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moosecakes4all
07-13-2010, 02:24 PM
We should have a solid thread for all of us Pre meds and current med students to discuss everything from the application process to what classes we are taking to how to study for the MCAT.

All pre-health students and current health care providers are welcome too!!!

Enjoy!
O2_lgu9Ml_M

r0bo
07-13-2010, 02:24 PM
premeds are homos

wildphucker
07-13-2010, 02:31 PM
I do med in australia but similar stuff to MCAT(yes have looked at MCAT smaples)

moosecakes4all
07-13-2010, 02:31 PM
I do med in australia but similar stuff to MCAT(yes have looked at MCAT smaples)

Nice man, whats the schooling system like there?

flexbrah
07-13-2010, 02:33 PM
i'm in on this thread. what classes are you guys taking in the fall? i'm taking (2nd year undergrad):
- biochem
- genetics
- organic 2 lab
- virology
- survey of human diseases
- and a bs ancient history class lol

i think i'm gonna take an MCAT class in the fall or spring and take the actual MCAT shortly after that. any suggestions on which prep course is most helpful?

wildphucker
07-13-2010, 02:34 PM
Nice man, whats the schooling system like there?

grad med is a bit less stressful. Pass/fail, no grades.


So you just gotta pass and youre a doctor no matter what actual score you got(of course, you still gotta go through residency and shiz)


Still as youre aware, they do throw a crazy amount of info at you in a short amount of time

r0bo
07-13-2010, 02:38 PM
i'm in on this thread. what classes are you guys taking in the fall? i'm taking (2nd year undergrad):
- biochem
- genetics
- organic 2 lab
- virology
- survey of human diseases
- and a bs ancient history class lol

vandenberg is a dinosaur and uses an overhead projector still..don't buy the book for virology either its useless..he tests you on the stupid little differences too so focus on those and the class is easy
biochem and genetics are easy too..if you have merkler for biochem he can be a dick

moosecakes4all
07-13-2010, 02:38 PM
i'm in on this thread. what classes are you guys taking in the fall? i'm taking (2nd year undergrad):
- biochem
- genetics
- organic 2 lab
- virology
- survey of human diseases
- and a bs ancient history class lol


Im taking both semesters of Organic chem and lab right now over the summer. Just finished semester one and got an A in both classes!!!

Fall semester:

Cell biology
Neuroscience
Calculus 2
Biochemistry
Persuasive writing

Youve got a solid schedule there brah!



Thats pretty cool how its pass fail over there in Au. What year are you in now?

flexbrah
07-13-2010, 02:40 PM
vandenberg is a dinosaur and uses an overhead projector still..don't buy the book for virology either its useless..he tests you on the stupid little differences too so focus on those and the class is easy
biochem and genetics are easy too..if you have merkler for biochem he can be a dick

haha vandenbergh is pretty cool. i have him for microbio right now... he reads straight off his notes but his stories about working in the field is actually really interesting. its the only reason i come to class anymore haha. i think i have some chick for biochem, she's supposed to be borderline retarded... i don't know if thats a good thing or bad lol.

r0bo
07-13-2010, 02:43 PM
haha vandenbergh is pretty cool. i have him for microbio right now... he reads straight off his notes but his stories about working in the field is actually really interesting. its the only reason i come to class anymore haha. i think i have some chick for biochem, she's supposed to be borderline retarded... i don't know if thats a good thing or bad lol.

dr l prob..she is real easy..i had her for biochem 1 and merkler for advanced biochem
yeah his stores are great..vandenberg is like a fking millionaire and just teaches now for the lulz

flexbrah
07-13-2010, 02:45 PM
Im taking both semesters of Organic chem and lab right now over the summer. Just finished semester one and got an A in both classes!!!

Fall semester:

Cell biology
Neuroscience
Calculus 2
Biochemistry
Persuasive writing

Youve got a solid schedule there brah!



Thats pretty cool how its pass fail over there in Au. What year are you in now?

ah GJDM! congrats! i don't think i've ever studied as much as i did for organic 1 and 2. i ended up with an A in orgo 1, but orgo 2 i got a B- :(... the ACS final absolutely wrecked my grade. my prof didn't prepare us for it very well. for instance: the numbers/values for NMR/mass spec/IR spec that he taught us were different from the actual ACS values. the ones we used were rounded. oh well, at least i'm done with that god forsaken class haha

Strengthftw
07-13-2010, 02:47 PM
studentdoctor.net forums, probably the best forum/site for all your doctor needs

flexbrah
07-13-2010, 02:48 PM
dr l prob..she is real easy..i had her for biochem 1 and merkler for advanced biochem
yