to top off the tank. Sure it might be more efficient as far as % absorbed taking it with carbs and post/pre workout, but really it won't change anything acutely, you are already loaded.
That being said, 5g/day post workout with your carb/protein meal is probably the best way to go to ensure you don't drop below supplemental levels.
But, I don't agree with his supposition about needing to cycle creatine based on the research, I think his line of reasoning is a bit flawed.
BUT I did learn that 2g/day MIGHT not be enough to maintain supplemental levels....and I might do a little creatine load 2 weeks out juuust to make sure I'm nice and maxed out lol

[co1e_train]

Ok I backtracked all of the relevant studies he referenced in there. In the first article he basically had every creatine study ever done referenced lol, but in the second one, where he makes some rather controversial statements, he only references 4. That alone tells me something, that he is looking at outliers and not placing that information on the same level of importance as the greater body of research.
That being said, I still looked through them.
First one that is interesting is that they did a study showing that 2g/day of creatine monohydrate does not maintain supplemental levels of creatine in the body. This is the opposite result found in a study done right before it. Which is right? It depends, and likely has to do with how much activity is done and the level creatine degradation.
What's the solution? Take more lol, I'd say 5g/day or 5g/workout would probably do it. 2g/day is 14g/week. I workout 4 times a week and take 5g/workout, so I'm getting 20g/week.
The other study which was interesting basically looked at the creatine transporter downregulating....from that he is extrapolating that taking creatine for extended periods makes your body produce less and will result in it being ineffective if it is not cycled.

I think that is an extrapolation that is missing a key physiological point. Downregulation occurs when saturation is reached. For example, the glut 4 transporter is downregulated once muscle glycogen is topped out, sure, further glucose can't increase glycogen stores more...but that doesn't mean we should carb cycle to maintain muscle glycogen levels. It just means the body isn't going to fill them up anymore because it's full.
I imagine this is the same thing we are seeing with creatine. It downregulates its uptake once saturated is reached, and then yes, creatine won't be taken up as well...but who cares, the tank is full per say.
That being said, it would probably be prudent to take more than 2g/day once saturated to ensure that is enough considering the findings of the study I mentioned before.

Lastly he talks about the ideal time to take creatine, and how much sugar to take it with. Here is a key point All the creatine research available that looks at efficient uptake of creatine is looking at going from an unsaturated state, to a creatine saturated state once you have loaded creatine or supplemented with it for an extended period, how efficient the uptake is really doesn't matter, you are just trying to top off the tank. Sure it might be more efficient as far as % absorbed taking it with carbs and post/pre workout, but really it won't change anything acutely, you are already loaded.
That being said, 5g/day post workout with your carb/protein meal is probably the best way to go to ensure you don't drop below supplemental levels.
But, I don't agree with his supposition about needing to cycle creatine based on the research, I think his line of reasoning is a bit flawed.
BUT I did learn that 2g/day MIGHT not be enough to maintain supplemental levels....and I might do a little creatine load 2 weeks out juuust to make sure I'm nice and maxed out lol


Thanks for the summary man. I have been doing 5g/workout as of late and its good to know its on point.

[devinh]

Looks like guys just use knee wraps just like you would on other body parts.
g-XoB-AIrYk

Figure using Benny is a good example since he's a big ol S.O.B.


Shoe string is way to WWE...brother.

how'd you find that video todd? that's from my account. lol. we had a good arm day that day, lot's of occluded pain.
shoe string would be a big no no. I've used medical tourniquets, and even those are too thin, cut you right up. knee wraps are the way to go.

edit: that video makes me laugh, i haven't watched it in so long. that's me holding the camera and talking too. in the very beginning you can see another big ol' SOB, Dom, getting ready to do the heaviest one arm seated rows i've ever seen. he's in the green shirt.

[Stoner90]

In regards to Creatine. What do you think of, Kre Alkalyn Creatine out of curiosity?

[DREhova 87]

In regards to Creatine. What do you think of, Kre Alkalyn Creatine out of curiosity?

Isn't it just a way to charge more? For more profit?

[Justin-27]

From my very basic creatine understaning.

Creatine supplementation=moar ATP=moar Muskelz contrackshon=large and in charge?=why go off? :/

[COZ999]

Isn't it just a way to charge more? For more profit?

its to reduce the bloat some get from mono. People dont understand its a form of mono just altered. I enjoyed its effects, bro science or not I like it

[healthybodies]

You know I love that thing you do bro. (Slight homo)

[JohnBrowne]

Isn't it just a way to charge more? For more profit?

lol this

It's called a scam.

[COZ999]

You know I love that thing you do bro. (Slight homo)

Good movie and song (much homo here)

[adamrochester]

what do you recommend we use to occlude arms? something thin like shoe string or thicker like wrist wraps?

i tried knee sleeves , wrsit wraps and knee wraps, knee wraps are best imo there a pain because there so long and hard to do your self but i asked some random at the gym :) he was like wtf lol what are you doing

[Quelly]

In regards to Creatine. What do you think of, Kre Alkalyn Creatine out of curiosity?
It's been proven to be less stable than creatine monohydrate, about 1% of monohydrate is converted to creatinine (unusable byproduct of creatine) in the process of being absorbed supplementally, while 35% of kre alkalyn is converted to creatinine. So, if you want to use it, go ahead just know you'll need to take an extra 1/3 of a serving to get the dose you think you are getting, and it's WAY more expensive than monohydrate.

Isn't it just a way to charge more? For more profit?
no comment I am a sponsored athlete and I don't want it to come off like I am bashing anybody....but I will say what the research shows

From my very basic creatine understaning.

Creatine supplementation=moar ATP=moar Muskelz contrackshon=large and in charge?=why go off? :/
there is a little extra boost to the creatine phosphate energy system but a lot of the benefits of the supplement is in gene signalling for hypertrophy and muscle cell hydration and fullness which is beneficial for growth and recovery

its to reduce the bloat some get from mono. People dont understand its a form of mono just altered. I enjoyed its effects, bro science or not I like it
Monohydrate doesn't bloat, its whatever is mixed with it that causes bloating, the early 90's stuff wasn't 100% creatine monohydrate and some of it's impurities caused the bloating. Creatine DOES cause weight gain from water uptake in the muscle cell, but that's a huge component to why its worth taking. If you take a creatine that doesn't cause weight gain, it isn't working effectively.
Kre Alkalyn is altered monohydrate, correct, it's just a less effective version because of the alteration. And it doesn't surprise me you enjoy the effects, it will give you the same effects as monohydrate, especially long term. It just is more expensive to produce and thus purchase, and happens to be less effectively utilized by the body. But if you take enough it won't matter.

lol this

It's called a scam.
Once again, no comment, it could just as easily be a product based on an un tested hypothesis about ph levels in the body, that just didn't pan out...

But, here's the abstract of the research so you know I'm not just making stuff up about kre alk's inefficiency in comparison to monohydrate

Kre-alkalyn® supplementation has no beneficial effect on creatine-to-creatinine conversion rates.
Tallon MJ1 and Child R2
University of Northumbria, Sport Sciences, Northumbria University, Northumberland Building, Newcastle upon Tyne, United Kingdom
Department of Life Sciences, Kingston University, Penrhyn Rd, Kingston-upon-Thames, United Kingdom.
All American Pharmaceutical and Natural Foods Corp. (Billings, MT, USA) claim that Kre-alkalyn® (KA) a “Buffered” creatine, is 100% stable in stomach acid and does not convert to creatinine. In contrast, they also claim that creatine monohydrate (CM) is highly pH labile with more than 90% of the creatine converting to the degradation product creatinine in stomach acids. To date, no independent or university laboratory has evaluated the stability of KA in stomach acids, assessed its possible conversion to creatinine, or made direct comparisons of acid stability with CM.
This study examined whether KA supplementation reduced the rate of creatine conversion to creatinine, relative to commercially available CM (CreapureÒ). Creatine products were analyzed by an independent commercial laboratory using testing guidelines recommended by the United States Pharmacopeia (USP). Each product was incubated in 900ml of pH 1 HCL at 37± 1oC and samples where drawn at 5, 30 and 120 minutes and immediately analyzed by HPLC (UV) for creatine and creatinine.
In contrast to the claims of All American Pharmaceutical and Natural Foods Corp., the rate of creatinine formation from CM was found to be less than 1% of the initial dose, demonstrating that CM is extremely stable under acidic conditions that replicate those of the stomach. This study also showed that KA supplementation actually resulted in 35% greater conversion of creatine to creatinine than CM. In conclusion the conversion of creatine to creatinine is not a limitation in the delivery of creatine from CM and KA is less stable than CM in the acid conditions of the stomach.


You know I love that thing you do bro. (Slight homo)
Turns you on when I talk all researchy doesn't it Brad?

[Quelly]

Intro

Well my concerns about my weight yesterday disappeared today, it was definitely the high sodium, because I dropped like a pound a half to 194.0 this morning lol. So that should set me up for a new low by Saturday morning :)
Today was busy, trained a client at noon, came back to the house and researched creatine for a bit ;) then headed out to work. We had a staff meeting, I finished up a developmental course, and then sat in on two hours of Dr. Zink teaching Psychology of the Mind Body. Pretty cool stuff on Psychoneuroimmunolgy. I was supposed to be shadowing him to watch his teaching techniques and skills but honestly I got very caught up in the content lol.
Anywho, came home with enough time to get down a quick meal an hour before the gym, then hit up a Glutes/Hams Strength day. Got my progression but didn't have the strength endurance today to keep up the effort into my second set. Still a good workout though can't complain about lifetime squat PRs when I'm 194.

Nutrition

60/200/250

Training

Glutes and Hams Strength(warm ups excluded)

Low Bar Squats
385 x 6
385 x 4

RDL
360 x 6 (2 sets)

Lying Ham Curls
150 x 7, 5

Debrief

I have to say I feel very blessed in my life right now. I am active in my marital life, my emotional health, my education, my career, my competitive passion and my physical health, and I feel spiritually grounded and connected. Life is good.

[CHRIS925]

Dude you're killin' it on those squats... 385x6 is nassty.. I only dream of that :(

[COZ999]

Well with regards to that study it was basically debunked and he tallon never showed up to court when efx sued him. I'll post the court docket info when I get home. That study is suppose to be deleted and that guy can longer make his claims. Def no hate tho bro lOts of people have presented us that study and I wast trying to push kre all so I hope it did not come off like that. I have this experiment in the works right now and includes mono so all this discussion has been interesting More to come. So anyway back on track... Update pics? :)

[chuckles_345]

slacker!

Lol.....as far as the discussion on occlusion apparatus for arms, I have tried both knee wraps and wrist wraps and imo the wrist wraps work better for arms (probably because mine aren't big). However, I when I trained with big Dom last spring, I'm pretty we used knee wraps on his arms because they are as large as my legs. In the end, if you are partially restricting blood flow, and can perform the movement with a full range of motion, I think it should work for you.

Also, that 385x6 squat is nuts.

[JohnBrowne]

Well with regards to that study it was basically debunked and he tallon never showed up to court when efx sued him. I'll post the court docket info when I get home. That study is suppose to be deleted and that guy can longer make his claims. Def no hate tho bro lOts of people have presented us that study and I wast trying to push kre all so I hope it did not come off like that. I have this experiment in the works right now and includes mono so all this discussion has been interesting More to come. So anyway back on track... Update pics? :)

His study was never "debunked". EFX won the lawsuit by default because Tallon is a British citizen and chose not to appear in American court.

Moral of the story is that his study is legit and EFX still has no empirical research to support the advertised benefits of Kre-Alkaline.

Honestly EFX should consider themselves lucky that nobody has sued them for false advertising.

[ehlisl]

Debrief

I have to say I feel very blessed in my life right now. I am active in my marital life, my emotional health, my education, my career, my competitive passion and my physical health, and I feel spiritually grounded and connected. Life is good.

All this and a PR :D Great work E!

Shows balance is key in all areas! Always impressed by your approach!

[healthybodies]

Turns you on when I talk all researchy doesn't it Brad?

You know how to push my buttons E!

[str8flexed]

His study was never "debunked". EFX won the lawsuit by default because Tallon is a British citizen and chose not to appear in American court.

Moral of the story is that his study is legit and EFX still has no empirical research to support the advertised benefits of Kre-Alkaline.

Honestly EFX should consider themselves lucky that nobody has sued them for false advertising.

yea, the study was hardly disproven

at the very least monohydrate is JUST as good as kre-alkalyn... at worst KA is less absorbable.

It's all really null and void considering the price difference and considering if you take 5g of creatine monohydrate per day (dirt cheap) you saturate the muscle cells and get all the benefits.

just another example of companies trying to reinvent the wheel to get a better margin & price point

[COZ999]

Not gonna keep discussing this in here. Numerous threads going back and forth on the topic. It's the same as mono some people like it more some don't. leave it at that

[str8flexed]

not fighting with you dude, just stating my input on the matter

[COZ999]

That was for johnbrowne. He tends to rile up threads, I have the utmost respect for your opinion . Your a wealth of knowledge on these topics but I just wanted to get back to e's prep thread

[str8flexed]

understood, sorry for the miscommunication

[COZ999]

No prob sweet cheeks ;) ummm what???? I meant uh ,Dr Norton

[JohnBrowne]

That was for johnbrowne. He tends to rile up threads, I have the utmost respect for your opinion . Your a wealth of knowledge on these topics but I just wanted to get back to e's prep thread

People don't like the truth, especially people that have some monetary incentive to perpetuate misinformation to sell product.

But you're right, enough of this.

[COZ999]

Fair enough jb

[mneugeba]

Ok I backtracked all of the relevant studies he referenced in there. In the first article he basically had every creatine study ever done referenced lol, but in the second one, where he makes some rather controversial statements, he only references 4. That alone tells me something, that he is looking at outliers and not placing that information on the same level of importance as the greater body of research.
That being said, I still looked through them.
First one that is interesting is that they did a study showing that 2g/day of creatine monohydrate does not maintain supplemental levels of creatine in the body. This is the opposite result found in a study done right before it. Which is right? It depends, and likely has to do with how much activity is done and the level creatine degradation.
What's the solution? Take more lol, I'd say 5g/day or 5g/workout would probably do it. 2g/day is 14g/week. I workout 4 times a week and take 5g/workout, so I'm getting 20g/week.
The other study which was interesting basically looked at the creatine transporter downregulating....from that he is extrapolating that taking creatine for extended periods makes your body produce less and will result in it being ineffective if it is not cycled.

I think that is an extrapolation that is missing a key physiological point. Downregulation occurs when saturation is reached. For example, the glut 4 transporter is downregulated once muscle glycogen is topped out, sure, further glucose can't increase glycogen stores more...but that doesn't mean we should carb cycle to maintain muscle glycogen levels. It just means the body isn't going to fill them up anymore because it's full.
I imagine this is the same thing we are seeing with creatine. It downregulates its uptake once saturated is reached, and then yes, creatine won't be taken up as well...but who cares, the tank is full per say.
That being said, it would probably be prudent to take more than 2g/day once saturated to ensure that is enough considering the findings of the study I mentioned before.

Lastly he talks about the ideal time to take creatine, and how much sugar to take it with. Here is a key point All the creatine research available that looks at efficient uptake of creatine is looking at going from an unsaturated state, to a creatine saturated state once you have loaded creatine or supplemented with it for an extended period, how efficient the uptake is really doesn't matter, you are just trying to top off the tank. Sure it might be more efficient as far as % absorbed taking it with carbs and post/pre workout, but really it won't change anything acutely, you are already loaded.
That being said, 5g/day post workout with your carb/protein meal is probably the best way to go to ensure you don't drop below supplemental levels.
But, I don't agree with his supposition about needing to cycle creatine based on the research, I think his line of reasoning is a bit flawed.
BUT I did learn that 2g/day MIGHT not be enough to maintain supplemental levels....and I might do a little creatine load 2 weeks out juuust to make sure I'm nice and maxed out lol

Awesome debunkery! Thanks. Reps on spread, but I would if I could...

[toddbz]

how'd you find that video todd? that's from my account. lol. we had a good arm day that day, lot's of occluded pain.
shoe string would be a big no no. I've used medical tourniquets, and even those are too thin, cut you right up. knee wraps are the way to go.

edit: that video makes me laugh, i haven't watched it in so long. that's me holding the camera and talking too. in the very beginning you can see another big ol' SOB, Dom, getting ready to do the heaviest one arm seated rows i've ever seen. he's in the green shirt.

I just searched "occluded arm training" and blamo there it was lol


That was for johnbrowne. He tends to rile up threads

That guy has proven time and time again that he's an ass hat.
It's kind of like dog poop...you just walk around it.

[CHRIS925]

i just searched "occluded arm training" and blamo there it was lol



that guy has proven time and time again that he's an ass hat.
it's kind of like dog poop...you just walk around it.

lol

[Quelly]

Dude you're killin' it on those squats... 385x6 is nassty.. I only dream of that :(
It's been a long road my friend...strained spinal ligament, torn hamstring, and 7 years of lifting to get here

Lol.....as far as the discussion on occlusion apparatus for arms, I have tried both knee wraps and wrist wraps and imo the wrist wraps work better for arms (probably because mine aren't big). However, I when I trained with big Dom last spring, I'm pretty we used knee wraps on his arms because they are as large as my legs. In the end, if you are partially restricting blood flow, and can perform the movement with a full range of motion, I think it should work for you.

Also, that 385x6 squat is nuts.
Thanks for the pragmatic insight dude, and thanks!

All this and a PR :D Great work E!

Shows balance is key in all areas! Always impressed by your approach!
It's a work in progress, both the prs and my life, always striving to seek balance....and squat prs ;)

You know how to push my buttons E!
yeah i do baby...see you this weekend


and on the whole creatine front....we got Controlled Labs, Scivation and EFX athletes discussing creatine...it's safe to say we should probably all keep our discussion limited to what's already been said considering this a supplement distributors forum and there have literally been people sued on here for similar things....:)

[pirateofitaly]

Wombo squats there, jesus...

[Justin-27]

Good stuff.

@194?

Better stuff.

[Quelly]

Wombo squats there, jesus...


Good stuff.

@194?

Better stuff.
thanks guys, periodization....it works

[Flynn]

I was going to write good stuff but then I read the "age" comments about Jeff & Brad. How dare you disrespect your elders ;).

[AustrianOakJr]

Nice work on the PR, Eric. Feels good mid-prep, eh? :) And great creatine discussion going on in here. Another creatine question.....what is magnesium chelate and what are the pros and cons?

[chuckles_345]

thanks guys, periodization....it works

Maybe I missed this somewhere, but what kind of progression are you running during this prep?

[Quelly]

I was going to write good stuff but then I read the "age" comments about Jeff & Brad. How dare you disrespect your elders ;).
Just lump into the category of "kids these days" I've got no respect, I just run around with my long hair and my fancy gadgets and have no respect...I can't help it Flynn, it's just my generation ;)

Nice work on the PR, Eric. Feels good mid-prep, eh? :) And great creatine discussion going on in here. Another creatine question.....what is magnesium chelate and what are the pros and cons?

I think it was initially proposed like CEE and Kre Alk to be superior to Mono in some way, but I think it's pretty much no different from monohyrdate in terms of effectiveness.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15142029

Couple interesting pieces in the above study
-2.5g/day of creatine gave improvements in 1rm and work capacity at 70%1RM, didn't need much at all in terms of dosage, didn't need to load either
-2.5g/day of creatine vs 2.5g/day of magnesium chelate were not significantly different from one another in effectiveness in the parameters....likely meaning uptake of creatine was at least similar.

good old high quality monohydrate will do the trick, so will magnesium chelate, they perform the same.

[Quelly]

Maybe I missed this somewhere, but what kind of progression are you running during this prep?

for my compounds I have a progression on strength days, which are every other week, that looks like this

load x 6
add 10 x 5
add another 10 x 4
reset
initial load +5 x 6
add 10 x 5
add another 10 x 4

really basic linear progression, concurrent volume reduction with increase in intensity, and I think it helps that I have a hypertrophy workout where I don't follow a structured progression between strength weeks where I do....on a diet gives me more time to actually make the adaptation.

Over the last couple months (starting before my diet even) I have walked my squat up from 365 x 6 and 385 x 4, to 385 x 6 and 400 x 4 (will be 405 x 4 assuming everything goes well next month lol) very slow progression adding about 5lb/month to my 4RM-6RM since mid november

[DREhova 87]

I meant to tell you the other day when I was reading your log...but got distracted... Looks like your in a awesome place mentally and phyiscally. Really thing this will be a gratifying year for you. Your up to some great stuff. :)

[Quelly]

I meant to tell you the other day when I was reading your log...but got distracted... Looks like your in a awesome place mentally and phyiscally. Really thing this will be a gratifying year for you. Your up to some great stuff. :)

give me another 10lbs, we'll see how I'm doing lol but so far so good, thanks man

[DREhova 87]

give me another 10lbs, we'll see how I'm doing lol but so far so good, thanks man

lol. I was actually referring to everything outside bodybuilding. The job....education...ect. Great balance.

[Bnizzle163]

lol. I was actually referring to everything outside bodybuilding. The job....education...ect. Great balance.

I will second that. You're an inspiration in more ways than one, big E!

[BaFtub]

I've been following that type of progression in the bedroom and I must say it works wonders!

load x 6
add 10 x 5
add another 10 x 4
reset
initial load +5 x 6
add 10 x 5
add another 10 x 4

I usually peak around month four though , sadly.

But nah in forrealness guys, Eric knows his shiat when it comes to tacking on poundages over the course of months. Looks miniscule on paper but on a yearly basis that equals out to SO much more progression versus winging it/spinning wheels.

*clicks bb.com like button on eric's routine*

[foodpr0n]

Over the last couple months (starting before my diet even) I have walked my squat up from 365 x 6 and 385 x 4, to 385 x 6 and 400 x 4 (will be 405 x 4 assuming everything goes well next month lol) very slow progression adding about 5lb/month to my 4RM-6RM since mid november

And for someone in your position (years in the weight room) - that is AWESOME :eek:

Do you recommend this sort of thing for those 'less' advanced, or simply does simply adding reps @ the same weight until you hit say 3-4 sets of 8 before moving up in weight suffice?
e.g
100 x8,8,6 ...stay same
100 x8,8,8,8 ... move up
105 x6,6,4 ... stay same

Until you hit 105 3-4x8?


^Hmm, guess it depends on the person looking at writing that out. I know Lyle mentions some people suck at volume across sets, so a more 'reverse' pyramid set would be better.

Regardless, kudos on those gains E

[Quelly]

lol. I was actually referring to everything outside bodybuilding. The job....education...ect. Great balance.
And I was saying....that those things might be harder to manage as I get about 10lbs leaner :) But thank you

I will second that. You're an inspiration in more ways than one, big E!
Thanks dude, humbled

I've been following that type of progression in the bedroom and I must say it works wonders!

load x 6
add 10 x 5
add another 10 x 4
reset
initial load +5 x 6
add 10 x 5
add another 10 x 4

I usually peak around month four though , sadly.

But nah in forrealness guys, Eric knows his shiat when it comes to tacking on poundages over the course of months. Looks miniscule on paper but on a yearly basis that equals out to SO much more progression versus winging it/spinning wheels.

*clicks bb.com like button on eric's routine*
lol @ that whole post

And for someone in your position (years in the weight room) - that is AWESOME :eek:

Do you recommend this sort of thing for those 'less' advanced, or simply does simply adding reps @ the same weight until you hit say 3-4 sets of 8 before moving up in weight suffice?
e.g
100 x8,8,6 ...stay same
100 x8,8,8,8 ... move up
105 x6,6,4 ... stay same

Until you hit 105 3-4x8?


^Hmm, guess it depends on the person looking at writing that out. I know Lyle mentions some people suck at volume across sets, so a more 'reverse' pyramid set would be better.

Regardless, kudos on those gains E
Adding a rep is great, its like 2% gain in strength abouts, so quite significant....that being said some people could try to add reps forever and not be able to increase weight in certain rep ranges just because they suck at it...for that reason I think yeah, very much depends on the person. I do fine in the 3-7 rep range or so adding reps, but I have a very tough time making rep increases in the 8+ rep range...dunno why.

[Philipp84]

Also IN here!

[AustrianOakJr]

Thanks for the link, man.

[Highstick12]

Very informative journal.

[Quelly]

Intro

So it's been 6.5 weeks and I've gone from 200 to 193.2 and it's time to make the first adjustment! Weight loss rate has just fallen underneath 1lb/week averaged out over the last 3 weeks so we're pulling the trigger on a minor change. Off days and cardio days (the days I don't even log) carbs will go lower by 50g, that's 3 days/week so a total reduction of 150g/cho per week. And I'm adding a 20min GPP/Moderate High Intensity cardio session the day after my refeed on sundays, after I finish quads/calves. Probably do some KB work, metabolic barbell circuit stuff, slap the 25lb bumper plates on the 25lb olympic bar and some a bunch of power snatches etc. Maybe do some 1 min 2 min work to rest interval elliptical stuff...anyways, try to burn 300-400kcals in a relatively short window once a week. That's an additional 900-1000kcals/week through cardio and deficit so hopefully that will put me back to or over the 1lb/week mark. Keeping carbs on training days and refeed day the same, fat and protein is unchanged.
Had a kickass workout today, still getting stronger which is fantastic!

Nutrition

50/500/200

Training

Chest/Back Hypertrophy (warm ups excluded)

DB Chest Press
105's x 12, 10, 8

Incline DB Press
90's x 12, 9

HS Lat Pullover
2pps +5lbs/side x 10, 10

Cable Rows
160 x 12, 10

Latpulldown on station with handle for each hand
180 x 8

Debrief

still doesn't even feel like I'm dieting and that's cool :) Tomorrow Team 3DMJ is working out with Layne Norton in San Fran!

[Quelly]

Also IN here!
Glad to have you!

Thanks for the link, man.
you got it Sean

Very informative journal.

I try!

[Highstick12]

Awesome pressing as usual!

[AllGenetix]

whats the rest times on hyphy work and strength work?

[Quelly]

whats the rest times on hyphy work and strength work?

not explicitly timed, but probably 1-2 minutes between sets and exercises, on strength work, however long I feel like I need to put up big poundages again

[Quelly]

Awesome pressing as usual!

it's getting better thanks Alex :)

[Bnizzle163]

It's good to be that far into prep and feel like you're not dieting still :)

Training with Dr.Norton? There will be vids, I hope.

[woofman81]

It's good to be that far into prep and feel like you're not dieting still :)

Training with Dr.Norton? There will be vids, I hope.

Another request for vids as well :)

[adamrochester]

Another request for vids as well :)

this spot on ! and pics !

[Quelly]

dont worry well get some!

[entropy1]

with all the interest here...I will say, make sure if you do do occlusion training that you never have a muscle group occluded for 10 minutes or more don't want any tissue necrosis going on with anybody...that's no good lol

admitely it's for veterinary, and non exercising. but the rule we where taught for tourniquets was 2 hours- a number which i believe came from human ortho surgeons

EDIT: he's a reference that says 90mins http://www.tourniquets.org/pdf/protocol.pdf
they are using pressure controlled ones, but also using esmarch bandages (which force all the blood out of the limb http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esmarch_bandage)

[Justin-27]

so E, why you no do teh pull ups/chins/dips?

[Quelly]

admitely it's for veterinary, and non exercising. but the rule we where taught for tourniquets was 2 hours- a number which i believe came from human ortho surgeons

EDIT: he's a reference that says 90mins http://www.tourniquets.org/pdf/protocol.pdf
they are using pressure controlled ones, but also using esmarch bandages (which force all the blood out of the limb http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esmarch_bandage)
I know I'm being a total conservative with that figure...but I know if I say 10mins some crazy dude is gonna do twice that....just trained with Layne today and he knows a lot more on that subject he was talking about regularly occluding for longer than that for a while, etc. etc.

Call me cautious when it comes to applying a tourniquet to your own body lol, there are worse things to be overly conservative about

so E, why you no do teh pull ups/chins/dips?
Mainly because I'm losing weight and it's difficult to track progress because it's a bodyweight influenced diet, and I have a good groove with lat pulldowns and like them....they are a good exercise, I recommend them

[Justin-27]

That's a fair current answer, how about your past with them? Ever use them to build that back? I'm just curious.

I use both. Though I tend to only use pulldowns in the parallel, CG or the medium grip, supinated iteration.

[Quelly]

Intro

So the 3DMJ crew, all four of us coaches, and also some friends and clients met up with Layne Norton to train in San Francisco today since he was in town as a guest speaker for a Dairy Conference. We had a great workout and an even better time chatting and hanging out. All I have to say is that it's really good to meet people in person sometimes, got a true sense of who Layne is and I like to think I'm pretty good at getting a read on people. Layne is good people, trying to do good things and uplift the sport and everybody in it as a whole. Proud to call him a friend :)
And BTW he's strong as **** lol, got to spot him on his "deload" week squatting nearly my 2RM on Deadlifts for an easy double...good times, VERY motivating. Also picked his brain on occlusion, meal intervals, and measuring rates of protein synthesis in the lab. My inner geek had a blast :)

Nutrition

60/250/250

Training

Quads & Calves Strength (warm ups excluded)
20 mins Moderate High Intensity Cardio/GPP

Front Squats, burying these bad boys deep
275 x 6
285 x 4
275 x 4

Hack Squats, smooth machine they have at this gym!
5pps+25lbs/side x 5 (2 sets)

Single Leg Leg Extensions
I forget x 8, 7

Standing Calf Raise
350 x 7, 6, 5
300 x 8, 7

Cardio: Barbell Complexes with 65lbs (they had 10lbs bumper plates :))
5 snatches rest, repeat for about 10 minutes
5 clean and jerk rest repeat, for about 5 minutes
5 bent row, hang clean, jerk, overhead squat, rest, repeat 5 minutes

Debrief

great day today, best part of this sport is meeting other passionate, positive people. Truly. Better than any trophy or placing for me.

[Quelly]

That's a fair current answer, how about your past with them? Ever use them to build that back? I'm just curious.

I use both. Though I tend to only use pulldowns in the parallel, CG or the medium grip, supinated iteration.

Oh definitely, in the offseason I got up to doing like 7-8 reps with +50lbs or so at like 210lbs...pulldowns are great too, but both require finding your groove to hit the latts...well at least for me...took me some time

[Quelly]

Intro

Things are really starting to shape up visually. Looking pretty cut up and finally starting to look bigger with the more weight I drop at this point. Felt worthy enough to wear a tank to the gym today doing hypertrophy shoulders and arms, always motivating for me when I start to see my body change :)
Yesterday I was CRAZY busy, Bryan College from 8-1, did a lecture on balance and reactive training, 3-4:30pm I had a client across town, then 6-8pm I attended a Wellness Class on Weight Management in Vacaville about an hour from that client's house. For my final project in one of my classes (my personal education classes that it is) I am writing a research paper on Wellness Coaching. So along with looking through studies I had to experience the subject and interview a professional in the field. I am lucky that my cousin Brooke is a Health Educator for Kaiser and she hooked me up with being able to watch the class and pick their brains. Anyway, the final project was actually due on the 27th, but the class is on mondays and was cancelled the last two weeks for valentines day and presidents day, so I go an extension on just the experiential feedback and interview portion. So I had already turned in the research paper portion. Once I came home around 8:30pm I worked until bed time writing the experiential journal, the interview, and my impression of the whole thing. Total paper length was about 8 pages for both sections....it's nice to be done!
Long story short...I didn't get my cardio in yesterday....so today after my workout I did it.

Nutrition

60/250/250

Training

Shoulders and Arms Hypertrophy(warm ups excluded)

Standing Overhead Press
120 x 8 (2 sets)

Seated DB Press (delts were smoked)
75's x 7 (this is actually really good for doing militarys first for me)
65's x 8

Standing Lateral Raises, strict
30's x 10, 9

Alternating DB Curls
40's x 12, 10, 8

Alternating DB Hammer Curls
45's x 10, 9

Seated DB Overhead Tricep Press
100's x 11
100's x 9

Tricep Pushdowns
50 x 10, 9

Debrief

Lecturing on professional development either thursday or monday depending on where the class is at, I'll be working on my lesson plan tomorrow.

[Warrior9]

cancelled for valentines day? i wish my college did that :)

haha just kidding, glad to hear things are moving along,
new pics anytime soon E?

[Quelly]

cancelled for valentines day? i wish my college did that :)

haha just kidding, glad to hear things are moving along,
new pics anytime soon E?

It wasn't a college course, it was a wellness class at a medical center :)

and yeah I'll put up more pics a month after my last pic set. I'll put up pics every ~4 weeks

[RichKnapp]

I'm still lerking. ;)

[anti-steroids]

Intro

Things are really starting to shape up visually. Looking pretty cut up and finally starting to look bigger with the more weight I drop at this point. Felt worthy enough to wear a tank to the gym today doing hypertrophy shoulders and arms, always motivating for me when I start to see my body change :)
Yesterday I was CRAZY busy, Bryan College from 8-1, did a lecture on balance and reactive training, 3-4:30pm I had a client across town, then 6-8pm I attended a Wellness Class on Weight Management in Vacaville about an hour from that client's house. For my final project in one of my classes (my personal education classes that it is) I am writing a research paper on Wellness Coaching. So along with looking through studies I had to experience the subject and interview a professional in the field. I am lucky that my cousin Brooke is a Health Educator for Kaiser and she hooked me up with being able to watch the class and pick their brains. Anyway, the final project was actually due on the 27th, but the class is on mondays and was cancelled the last two weeks for valentines day and presidents day, so I go an extension on just the experiential feedback and interview portion. So I had already turned in the research paper portion. Once I came home around 8:30pm I worked until bed time writing the experiential journal, the interview, and my impression of the whole thing. Total paper length was about 8 pages for both sections....it's nice to be done!
Long story short...I didn't get my cardio in yesterday....so today after my workout I did it.

Nutrition

60/250/250

Training

Shoulders and Arms Hypertrophy(warm ups excluded)

Standing Overhead Press
120 x 8 (2 sets)

Seated DB Press (delts were smoked)
75's x 7 (this is actually really good for doing militarys first for me)
65's x 8

Standing Lateral Raises, strict
30's x 10, 9

Alternating DB Curls
40's x 12, 10, 8

Alternating DB Hammer Curls
45's x 10, 9

Seated DB Overhead Tricep Press
100's x 11
100's x 9

Tricep Pushdowns
50 x 10, 9

Debrief

Lecturing on professional development either thursday or monday depending on where the class is at, I'll be working on my lesson plan tomorrow.

nice workout!..on a side note in HS I remember a teacher withthe same initials (E.H) he got hit in the head with a garbage can lol!(damn kids ) :D

[Quelly]

nice workout!..on a side note in HS I remember a teacher withthe same initials (E.H) he got hit in the head with a garbage can lol!(damn kids ) :D

...I sure as hell that doesn't happen to me....I specifically teach adults....most of them are adult males who like to lift weights....lol

[NattyMeso]

Hey man after reading some of your other posts I thought it'd be wise to sub to this log. Good luck!

Seems after reading through a lot of your workouts that we aren't too different, in both workout routines and diet. This is good sign for me haha, I want to compete 2012 :D

[Quelly]

Hey man after reading some of your other posts I thought it'd be wise to sub to this log. Good luck!

Seems after reading through a lot of your workouts that we aren't too different, in both workout routines and diet. This is good sign for me haha, I want to compete 2012 :D

Glad to have you along, and just remember there are a lot of ways to skin a cat, and we are each a different "cat", I have clients right now who would not do well dieting like me.

Carb cycling, only a couple cardio sessions, low volume, frequency of training each muscle group 1x/week....very specific to my body during contest prep...

but the point is there is a underlying, well thought out rationale to everything I do...but it is customized to me....

so yeah....that's my disclaimer lol, glad to have you aboard!

[Quelly]

So, my long term goal is to become a pro as many of you may know, and my preferred organization was either the WNBF or the IFPA...just found out that the IFPA will only take pro cards from NGA or WNBF as of this year...so I won't be doing any ABA shows this year, since the only reason I was going to do them would be to apply for my IFPA pro status with a PNBA card...but that's a no go now...to be honest that doesn't disappoint me, I'd prefer to give my money and support to the organizations that do more for their athletes and make a greater effort to put on quality shows. So, updated list of shows I may do:

NGA:
5/14 NGA Mountain States Ogden, UT
6/11 NGA Natural California Folsom, CA
8/27 NGA Idaho State Boise, ID
10/15 NGA Northern States Ogden, UT
10/TBA NGA Flex Fitness Twin Falls, ID

WNBF:
7/9 INBF Southern California Classic La Jolla, CA
9/24 INBF West Coast Classic Sacramento, CA

As many of you may or may not know I am not eligible to do OCB/NANBF (and IFPA for that matter) shows until 2013 because of my banned substance use (superdrol) in 06. It falls under the 2 year rule for the INBF (they have a 2 year ban for all over the counter hormonal products that were used) so I have been eligible since 08, and I used superdrol before it was banned in the NGA (spoke to the president about this in 07, and competed with the NGA in 09 had no issue). The OCB/NANBF on the other hand banned superdrol about 8 months before I used it, and thus it has a 7 year ban from that date. Sadly, back in 06 I wasn't even seriously considering competing, and I was insecure and in the "get big now" mindset w/o regard to my future, my health or my personal ethics...and it's a good lesson for me to learn now....gotta play chess with life, not checkers.
So, even if I did win an NGA show or WNBF show and decided to go IFPA, I could apply for my card, but I'd have to wait until 2013 to actually compete...which is fine with me, I'm not ready for the pro stage and I'm planning on taking off until 2014 after this season.

[Big.Jazayrli]

So, even if I did win an NGA show or WNBF show and decided to go IFPA, I could apply for my card, but I'd have to wait until 2013 to actually compete...which is fine with me, I'm not ready for the pro stage and I'm planning on taking off until 2014 after this season.

What say ye to a two year dual-bulk. I'll join you. Together we will ruin others hopes and dreams.

In? :D

[bwelch1985]

I like the plans Eric....long offseasons are basically the only way guys at your experience level can make substantial gains...but I know staying away from the stage is easier said than done!:)

btw, I can't believe you can diet for so long! All the way till October!?! I would die.

[COZ999]

It wasn't a college course, it was a wellness class at a medical center :)

and yeah I'll put up more pics a month after my last pic set. I'll put up pics every ~4 weeks

I want pics every 4 hours. I REALLY wanna track ur progress

[toddbz]

btw, I can't believe you can diet for so long! All the way till October!?! I would die.

Just win the 1st show.
question + answer = solution


Nice work my man on those standing presses. Real good stuff.
Super proud of what you boys have been accomplishing lately.

[Quelly]

What say ye to a two year dual-bulk. I'll join you. Together we will ruin others hopes and dreams.

In? :D
I'm dizown homie....I'd love to see what kind of total I can get to with 2 years of running powerlifting programs....1300+...1400? Maybe :)

I like the plans Eric....long offseasons are basically the only way guys at your experience level can make substantial gains...but I know staying away from the stage is easier said than done!:)

btw, I can't believe you can diet for so long! All the way till October!?! I would die.
Well I would much prefer not to diet until october lol...I will probably finish my season as soon as I win a pro qual....but believe you me....I will give myself A LOT of opportunities lol

I want pics every 4 hours. I REALLY wanna track ur progress
how does one get a restraining order? ;)

Just win the 1st show.
question + answer = solution


Nice work my man on those standing presses. Real good stuff.
Super proud of what you boys have been accomplishing lately.
Thanks Todd I really appreciate that :)

[Big.Jazayrli]

I'm dizown homie....I'd love to see what kind of total I can get to with 2 years of running powerlifting programs....1300+...1400? Maybe :)


bah ofcourse you can. Don't sell yourself short :)

[Quelly]

bah ofcourse you can. Don't sell yourself short :)

LOL wasnt like I was saying...1400...oh man no way woe is me

acting like I'm Eor or something lol

I'm saying I'm shooting for 1400, 1300+ won't make me feel like a failure though ;)

[Big.Jazayrli]

LOL wasnt like I was saying...1400...oh man no way woe is me

acting like I'm Eor or something lol

I'm saying I'm shooting for 1400, 1300+ won't make me feel like a failure though ;)

Just making sure :) Can't do negativity except if its aimed at negativity

hows that for a word mashup? ;)

[co1e_train]

Sounds like you got a solid game plan man.

Now i didnt catch this above if it was there but once you win your pro status, say with in the first 1 or so shows, are you gonna do any other shows that you have lined up or stop there and start the prolonged off season?

[tacoop]

Hey coach,

Glad you are competing in the NGA show in June. That is the same one you are preping me for. It will be good to meet you and any other Team 3D members that are there. Good luck with your prep.




So, my long term goal is to become a pro as many of you may know, and my preferred organization was either the WNBF or the IFPA...just found out that the IFPA will only take pro cards from NGA or WNBF as of this year...so I won't be doing any ABA shows this year, since the only reason I was going to do them would be to apply for my IFPA pro status with a PNBA card...but that's a no go now...to be honest that doesn't disappoint me, I'd prefer to give my money and support to the organizations that do more for their athletes and make a greater effort to put on quality shows. So, updated list of shows I may do:

NGA:
5/14 NGA Mountain States Ogden, UT
6/11 NGA Natural California Folsom, CA
8/27 NGA Idaho State Boise, ID
10/15 NGA Northern States Ogden, UT
10/TBA NGA Flex Fitness Twin Falls, ID

WNBF:
7/9 INBF Southern California Classic La Jolla, CA
9/24 INBF West Coast Classic Sacramento, CA

As many of you may or may not know I am not eligible to do OCB/NANBF (and IFPA for that matter) shows until 2013 because of my banned substance use (superdrol) in 06. It falls under the 2 year rule for the INBF (they have a 2 year ban for all over the counter hormonal products that were used) so I have been eligible since 08, and I used superdrol before it was banned in the NGA (spoke to the president about this in 07, and competed with the NGA in 09 had no issue). The OCB/NANBF on the other hand banned superdrol about 8 months before I used it, and thus it has a 7 year ban from that date. Sadly, back in 06 I wasn't even seriously considering competing, and I was insecure and in the "get big now" mindset w/o regard to my future, my health or my personal ethics...and it's a good lesson for me to learn now....gotta play chess with life, not checkers.
So, even if I did win an NGA show or WNBF show and decided to go IFPA, I could apply for my card, but I'd have to wait until 2013 to actually compete...which is fine with me, I'm not ready for the pro stage and I'm planning on taking off until 2014 after this season.

[healthybodies]

Hey coach,

Glad you are competing in the NGA show in June. That is the same one you are preping me for. It will be good to meet you and any other Team 3D members that are there. Good luck with your prep.

We never miss a chance to slap dream tan on someone Tim.

[tacoop]

Thanks Brad,

I look forward to that. Are you gonna make it to the show?



We never miss a chance to slap dream tan on someone Tim.

[Quelly]

Intro

Gonna be a good week for weight loss, I was 192.8 this morning, and it's only Wednesday. I always hit my lowest weigh in of the week on saturday mornings with my carb cycling setup so likely we might see a 192.0 or lower if I had to guess.
Trained a client in home today, then headed from her place back home, did some school work, some work on my lesson plan and lecture, and then headed to work. Practiced my lecture, and then helped with the certification prep class.
I'm lecturing on professional development tomorrow, and I'll probably do a brief lecture next week on tuesday on biomechanics for the practicum. I'm excited!

Nutrition

60/200/250

Training

Glutes and Hams Hypertrophy(warm ups excluded)

Barbell Hip Thrusts
385 x 8
365 x 10
335 x 12, 10

Lying Ham Curls
125 x 9
110 x 10

Debrief

holy hip extensors batman....gonna be sore

[Quelly]

Just making sure :) Can't do negativity except if its aimed at negativity

hows that for a word mashup? ;)
it made my brain hurt

Sounds like you got a solid game plan man.

Now i didnt catch this above if it was there but once you win your pro status, say with in the first 1 or so shows, are you gonna do any other shows that you have lined up or stop there and start the prolonged off season?
I really would love to get on stage with the boys, so if I get my pro card I will look into that possibility...but as WNBF pros on the side of the country with no WNBF shows...they have some tough choices to make...and since I can't compete in the IFPA yet...we'll just have to see....

Hey coach,

Glad you are competing in the NGA show in June. That is the same one you are preping me for. It will be good to meet you and any other Team 3D members that are there. Good luck with your prep.

We never miss a chance to slap dream tan on someone Tim.

Thanks Brad,

I look forward to that. Are you gonna make it to the show?
Tim, going to be good to meet you! There will probably be a bunch of Team 3DMJ folks in that show, it will be a blast! Last year the whole team made it out, we had like 4 clients in that show and all four of us made it out, TON of fun.

[ErickStevens]

Want to race to 190lbs? ;)

[tacoop]

That is good to here. Hopefully I represent Team 3DMJ well. It has been a good first week. Chugging right along.



Tim, going to be good to meet you! There will probably be a bunch of Team 3DMJ folks in that show, it will be a blast! Last year the whole team made it out, we had like 4 clients in that show and all four of us made it out, TON of fun.[/QUOTE]

[toddbz]

I'm lecturing on professional development tomorrow

What's professional development?

[Resolutioner]

NGA:
5/14 NGA Mountain States Ogden, UT


I hope to see you there, that is show I have my eyes set on.

Hopefully the October one too.

[Quelly]

Want to race to 190lbs? ;)
on your marks, set, go!

That is good to here. Hopefully I represent Team 3DMJ well. It has been a good first week. Chugging right along.
Hey if you represent yourself to best of your ability, that's what matters :) 1 week down!

What's professional development?
Basically teaching personal trainers how to run a business (themselves):
the purpose of business, creating & keeping a customer vs making money/the bottom line.
How to interact with clients and potential clients, the importance of rapport, empathy, assesment and development, the ins and outs of communication, and quality customer service, to include enthusiasm, professionalism and confidence. Also learning to ask why and get to the root causes and emotional motivations that people have for working out, or wanting to work out, and helping them stay motivated. And lastly, pragmatic ways of looking at how many contacts you need to make to earn a certain annual income. Breaking that income down into your hourly rate, how many hours you work, your closing percentage, and then how to follow through and actually ask for the sale and follow up.

I hope to see you there, that is show I have my eyes set on.

Hopefully the October one too.
Oh very cool, if I'm ready I'll be there, if I'm not, I won't....unless I've got fully separated quads and striated glutes I'm not gonna do May 14th...hopefully everything goes according to plan though :) in that case make sure to introduce yourself!

[Flynn]

...unless I've got fully separated quads and striated glutes I'm not gonna do May 14th

In other words, "if your ass is ready." Hahaha, I crack myself up :p.

[Quelly]

In other words, "if your ass is ready." Hahaha, I crack myself up :p.

lol...you cracked me up too, you got a real life chuckle out of me :)

but in practical terms, sadly I actually get striated glutes before my quads come in all the way...so we'll see, glutes might not be enough lol

In other news

c1Dh2u4mT4o

[BaFtub]

Caleb couldnt get any better with video editing... masterpiece.

Great vid, and noice fronts eric

[Highstick12]

Awesome video!

[XManPaul]

Eric, you stated this on a post on the previous page:

As many of you may or may not know I am not eligible to do OCB/NANBF (and IFPA for that matter) shows until 2013 because of my banned substance use (superdrol) in 06. It falls under the 2 year rule for the INBF (they have a 2 year ban for all over the counter hormonal products that were used) so I have been eligible since 08, and I used superdrol before it was banned in the NGA (spoke to the president about this in 07, and competed with the NGA in 09 had no issue). The OCB/NANBF on the other hand banned superdrol about 8 months before I used it, and thus it has a 7 year ban from that date. Sadly, back in 06 I wasn't even seriously considering competing, and I was insecure and in the "get big now" mindset w/o regard to my future, my health or my personal ethics...and it's a good lesson for me to learn now....gotta play chess with life, not checkers.
So, even if I did win an NGA show or WNBF show and decided to go IFPA, I could apply for my card, but I'd have to wait until 2013 to actually compete...which is fine with me, I'm not ready for the pro stage and I'm planning on taking off until 2014 after this season.

I would like to "thank you" for actually admitting this and playing by the rules of each individual federation that you plan on competing in and doing everything correctly and by the book. Do you know how many people take pro-hormones or ephedra and don't even look at these banned substance lists (nga allows both) and some do, but still pass the poly because most federation's poly's rush the questions and should ask a separate question for just the use of ephedra and pro-hormones. It's sad to say but i know of a guy or two on this contest prep board who have done it before and i believe they are going straight untested NPC now, but either way i commend you and respect that!

just my 2 cents

[CHRIS925]

Eric, you stated this on a post on the previous page:

As many of you may or may not know I am not eligible to do OCB/NANBF (and IFPA for that matter) shows until 2013 because of my banned substance use (superdrol) in 06. It falls under the 2 year rule for the INBF (they have a 2 year ban for all over the counter hormonal products that were used) so I have been eligible since 08, and I used superdrol before it was banned in the NGA (spoke to the president about this in 07, and competed with the NGA in 09 had no issue). The OCB/NANBF on the other hand banned superdrol about 8 months before I used it, and thus it has a 7 year ban from that date. Sadly, back in 06 I wasn't even seriously considering competing, and I was insecure and in the "get big now" mindset w/o regard to my future, my health or my personal ethics...and it's a good lesson for me to learn now....gotta play chess with life, not checkers.
So, even if I did win an NGA show or WNBF show and decided to go IFPA, I could apply for my card, but I'd have to wait until 2013 to actually compete...which is fine with me, I'm not ready for the pro stage and I'm planning on taking off until 2014 after this season.

I would like to "thank you" for actually admitting this and playing by the rules of each individual federation that you plan on competing in and doing everything correctly and by the book. Do you know how many people take pro-hormones or ephedra and don't even look at these banned substance lists (nga allows both) and some do, but still pass the poly because most federation's poly's rush the questions and should ask a separate question for just the use of ephedra and pro-hormones. It's sad to say but i know of a guy or two on this contest prep board who have done it before and i believe they are going straight untested NPC now, but either way i commend you and respect that!

just my 2 cents

^ x2 man. Truly respectable....






On another note... that video is bad ****in' ass! Holy sh*t at your guys' squats...

Here I am front squatting 275 for triples and Eric has to up my ass on video :( lol props to all of you man...

[Quelly]

Caleb couldnt get any better with video editing... masterpiece.

Great vid, and noice fronts eric

Awesome video!
yeah he pimped it

Eric, you stated this on a post on the previous page:

As many of you may or may not know I am not eligible to do OCB/NANBF (and IFPA for that matter) shows until 2013 because of my banned substance use (superdrol) in 06. It falls under the 2 year rule for the INBF (they have a 2 year ban for all over the counter hormonal products that were used) so I have been eligible since 08, and I used superdrol before it was banned in the NGA (spoke to the president about this in 07, and competed with the NGA in 09 had no issue). The OCB/NANBF on the other hand banned superdrol about 8 months before I used it, and thus it has a 7 year ban from that date. Sadly, back in 06 I wasn't even seriously considering competing, and I was insecure and in the "get big now" mindset w/o regard to my future, my health or my personal ethics...and it's a good lesson for me to learn now....gotta play chess with life, not checkers.
So, even if I did win an NGA show or WNBF show and decided to go IFPA, I could apply for my card, but I'd have to wait until 2013 to actually compete...which is fine with me, I'm not ready for the pro stage and I'm planning on taking off until 2014 after this season.

I would like to "thank you" for actually admitting this and playing by the rules of each individual federation that you plan on competing in and doing everything correctly and by the book. Do you know how many people take pro-hormones or ephedra and don't even look at these banned substance lists (nga allows both) and some do, but still pass the poly because most federation's poly's rush the questions and should ask a separate question for just the use of ephedra and pro-hormones. It's sad to say but i know of a guy or two on this contest prep board who have done it before and i believe they are going straight untested NPC now, but either way i commend you and respect that!

just my 2 cents
Thanks Paul, and the way I see it regardless of what a polygrapher will ask, I want to play by the rules...I just wouldn't be able to look myself in the mirror every morning if I didn't.
I don't have any regrets about the actual action of taking prohormones/prosteroids...but I do regret that I didn't think about the long term consequences before I decided to...because I wouldn't have done it...I fully support bodybuilders on both sides of the fence, it is their body, as long as they compete with honor, which means on an even playing field, drugs vs drugs not drugs vs natties, then more power to them. But heck, I do feel like a dumb-ass for not considering the long term consequences of my actions.

^ x2 man. Truly respectable....






On another note... that video is bad ****in' ass! Holy sh*t at your guys' squats...

Here I am front squatting 275 for triples and Eric has to up my ass on video :( lol props to all of you man...
I wish I was still at my old front squatting strength, but I don't have the same groove or upper back specific strengthyY0SIHUy5Ng
yeah I was just frontin with 285......GET IT!!! HAHAHAHAHA.....ahhh.....ha.....sorry.

[Quelly]

Intro

Wanted to do a brief update because I don't share some of the training stuff that I do that is equally important for my longevity in this sport. Today I went in and did some corrective exercise and core stability work along with my cardio.
I have slightly protracted, depressed and internally rotated shoulders. Thoracic kyphosis runs on my dad's side of the family, doesn't start looking bad on that side until folks get in there 50's and 60's, but its mild earlier. Even with my weight lifting background I still notice it. I have to shrug slightly in my front shots to keep my taper and symmetry. But, I'm getting more active about really trying to correct it. I have trigger points in my latts/teres major and pec minor that contribute to this and I also neglect shrugs because it ends up causing me neck issues, well at least barbell shrugs. So my upper trap development is neglected. So, I'm working on local muscular endurance with dumbbell shrugs, and I started with 45's for 25 reps 2 sets, and I'll probably build these bad boys all the way into the 80's eventually for 30 reps, maybe even higher. When I was consistent with DB Shrugs I got up to 175 for 6 reps, so lots of room to progress.
The core work, a pallof press, is a great exercise. I reccomend youtubing it. But it trains the core to stay rigid with dynamic amounts of pull from different angles. And as we all know, what do we want our core doing during squats, deadlifts and other heavy compound barbell lifts? NOTHING. The true primary function of the core is isometric stabilization...so that's how I'm training it. Haven't done a traditional crunch or leg raise in months...and even when I did it was a very VERY minor part of my training. Anywho....abs aren't lacking ;)

Nutrition

60/100/250 (don't freak out, I have been having 3 low carb days/week on non training days...I'll be okay :))

Training

Corrective, Core, Cardio

Foam Rolling
Lats/Teres Major

Static Stratch
Lats/Teres Major, Pec Minor

Standing DB Shrug, controlled slow tempo
50's x 30 (2 sets)

Pallof Press
anti rotation
25 x 10 (2 sets both ways)
anti lateral flexion
25 x 8, 30 x 5
anti extension
30 x 10 (2 sets)

20 Mins Recumbant Bike HR ~100-110 (I don't do the full 400kcals when I do the corrective stuff first)

Debrief

So anyway, I get in the above (well this is actually the first time I did the foam rolling and stretching, see I learn from teaching!) 1-2x/week.
longevity name of the game

[CHRIS925]

Duuude. 315 that's nasssty. Respect!

I was gonna ask.... Any good pointers on back squats? Mine suck A$$!!! Strength doesn't want to go up... Might be because I'm working fronts a lot instead though.

[Quelly]

Duuude. 315 that's nasssty. Respect!

I was gonna ask.... Any good pointers on back squats? Mine suck A$$!!! Strength doesn't want to go up... Might be because I'm working fronts a lot instead though.

got any vids?

[CHRIS925]

got any vids?

Nope :( Would help tons I know..

I've tried taking vids on my phone but the damn thing doesn't want to send it to my email..

I like to think I've got the form down real good.. Feels right and I've watched tutorials by rippetoe & others and taken the advice into consideration.. My back squat just blows...

But honestly for BB purposes I have found that fronts are more useful to me. I can find ways to build the hammies and glutes directly.. while putting a heavy focus on quads and core strength during fronts..

Just pisses me off how my back squats don't improve much...

[JimmyChitwood]

I remember when you hit those front for 315. That was a great day. I baked a cake. And ate it.

Really awesome vid up there - the squat montage. It's an odd feeling I have while watching (nothing creepy)... sorta wishing I was there, yet glad I wasn't so I wouldn't be embarrassed as you all sigh and grumble while stripping off plates so I can play too.

Although...my fronts are coming along now... :)

[Bnizzle163]

I can't believe you are almost in the 180's already dude! That's just plain awesome.

Do you think everyone can benefit from incorporating some form of corrective exercise and core stability training? It's something I used to preach to my clients and never really did myself :( lol

[mneugeba]

In other news

c1Dh2u4mT4o

By far the most awesome video I've seen in a while.

[toddbz]

Basically teaching personal trainers how to run a business (themselves):
the purpose of business, creating & keeping a customer vs making money/the bottom line.
How to interact with clients and potential clients, the importance of rapport, empathy, assesment and development, the ins and outs of communication, and quality customer service, to include enthusiasm, professionalism and confidence. Also learning to ask why and get to the root causes and emotional motivations that people have for working out, or wanting to work out, and helping them stay motivated. And lastly, pragmatic ways of looking at how many contacts you need to make to earn a certain annual income. Breaking that income down into your hourly rate, how many hours you work, your closing percentage, and then how to follow through and actually ask for the sale and follow up.


Kind of like business management, but with the addition of bedside manner. Essentials of good business practice no matter what the vocation. I know there are actually people that will come in and monitor a business to see where it can be improved, streamlined, etc. Bryan may actually have something like that set up where you'd take your class, go into an existing business (they ask you to come), and see where improvements could be made. Helps the business, and give the students practical experience. I know Sierra College is given quite a few grants to do just that.


In other words, "if your ass is ready." Hahaha, I crack myself up :p.

HAHA!!!

[kmaster82]

I like that you are going to just wait and do a show when you have meet your conditioning goals. I also respect you for your plans and character with each league. I do have to throw in my two cents after reading Xman's post.
I have been listening to natural BB radio over the last 6 months and also all the natural shows and leagues I have competed in I can't believe some guys. I was listen to the show before they had Kuet Weidner on and they were talking about the guy who got banned from the natural olympia after testing positive for halotestein (sp). That wasn't the shocking part them saying that he was taking insulin for his diabetes and there is no way he could be positive for halotestein because he is on test by his Dr. for his medical condition WTF. I see out here a bunch of guys, especially masters thinking because the Dr. prescribes them test they are natural still. Then you throw in a famous ex NGA champ failing and switching leagues, Liza failing and switching, etc. It is sad and upsetting but it is people like 3D muscle, Dr. Joe, etc that make me happy and proud I compete naturally and have their friendships. If other people want to cheat and compete against the rest of us playing by the rules that is there problem. The bottom line for me is character is who you are when nobody is looking. Can you look yourself in the mirror and know you are playing by the rules or not? Keep up the good work and representing the sport with the character, morals, and passion you do. Ok sorry I will get of my soap box now :D

[_Machine_]

In other news

c1Dh2u4mT4o

Siickkk video ... Looks like you guys were doing work!

[Quelly]

Nope :( Would help tons I know..

I've tried taking vids on my phone but the damn thing doesn't want to send it to my email..

I like to think I've got the form down real good.. Feels right and I've watched tutorials by rippetoe & others and taken the advice into consideration.. My back squat just blows...

But honestly for BB purposes I have found that fronts are more useful to me. I can find ways to build the hammies and glutes directly.. while putting a heavy focus on quads and core strength during fronts..

Just pisses me off how my back squats don't improve much...
that sounds frustrating, wish I could help you more, but with just the knowledge that your back squat "just blows" and that they don't improve much, all i can really offer is condolences you know lol?

I remember when you hit those front for 315. That was a great day. I baked a cake. And ate it.

Really awesome vid up there - the squat montage. It's an odd feeling I have while watching (nothing creepy)... sorta wishing I was there, yet glad I wasn't so I wouldn't be embarrassed as you all sigh and grumble while stripping off plates so I can play too.

Although...my fronts are coming along now... :)
awesome, what are your fronts at now these days?

I can't believe you are almost in the 180's already dude! That's just plain awesome.

Do you think everyone can benefit from incorporating some form of corrective exercise and core stability training? It's something I used to preach to my clients and never really did myself :( lol
I think if you have postural or muscular imbalances yes, and I think proper core training for a weight lifter is core stability training. The ability to prevent motion in the core musculature is what holds our viscera in and prevents vertebral movement during heavy compound lifts that put a lot of torque on the lumbar....proper core training (not crunches and weighted leg raises) is probably the best weapon available for avoiding slipped discs and hernias in my opinion.

By far the most awesome video I've seen in a while.
caleb did a fantastic job

Kind of like business management, but with the addition of bedside manner. Essentials of good business practice no matter what the vocation. I know there are actually people that will come in and monitor a business to see where it can be improved, streamlined, etc. Bryan may actually have something like that set up where you'd take your class, go into an existing business (they ask you to come), and see where improvements could be made. Helps the business, and give the students practical experience. I know Sierra College is given quite a few grants to do just that.



HAHA!!!
cool, I didn't know sierra college did that....don't think bryan does. But yeah it was a fun lecture, getting the focus moved from "making money" to providing quality service felt good.

I like that you are going to just wait and do a show when you have meet your conditioning goals. I also respect you for your plans and character with each league. I do have to throw in my two cents after reading Xman's post.
I have been listening to natural BB radio over the last 6 months and also all the natural shows and leagues I have competed in I can't believe some guys. I was listen to the show before they had Kuet Weidner on and they were talking about the guy who got banned from the natural olympia after testing positive for halotestein (sp). That wasn't the shocking part them saying that he was taking insulin for his diabetes and there is no way he could be positive for halotestein because he is on test by his Dr. for his medical condition WTF. I see out here a bunch of guys, especially masters thinking because the Dr. prescribes them test they are natural still. Then you throw in a famous ex NGA champ failing and switching leagues, Liza failing and switching, etc. It is sad and upsetting but it is people like 3D muscle, Dr. Joe, etc that make me happy and proud I compete naturally and have their friendships. If other people want to cheat and compete against the rest of us playing by the rules that is there problem. The bottom line for me is character is who you are when nobody is looking. Can you look yourself in the mirror and know you are playing by the rules or not? Keep up the good work and representing the sport with the character, morals, and passion you do. Ok sorry I will get of my soap box now :D
I am going to continually do my best to check in with my principles before I make decisions in my life...I won't always succeed but I will definitely admit when I screwed up and pay for the consequences....and because of that I'll be able to look in the mirror...I just hope the same for everybody else in the long run.

Siickkk video ... Looks like you guys were doing work!
always baby!

[CHRIS925]

Definitely understandable brah. Maybe I can squat with berto and Jeff when I see them tomorrow to see where my form needs improvement!

[Quelly]

Definitely understandable brah. Maybe I can squat with berto and Jeff when I see them tomorrow to see where my form needs improvement!
you going out to jeff's?

[Quelly]

Intro

Mind games creeped up on me the last couple days....but for good reasons! I hit 191 yesterday and 190 this morning...all I know is sure I'm leaner, but I'm not looking like I'm 10 over, and it feels like I've managed to get smaller despite an extended offseason and hitting prs in the gym and doing less cardio and eating more food this go around...so....the logical part of my bran and jeff and berto are telling me hold steady I'm just depleted and dehydrated a bit. Which is probably true...between my wacky Bryan College training period schedule, and it being the end of the quarter I've had probably 3 cups of coffee this last week...which makes me pee a lot and which is a lot for me.
In other news....there may be a good chance I'll be doing a show on April 30th...there is an NGA pro/am that a particular guy I know might be considering as his first pro show of the season....and he's trying to convince me to do it even if I'm not at 100%...so yeah...might be a warm up, "why not" show for me. So technically....I'm 8 weeks out :eek:
So guess what that means? Starting occlusion training!

Nutrition

50/500/200

Training

Chest and Back Strength
Arms Occlusion

DB Chest Press
130's x 4 all time PR :)
130's x 4 with a lil help on the kickup

DB Chest Press, 2 second pause at bottom, deep (needing help on the kickup pissed me off lol)
110's x 5, 4, 5, 5

Pendalay Row from rack, bar just below knee
260 x 6 (3 sets)

lat pulldown
165 x 8

occluded tricep pushdowns (holy good god mother of the lord in heaven this hurts)
35 x 20, 35 x 12, 35 x 9, 35 x 7

occluded db neutral grip curls (see my commentary after tricep pushdowns...yeah...again)
20's x 15, 20's x 12, 20's x 7, 15's x 3 DROP 12.5's x 2 DROP 10's x 3 lololol

Debrief

hahahahahaha OCCLUSION HURTS!!!!

btw, wrist wraps worked just great for arms

[ehlisl]

8 weeks and 130's!!! Sick work E!!!

Tara and I are probably going to go to the Boise show! I'll bring the tube sock!! :D

[CHRIS925]

you going out to jeff's?

Yea.. why?

[Quelly]

Yea.. why?

:) see you there :)

[CHRIS925]

:) see you there :)

Sounds good man. Time to critique the sh*t outta my squat!

I'm working back/bis there.. since berto suggested I can use his home gym. I'll get off work and make the hour and a half drive to get there by 3. Nobody else gonna hit some weights with me?! haha :(

[Quelly]

Sounds good man. Time to critique the sh*t outta my squat!

I'm working back/bis there.. since berto suggested I can use his home gym. I'll get off work and make the hour and a half drive to get there by 3. Nobody else gonna hit some weights with me?! haha :(

Its gonna be crowded homie....Erik Holm, me, eric and Jeff....I'm doing quads and calves and some occlusion training, so if you need a spot or what not I'm there :) But yeah, me erik and berto are pretty close to that time where we need to really starting working on our posing

[Highstick12]

Awesome PR!

Straight up BEASTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT

[adamrochester]

Intro

Mind games creeped up on me the last couple days....but for good reasons! I hit 191 yesterday and 190 this morning...all I know is sure I'm leaner, but I'm not looking like I'm 10 over, and it feels like I've managed to get smaller despite an extended offseason and hitting prs in the gym and doing less cardio and eating more food this go around...so....the logical part of my bran and jeff and berto are telling me hold steady I'm just depleted and dehydrated a bit. Which is probably true...between my wacky Bryan College training period schedule, and it being the end of the quarter I've had probably 3 cups of coffee this last week...which makes me pee a lot and which is a lot for me.
In other news....there may be a good chance I'll be doing a show on April 30th...there is an NGA pro/am that a particular guy I know might be considering as his first pro show of the season....and he's trying to convince me to do it even if I'm not at 100%...so yeah...might be a warm up, "why not" show for me. So technically....I'm 8 weeks out :eek:
So guess what that means? Starting occlusion training!

Nutrition

50/500/200

Training

Chest and Back Strength
Arms Occlusion

DB Chest Press
130's x 4 all time PR :)
130's x 4 with a lil help on the kickup

DB Chest Press, 2 second pause at bottom, deep (needing help on the kickup pissed me off lol)
110's x 5, 4, 5, 5

Pendalay Row from rack, bar just below knee
260 x 6 (3 sets)

lat pulldown
165 x 8

occluded tricep pushdowns (holy good god mother of the lord in heaven this hurts)
35 x 20, 35 x 12, 35 x 9, 35 x 7

occluded db neutral grip curls (see my commentary after tricep pushdowns...yeah...again)
20's x 15, 20's x 12, 20's x 7, 15's x 3 DROP 12.5's x 2 DROP 10's x 3 lololol

Debrief

hahahahahaha OCCLUSION HURTS!!!!

btw, wrist wraps worked just great for arms

sick pr brother !

p.s you will get used to this occlusion ! im in 4th week and it doesnt bother me nearly as much ! during set i pull the wraps so hard to try mack it more pain full :P and got my mate to yesterday but it didnt bother me oviously still hurts but you will build a fine tolerance out of it :)

[strebla]

Its gonna be crowded homie....Erik Holm, me, eric and Jeff....I'm doing quads and calves and some occlusion training, so if you need a spot or what not I'm there :) But yeah, me erik and berto are pretty close to that time where we need to really starting working on our posing
Its my day off from the gym, but this sounds like another 3DMJ mashup video in the making :)

[CHRIS925]

Its gonna be crowded homie....Erik Holm, me, eric and Jeff....I'm doing quads and calves and some occlusion training, so if you need a spot or what not I'm there :) But yeah, me erik and berto are pretty close to that time where we need to really starting working on our posing

That's the reason I'm going out there.. but I'm throwin a back/bi workout in there since I'll have no chance to get it in over here before I'm off work.

I've never done any sort of posing in my life haha.. can someone say.. noooob

[CHRIS925]

Its my day off from the gym, but this sounds like another 3DMJ mashup video in the making :)

Hell yea! Sounds bad ass :) Good thing I'm not working w/ squats cuz that would definitely not be video material.. haha. Strength blows man. Front squats are alright.

[strebla]

Hell yea! Sounds bad ass :) Good thing I'm not working w/ squats cuz that would definitely not be video material.. haha. Strength blows man. Front squats are alright.
No worries its all in fun. Looking forward to meeting you!

[CHRIS925]

No worries its all in fun. Looking forward to meeting you!

Definitely. I'll plan to make it there around 3.. see you guys there

[healthybodies]

occluded tricep pushdowns (holy good god mother of the lord in heaven this hurts)
35 x 20, 35 x 12, 35 x 9, 35 x 7

occluded db neutral grip curls (see my commentary after tricep pushdowns...yeah...again)
20's x 15, 20's x 12, 20's x 7, 15's x 3 DROP 12.5's x 2 DROP 10's x 3 lololol

Debrief

hahahahahaha OCCLUSION HURTS!!!!

btw, wrist wraps worked just great for arms

This really cracked me up for some reason.

[toddbz]

Absolutely impossible for you to not beat your last showings my man!
Way WAY to much progress has been made for a 'lesser' Eric to show up.

[coloBB]

might be up on stage with you if you travel over to Idaho in September :)

[Bnizzle163]

There's not a single doubt in my mind that you are going to achieve your best conditioning to date. Funny thing is, you're at the point where every pound will show a lot more detail, then it will be every 1/2 lb, then every quarter. I know I look a HECK of a lot different than I did at 171 versus 161. So, no worries, E!

Gotta love the mind games though ;)

[Big.Jazayrli]

Its gonna be crowded homie....Erik Holm, me, eric and Jeff....I'm doing quads and calves and some occlusion training, so if you need a spot or what not I'm there :) But yeah, me erik and berto are pretty close to that time where we need to really starting working on our posing

Erik, why you listing yourself twice?

..... :D :eek: :D

[Quelly]

mind games have been the challenge as of late...just gotta focus on the now...and lol at me typing eric, erik and me all in the same sentence....guess I'm dieting ;)

thank for the positivity everybody, I love that when I'm not there with the optimism, all I have to do is go to my own log and I know my peeps got my back :)

[JENerator]

mind games have been the challenge as of late...just gotta focus on the now...and lol at me typing eric, erik and me all in the same sentence....guess I'm dieting ;)

thank for the positivity everybody, I love that when I'm not there with the optimism, all I have to do is go to my own log and I know my peeps got my back :)
Well at least there are multiple Eric/k's and you're not just referencing multiple personalities in the 3rd person...yet at least...LOL, dieting messes up your head!

You're the positive one...keep on inspiring E, always a good read in here. :)

[Quelly]

Well at least there are multiple Eric/k's and you're not just referencing multiple personalities in the 3rd person...yet at least...LOL, dieting messes up your head!

You're the positive one...keep on inspiring E, always a good read in here. :)

Thanks Jen I appreciate it....and I think I might be a little dissociated....the Eric in 09 would stress if the scale wouldn't go down and could only worry about getting lean enough....the Eric this year is worried about losing too fast and not being big enough....

it's fun to be crazy no?

[CHRIS925]

You keep swearing so much during your workouts you'll end up losing mass.. better watch that Eric ;)

But seriously dude.. awesome meeting you guys yesterday.. I'm proud to have your guys' support for my first round at this...

[Quelly]

You keep swearing so much during your workouts you'll end up losing mass.. better watch that Eric ;)

But seriously dude.. awesome meeting you guys yesterday.. I'm proud to have your guys' support for my first round at this...

lol, occlusion makes me cuss like a sailor :)

and glad to be in support of you chris, always inspiring to see fresh blood :)

[Quelly]

So after last month's discussion of ethics I got back to the purpose of my Q&A Blog....answering questions! I addressed about five questions, some asked via facebook, some in my log, and some that came via email, covered a lot of topics: gender metabolism speed training deloads rep range

http://www.3dmusclejourney.com/2011-03qa.php

[anti-steroids]

lol, occlusion makes me cuss like a sailor
I cuss like a sailor more often than not..Have you done occulded cardio yet?

[Quelly]

I cuss like a sailor more often than not..Have you done occulded cardio yet?

no sir i have not

[anti-steroids]

no sir i have not

dude I think you will love it

[Quelly]

dude I think you will love it

may have to give it a try if I end up doing any substantial amount of cardio lol...currently my cardio schedule is like almost nothing

[anti-steroids]

may have to give it a try if I end up doing any substantial amount of cardio lol...currently my cardio schedule is like almost nothing

yeah I only really do it sporadically..but still its awesome not to mention the looks and comments it gets in the gym

[chuckles_345]

I cuss like a sailor more often than not..Have you done occulded cardio yet?

20 min occluded cardio on the recumbant bike is rough. I've been doing that and 1 session of HIIT a week during my extended mini-cut.

[devinh]

Occluded cardio is enjoyable, I do concur.
I'm assuming you wrapped at your arms for your occluded arm work, since you used wrist wraps. I think I mentioned it before, may have been here or Layne's thread, can't remember, but it was from one of Jeremy's studies. I remember him saying even when doing upper body occlusion work to wrap at your legs. I will probably get this a little mixed up and you should probably just ask him about it in his thread, but i'll give it a shot anyway, lol. Wrapping at your legs will restrict greater blood flow than wrapping your arms, since your legs have far more blood than your arms. The blood flow will still be restricted through a great part of your body, and since there will he so much more restriction you will get a greater hormonal response, which should result in more growth in the muscle being worked.

Edit: I haven't actually tried it this way yet, but I imagine it doesn't hurt nearly as much, and you could probably use more weight. Just a guess though.

[cptdgraham]

Eric, cool to know you have a thread on here...but I think im going to have to let all the staff know that you get your cardio by chasing dogs around neighborhoods! lol...you're a great addition to the team!

[Quelly]

Occluded cardio is enjoyable, I do concur.
I'm assuming you wrapped at your arms for your occluded arm work, since you used wrist wraps. I think I mentioned it before, may have been here or Layne's thread, can't remember, but it was from one of Jeremy's studies. I remember him saying even when doing upper body occlusion work to wrap at your legs. I will probably get this a little mixed up and you should probably just ask him about it in his thread, but i'll give it a shot anyway, lol. Wrapping at your legs will restrict greater blood flow than wrapping your arms, since your legs have far more blood than your arms. The blood flow will still be restricted through a great part of your body, and since there will he so much more restriction you will get a greater hormonal response, which should result in more growth in the muscle being worked.

Edit: I haven't actually tried it this way yet, but I imagine it doesn't hurt nearly as much, and you could probably use more weight. Just a guess though.


that doesn't make logical sense to me because you still are breathing in fresh air, it then enters the blood stream and your heart pumps it to your arms....you wouldn't be training your arms in a hypoxic state if you just occluded your legs...

[Quelly]

Eric, cool to know you have a thread on here...but I think im going to have to let all the staff know that you get your cardio by chasing dogs around neighborhoods! lol...you're a great addition to the team!

Dustin! What's up man! HA, you read back a good bit through my log I'm impressed, yeah that dog just did not want to be saved...lol...I tried
And thanks, it's awesome to be a part of such a diverse, experienced, thoughtful and educated team

[devinh]

that doesn't make logical sense to me because you still are breathing in fresh air, it then enters the blood stream and your heart pumps it to your arms....you wouldn't be training your arms in a hypoxic state if you just occluded your legs...

It didn't make much sense to me either, but then I remembered I'm not the one in the labs all day. That's why I was saying you may just want to ask him directly since it is his deal and not mine after all. Just thought I'd bring it up, since it does apply here.

[chuckles_345]

I figured I'd clear up the study that I think is being referred to in here. Madarame et al. 2008 had 2 groups of subjects each perform 3 sets of 10 bicep curls with 50% of their 1rm and 180 sec rest between sets. The first group just performed the curls 2x per week. The second group did 3 sets of occluded leg extensions at 30 percent of 1rm with 30 sec rest between sets and then did 3 sets of 10 on bicep curls with 50% 1rm following the bout of occlusion training. Both groups trained 2x per week and after 10 weeks the group that did occluded leg extension before bicep curls had significantly greater increases in bicep CSA and strength even though blood flow to the arms was not restricted in either group. To me, this shows the powerful systemic effects of Kaatsu training (probably due to the increases in blood GH and IGF-1 following occlusion training).

Hope that clears things up. So long story short, I think what you were referring to was doing occluded leg extensions and then training upper body.

[devinh]

I figured I'd clear up the study that I think is being referred to in here. Madarame et al. 2008 had 2 groups of subjects each perform 3 sets of 10 bicep curls with 50% of their 1rm and 180 sec rest between sets. The first group just performed the curls 2x per week. The second group did 3 sets of occluded leg extensions at 30 percent of 1rm with 30 sec rest between sets and then did 3 sets of 10 on bicep curls with 50% 1rm following the bout of occlusion training. Both groups trained 2x per week and after 10 weeks the group that did occluded leg extension before bicep curls had significantly greater increases in bicep CSA and strength even though blood flow to the arms was not restricted in either group. To me, this shows the powerful systemic effects of Kaatsu training (probably due to the increases in blood GH and IGF-1 following occlusion training).

Hope that clears things up. So long story short, I think what you were referring to was doing occluded leg extensions and then training upper body.

That could be it. Thank you. I already let Jeremy know I was butchering his studies in here, so he may stop by and have the same input. Thanks again.

Edit: heres a thought, and I may be getting off base now. If occluded leg extensions before curls cause greater effects would occluded walking before the workout do the same? Not as intense as leg extensions, but if it would have a similar effect, it would work on other muscle groups as well that you can't occlude directly, such as chest, shoulders, or back.

[mneugeba]

Edit: heres a thought, and I may be getting off base now. If occluded leg extensions before curls cause greater effects would occluded walking before the workout do the same? Not as intense as leg extensions, but if it would have a similar effect, it would work on other muscle groups as well that you can't occlude directly, such as chest, shoulders, or back.

I sorta wondered something similar ... I remember a while back someone jokingly mentioning that he was going to try and figure out how to occlude his chest...

Maybe just do occluded leg extensions before doing a chest session? It'd be interesting given the systemic benefit seen in the study that chuckles was so nice to bring to our attention.

And Eric, did you ever hear back from the monkey islanders on occlusion?

[chuckles_345]

I sorta wondered something similar ... I remember a while back someone jokingly mentioning that he was going to try and figure out how to occlude his chest...

Maybe just do occluded leg extensions before doing a chest session? It'd be interesting given the systemic benefit seen in the study that chuckles was so nice to bring to our attention.

And Eric, did you ever hear back from the monkey islanders on occlusion?

You can do occlusion training for chest. If you put the cuff around your upper arm and train chest at a low intensity as you normally would during occlusion training, you can also see increased hypertrophy in the chest. Yasuda et al. 2010 had subjects do 4 sets of bench press with 30% of 1rm, 30 sec between sets. They had subjects do this workout 2x per day, 6 days per wk, for 2 wks. The control group did the same training protocol without blood flow restriction. They found an significant increase in chest and tricep muscle thickness and 1RM bench press in the occlusion group compared to the control group in just 2 wks following this protocol. Moral of the story, occlusion can be used for chest, however, it is in a more indirect way. The increases in chest size are probably due to the triceps fatiguing quickly and more stress being placed on the chest.

[toddbz]

If you start the wrap around your neck will you be performing "occluded" on your entire body?

Lights out dot dot dot

[devinh]

If you start the wrap around your neck will you be performing "occluded" on your entire body?

Lights out dot dot dot

Occluding your head? So your neck muscles, jaw muscles, and brain. So you chew yogurt (~30% consistency of a tough steak) for larger and stronger jaw muscles. Read popup books instead of novels for increased brain function. I think you're onto something Todd. We need human subjects for this one though, rats just won't do.

[toddbz]

Occluding your head? So your neck muscles, jaw muscles, and brain. So you chew yogurt (~30% consistency of a tough steak) for larger and stronger jaw muscles. Read popup books instead of novels for increased brain function. I think you're onto something Todd. We need human subjects for this one though, rats just won't do.

I'm on 3x/week and my face is shreddeded...ddd

Oh fyi I've forgotten how to drive a car and tie my shoes, but it's totally worth it.

[mneugeba]

You can do occlusion training for chest. If you put the cuff around your upper arm and train chest at a low intensity as you normally would during occlusion training, you can also see increased hypertrophy in the chest. Yasuda et al. 2010 had subjects do 4 sets of bench press with 30% of 1rm, 30 sec between sets. They had subjects do this workout 2x per day, 6 days per wk, for 2 wks. The control group did the same training protocol without blood flow restriction. They found an significant increase in chest and tricep muscle thickness and 1RM bench press in the occlusion group compared to the control group in just 2 wks following this protocol. Moral of the story, occlusion can be used for chest, however, it is in a more indirect way. The increases in chest size are probably due to the triceps fatiguing quickly and more stress being placed on the chest.

Again - thanks for bringing this study to our attention... I had no idea that occlusion was already this prevalent in the scientific literature being that I first heard of it only about a year ago from Layne's thread.

[Quelly]

very cool stuff....so the benefits of occlusion can affect systemic hypertrophy, however it is not occlusion training per say in either of the studies just talked about...but still...very interesting

oh and as to monkey island:
http://monkeyisland.lylemcdonald.com/showthread.php?t=47829

[Quelly]

Intro

Looking leaner daily now, nothing to write home about or pic worthy but soon :) Did my first occlusion leg workout at jeff's good god that was ridiculous, did my second arms occluded workout today, noticeably less painful than last time...interesting. Also progressed nicely in strength on my other lifts, dropped volume a bit to compensate for the occluded training.

Nutrition

60/250/250

Training

Shoulders and Arms Strength(warm ups excluded)

Standing Barbell Overhead Press
140 x 5 (2 sets)

Seated DB Shoulder Press
75's x 5 (2 sets)

Standing DB lateral raise
40's x 6
35's x 6

Alternating DB Curls (strict)
55 x 4

CGBP
245 x 4

Occluded Cable Curls
4 sets

Occluded Cable Pushdowns
4 sets

Debrief

so far so good

[will-work4ANDRO]

That could be it. Thank you. I already let Jeremy know I was butchering his studies in here, so he may stop by and have the same input. Thanks again.

Edit: heres a thought, and I may be getting off base now. If occluded leg extensions before curls cause greater effects would occluded walking before the workout do the same? Not as intense as leg extensions, but if it would have a similar effect, it would work on other muscle groups as well that you can't occlude directly, such as chest, shoulders, or back.

bingo, that is the thought Devin, and it's something i have definitely written about countless times...although i will say that I am starting to have a few questions about that Madarame study. I think a lot of literature is starting to question whether or not systemic elevations of hormones are really that important for hypertrophy and while it is still possible that perhaps blood flow restriction is different, i for one am starting to pull away from the "systemic" thought. The study could very well be an anomaly and I guess until we see that particular model reproduced, we'll have to speculate. I personally have started to take the opinion that the systemic elevations in hormones is probably less to do with "promoting hypertrophy" and more to do with mobilizing fuel stores.

as for the upper body, Chuckles talked about the cuffs on the upper arm that produce skeletal muscle hypertrophy through fatiguing the triceps. I believe i've seen some data on the back through lat pulldowns but i think that was just "poster" data. Blood flow restriction without a doubt produces significant muscle hypertrophy which is pretty equivalent to higher intensity exercise. I will caution that the exact mechanisms are speculative but with that being said, we aren't 100% sure the mechanisms by skeletal muscle hypertrophy under normal conditions either.

[chuckles_345]

we aren't 100% sure the mechanisms by skeletal muscle hypertrophy under normal conditions either.


Exactly....Dr. Layman (Layne's old advisor) saw me doing occlusion a couple weeks ago at the gym and we got to talking about occlusion how nobody knows why it works and his comment was that people have been trying to figure out what makes muscle grow in response to normal weight training for years and nobody has yet to really figure out all the details.

[Quelly]

bingo, that is the thought Devin, and it's something i have definitely written about countless times...although i will say that I am starting to have a few questions about that Madarame study. I think a lot of literature is starting to question whether or not systemic elevations of hormones are really that important for hypertrophy and while it is still possible that perhaps blood flow restriction is different, i for one am starting to pull away from the "systemic" thought. The study could very well be an anomaly and I guess until we see that particular model reproduced, we'll have to speculate. I personally have started to take the opinion that the systemic elevations in hormones is probably less to do with "promoting hypertrophy" and more to do with mobilizing fuel stores.

as for the upper body, Chuckles talked about the cuffs on the upper arm that produce skeletal muscle hypertrophy through fatiguing the triceps. I believe i've seen some data on the back through lat pulldowns but i think that was just "poster" data. Blood flow restriction without a doubt produces significant muscle hypertrophy which is pretty equivalent to higher intensity exercise. I will caution that the exact mechanisms are speculative but with that being said, we aren't 100% sure the mechanisms by skeletal muscle hypertrophy under normal conditions either.

I just recently wrote a research review about the systemic effects of anabolic hormones and their acute response to training...with the conclusion that they have been overemphasized...but there is a lot of conflicting research....some fo the kaatsu stuff is among that....also the recent piece of research that showed doing squats before curls increased arm size vs just doing curls....even though west et al and others in 06 did a study showing the exact opposite...only difference was the squats were done after...

lots left to learn

[gymratluke]

E do u think I could benefit from doing occlusion training on my weaker limbs in effort to balance out my left and right side?

[Quelly]

E do u think I could benefit from doing occlusion training on my weaker limbs in effort to balance out my left and right side?

you could apply it that way, but you'd probably have better luck in a gaining phase balancing out assymetry

[Quelly]

Intro

8 weeks into my diet as of today...I think I owe you guys some pics this weekend...Anywho. Good day at work, going to be subbing 3 days next week for a colleague which is good for me to get more experience teaching. Sat in on the class today and got familiar with the students.
After work, I headed to the gym for hams and glutes, and occluded hams and quads....BRUTAL today, in a fabulously masochistic awesome way. :)

Nutrition

60/200/250

Training

Glutes and Hams Strength(warm ups excluded)

Low Bar Squats @ 192.2
395 x 5 wow this was a true 5RM lol pretty pleased with over 2x bw for reps :)
365 x 5 had to do a back off the last set murdered me

RDLs
375 x 5 (2 sets)

Occluded Leg Extensions
4 sets

Occluded Leg Curls
4 sets

PAIN!!!!!

Debrief

occlusion is so ridiculous....so ridiculous....

[FATHER FLEX]

Hurts even more on a leg press! :P To date the worst, but calves were VERY close

[adamrochester]

calves are ok for me leg extensions do it for me they are the worst i want to squeel or throw my water bottle accross the gym :O haha

[will-work4ANDRO]

also the recent piece of research that showed doing squats before curls increased arm size vs just doing curls.


do you have a link/citation for this paper E?

[toddbz]

DUDE! WTF on those squats & RDL's!?
That's just so cool!

And you wondered if you made any progress...pshhhhh

[AustrianOakJr]

Intro

8 weeks into my diet as of today...I think I owe you guys some pics this weekend...Anywho. Good day at work, going to be subbing 3 days next week for a colleague which is good for me to get more experience teaching. Sat in on the class today and got familiar with the students.
After work, I headed to the gym for hams and glutes, and occluded hams and quads....BRUTAL today, in a fabulously masochistic awesome way. :)

Nutrition

60/200/250

Training

Glutes and Hams Strength(warm ups excluded)

Low Bar Squats @ 192.2
395 x 5 wow this was a true 5RM lol pretty pleased with over 2x bw for reps :)
365 x 5 had to do a back off the last set murdered me

RDLs
375 x 5 (2 sets)

Occluded Leg Extensions
4 sets

Occluded Leg Curls
4 sets

PAIN!!!!!

Debrief

occlusion is so ridiculous....so ridiculous....

Nice going on the PR man. Sick squatting. And then following with occulsion work. You have a few screws loose, i think. My legs are so freaking sore as it is without the occlusion.......I cant even imagine....:eek:

[JPlevell]

What does occlusion mean? Is that when you hold the weight for a couple seconds at the top before lowering?

[Bnizzle163]

Yes, you most definitely do owe us pics. With all the Shexshay pics I've been sending you, I'd say a whole boatload ;)

[Flynn]

What does occlusion mean? Is that when you hold the weight for a couple seconds at the top before lowering?

Here you go: Occlusion Training - Layne Norton (http://www.ironmanmagazine.com/index.cfm?page=article&go2=1489)

[Quelly]

do you have a link/citation for this paper E?
pm coming sir

DUDE! WTF on those squats & RDL's!?
That's just so cool!

And you wondered if you made any progress...pshhhhh
thanks todd...and logic and doubt don't always mix, you feel me?

Nice going on the PR man. Sick squatting. And then following with occulsion work. You have a few screws loose, i think. My legs are so freaking sore as it is without the occlusion.......I cant even imagine....:eek:
yeah...my legs are sore lol

Yes, you most definitely do owe us pics. With all the Shexshay pics I've been sending you, I'd say a whole boatload ;)
ok ok!

[nads786]

just found this journal, good stuff, subbed!

[Quelly]

seriously good stuff, hats off to Matthew Perryman for this one...btw either read the whole thing or don't read it, don't be ADHD and only get through half...he makes points throughout and challenges what he says earlier with current findings in research....GOOD STUFF
http://www.ampedtraining.com/2011/physique/intensity-training-failure-muscle-gain

[FATHER FLEX]

seriously good stuff, hats off to Matthew Perryman for this one...btw either read the whole thing or don't read it, don't be ADHD and only get through half...he makes points throughout and challenges what he says earlier with current findings in research....GOOD STUFF
http://www.ampedtraining.com/2011/physique/intensity-training-failure-muscle-gain

Nice!

[Shazriki]

seriously good stuff, hats off to Matthew Perryman for this one...btw either read the whole thing or don't read it, don't be ADHD and only get through half...he makes points throughout and challenges what he says earlier with current findings in research....GOOD STUFF
http://www.ampedtraining.com/2011/physique/intensity-training-failure-muscle-gain

Found this very interesting, good post!

[toddbz]

thanks todd...and logic and doubt don't always mix, you feel me?


All the way down to your coin purse. No homo


seriously good stuff, hats off to Matthew Perryman for this one...btw either read the whole thing or don't read it, don't be ADHD and only get through half...he makes points throughout and challenges what he says earlier with current findings in research....GOOD STUFF
http://www.ampedtraining.com/2011/physique/intensity-training-failure-muscle-gain

That dude from Friends is a pretty bright guy.

[FrmrHoss]

Huh, so you did set a pretty ballin PR 8 lbs lighter ;). Color me impressed sir.

[Quelly]

Huh, so you did set a pretty ballin PR 8 lbs lighter ;). Color me impressed sir.

thought i was just making **** up lol?

[devinh]

where's our pics? ...sir

[FrmrHoss]

thought i was just making **** up lol?

Well I mean, there wasn't a video so.... ;)

I actually remembered seeing the 395 set PR in your thread but I didn't put two and two togethr that you were that deep into your diet. Not that 395 isn't impressive however you cut it.

[zmcdole]

seriously good stuff, hats off to Matthew Perryman for this one...btw either read the whole thing or don't read it, don't be ADHD and only get through half...he makes points throughout and challenges what he says earlier with current findings in research....GOOD STUFF
http://www.ampedtraining.com/2011/physique/intensity-training-failure-muscle-gain

Freaking great article!! I'm actually ADD (diagnosed in 1st grade meds until 10th grade) and I was able to read the whole thing!! Haha.

[DREhova 87]

Thanks for posting that link to the article. This thread is always a wealth of knowledge!

[Quelly]

where's our pics? ...sir
probably saturday, been busy as **** today, and it will slow down around early evening tomorrow

Well I mean, there wasn't a video so.... ;)

I actually remembered seeing the 395 set PR in your thread but I didn't put two and two togethr that you were that deep into your diet. Not that 395 isn't impressive however you cut it.
lol...no video didn't happen! I'll take vids next strength glute/ham day (2 weeks) for 405 x 4 (hopefully 4...)

Freaking great article!! I'm actually ADD (diagnosed in 1st grade meds until 10th grade) and I was able to read the whole thing!! Haha.
Nice work! And yeah I loved the article

Thanks for posting that link to the article. This thread is always a wealth of knowledge!
Glad to hear it!

[MKW]

seriously good stuff, hats off to Matthew Perryman for this one...btw either read the whole thing or don't read it, don't be ADHD and only get through half...he makes points throughout and challenges what he says earlier with current findings in research....GOOD STUFF
http://www.ampedtraining.com/2011/physique/intensity-training-failure-muscle-gain

Eric, great article. I have one question though regarding the 30Fail group. At the beginning of the article it describes it as 30% of your 1RM to failure. But then in the conclusion it mentions going 1-2 reps to failure while sprinkling in true failure. In your opinion (or the article's and I just missed it) which is it? I'm curious mainly because I'm doing Layne's power/hyper right now and the hyper days are generally not taken to failure. Just curious where you perceive 1-2 reps shy of failure comes into place in this study.

[Shazriki]

So it's official, we got paired up. Look forward to working with ya!

[Flynn]

Q, when I get out to Sacramento, you have to take me to "Jamie's Bar & Grill". Nothing like good eats at a dive :p.

[Quelly]

Eric, great article. I have one question though regarding the 30Fail group. At the beginning of the article it describes it as 30% of your 1RM to failure. But then in the conclusion it mentions going 1-2 reps to failure while sprinkling in true failure. In your opinion (or the article's and I just missed it) which is it? I'm curious mainly because I'm doing Layne's power/hyper right now and the hyper days are generally not taken to failure. Just curious where you perceive 1-2 reps shy of failure comes into place in this study.
Well, I think you might be overfocusing on the details....there were 3 groups, 90% 1RM to failure, which is basically 3 reps for most people, 30% of 1RM matched to the 90%1RM groups volume...meaning if they did 90lbs (1rm=100) for 3 reps, total volume was 270 (90 x 3), the 30% group did the same 270lbs of volume, just with 30lbs so 30 x 9.
The 30% max group to failure did probably something like 20-40 reps depending on the person, their fiber type dominance and their training history. But, it's less the failure and more the total work that is important here.

The 90% to failure group did a volume of 270lbs (if we assume a 100lbs max for example)
the 30% group did a volume of 270lbs
and the 30% to failure did a volume of 600-1200 (30 x 20-40)

So the big difference here is total work done. Yes, failure might play a role...but its tough to differentiate what's more important. I'd say probably getting reasonably close to failure would do the trick, because that would still train the high threshold motor units as the slow twitch guys fatigued and stopped contributing....but there isn't something magic that happens at the exact moment of momentary muscular failure. 1 rep shy or failure is pretty inconsequential when dealing with such a high rep set and light loads.
I think 1-2 reps shy or to failure with a light load is going to be about the same as far as your body is concerned

So it's official, we got paired up. Look forward to working with ya!
After the goals discussion, I figured we would be best paired together, I figured why call up one of the other coaches and relay everything we'd talked about...so yeah...I made that call :)

Q, when I get out to Sacramento, you have to take me to "Jamie's Bar & Grill". Nothing like good eats at a dive :p.
Dude....I'll have to take me there too, never been! And seriously, if you come out to Sacramento you better look me up!

[jpfaherty]

Dude....I'll have to take me there too, never been!

LOL- Laughed hard at that.

Great Log man, full of so much valuable information. Thanks for taking the time to do it :D It goes a long way for us beginners!

[mivi320]

Haven't popped in here in awhile, things are looking great for you Eric. Really good discussion in here too.

[Quelly]

Intro

Barb and I went to a great couples communication workshop all today and all yesterday. Learned so much about each other, ourselves, and how we can work together more and against each other less. Good stuff based on the MBTI (Myers Briggs Type Indicator) assessment tool.
Anywho, the relevance to my bodybuilding log is that I had to weigh in about 3 hours earlier than I normally do on Saturday, and I weighed 190.0 just like yesterday which was 3 hours later...so I think I'm down another 1lb+ this week. So moving right along. Had a good workout today, and as promised here are my update pics:
http://i423.photobucket.com/albums/pp315/ericrhelms/progress2.jpg

Nutrition

50/500/200

Training

Chest/Back Hypertrophy (warm ups excluded)

DB Chest Press
110's x 12, 8
100's x 9

Incline DB Press
90's x 11

HS Lat Pullover
2pps +5lbs/side x 12, 10

Cable Rows
180 x 8

Face Pulls
80 x 10

Latpulldown on station with handle for each hand
160 x 10

Occluded Pushdowns
4 sets
Occluded Cable Curls
4 sets

Debrief

I think to get as lean as I want might have to see a depleted sub 180

[AllGenetix]

I'm an ENTJ who likes long walks on the beach and cold iron in my hands. Are we compatible?

[Quelly]

I'm an ENTJ who likes long walks on the beach and cold iron in my hands. Are we compatible?

I'm an ENFP who is married and straight...so as long as I'm on top and my wife doesn't know were good

I mean....no.

[foodpr0n]

Fark, E! you're leaning out nicely!!!

I'd say another 5lbs and def @ another 10lbs - you'll be sporting the 'layman' definition of 'cut'.

I think I remember reading ages ago about you saying you hardly get vascular until you reach the single digits? That right?

Lower back is whaaaa atm lol?!?!

AWESOME db pressing too!

[Quelly]

Fark, E! you're leaning out nicely!!!

I'd say another 5lbs and def @ another 10lbs - you'll be sporting the 'layman' definition of 'cut'.

I think I remember reading ages ago about you saying you hardly get vascular until you reach the single digits? That right?

Lower back is whaaaa atm lol?!?!

AWESOME db pressing too!


Yeah I didn't really have bicep veins until I was like 8-9% last time lol, 186-187, when I am actually curling weight I got em right now...but yeah not just walking around

and yeah, I was diced at 180 last time morning weight....not to sure I'd be happy if I was 180 and sporting a layman definition of cut...that would mean 2009-2011 fail at bulk...but honestly....it is kinda looking that way...but maybe I'm just more depleted or something

[foodpr0n]

Yeah I didn't really have bicep veins until I was like 8-9% last time lol, 186-187, when I am actually curling weight I got em right now...but yeah not just walking around

and yeah, I was diced at 180 last time morning weight....not to sure I'd be happy if I was 180 and sporting a layman definition of cut...that would mean 2009-2011 fail at bulk...but honestly....it is kinda looking that way...but maybe I'm just more depleted or something

Lmao - 5lbs for sure...the 10lbs was a safe barrier (that's why it was a 'def'):p

By layman definition I mean farkkking lean btw...thinking 7-8%
Non layman I regard as that 'bb'er lean that once reached thinks 8% is fat'

^You'll hit that @ 180+ then. Sorry about that :D

[Quelly]

Lmao - 5lbs for sure...the 10lbs was a safe barrier (that's why it was a 'def'):p

By layman definition I mean farkkking lean btw...thinking 7-8%
Non layman I regard as that 'bb'er lean that once reached thinks 8% is fat'

^You'll hit that @ 180+ then. Sorry about that :D

let's hope brother...let's hope lol

[DREhova 87]

Wish I was remotely as lean as you are right now. Great strengf on the presses! Are you going to incorporate a lot more occlusion training?

[Quelly]

Wish I was remotely as lean as you are right now. Great strengf on the presses! Are you going to incorporate a lot more occlusion training?

legs and arms 2x/week 4 sets each muscle group from here on out :)

[DREhova 87]

legs and arms 2x/week 4 sets each muscle group from here on out :)

your using wrist wraps to occlude yeah? Must have had a pretty good convo with Layne about it when he was down. So being that its 4 sets I am assuming that it does not have to be as many sets as he suggested in order for it to be effective?

[Quelly]

your using wrist wraps to occlude yeah? Must have had a pretty good convo with Layne about it when he was down. So being that its 4 sets I am assuming that it does not have to be as many sets as he suggested in order for it to be effective?

I use wrist wraps for my arms, knee wraps for my legs, great convo with layne, and the answer isn't that clear cut. Depends on what level of volume tolerance you have among other things. I decided to simply follow the protocol from the study on rugby players who had weight training experience.

[Flynn]

OK, who keeps abs like that all the time. Yes, hating!


....not to sure I'd be happy if I was 180 and sporting a layman definition of cut...that would mean 2009-2011 fail at bulk...but honestly....it is kinda looking that way...but maybe I'm just more depleted or something

With respect, get out of your head :p. And, if it did occur, it would not necessary be considered a failure. As an example, after nearly the same period, Tommy competed lighter (I believe about 6lbs) than when he won his pro card but came-in much harder, grainier, etc. Don't see why you cannot do the same!

[FATHER FLEX]

OK, who keeps abs like that all the time. Yes, hating!



With respect, get out of your head :p. And, if it did occur, it would not necessary be considered a failure. As an example, after nearly the same period, Tommy competed lighter (I believe about 6lbs) than when he won his pro card but came-in much harder, grainier, etc. Don't see why you cannot do the same!

Agree Tommy went from peeled, to certified shredded! One thing Eric forgets(and we all loose our minds a bit, I did this last week) is that he hold on to fat very evenly. So right until he is 7-8 over shredded it looks like he is carrying a little layer film, and then BOOM you get nasty hard looking.

Big changes this year is that we are really focusing on not allowing for a metabolic crash, sure you can will yourself to get peeled, but if we get him to 3-4 pounds away from shredded with 80-90% of his starting dieting calories in tact, then we did a good job and can push for the look he is going for. The Paul Iatomasi look which I hear is in again this year.

[Quelly]

OK, who keeps abs like that all the time. Yes, hating!



With respect, get out of your head :p. And, if it did occur, it would not necessary be considered a failure. As an example, after nearly the same period, Tommy competed lighter (I believe about 6lbs) than when he won his pro card but came-in much harder, grainier, etc. Don't see why you cannot do the same!


Agree Tommy went from peeled, to certified shredded! One thing Eric forgets(and we all loose our minds a bit, I did this last week) is that he hold on to fat very evenly. So right until he is 7-8 over shredded it looks like he is carrying a little layer film, and then BOOM you get nasty hard looking.

Big changes this year is that we are really focusing on not allowing for a metabolic crash, sure you can will yourself to get peeled, but if we get him to 3-4 pounds away from shredded with 80-90% of his starting dieting calories in tact, then we did a good job and can push for the look he is going for. The Paul Iatomasi look which I hear is in again this year.

thank you gentlemen, as long as I look better than last time and come in harder and more diced, than that's all I care about in the end lol...weight definitely plays mind games with me

[DREhova 87]

Does the actual losing fat for competition get any easier the 2nd time around? Or is it just trying to stay leaner in the offseason when I comes time to shredding down? The reason I ask...is because with me...if I ever do a competition its almost like I feel I would have to start prepping a year out with how my metabolism reacts. :(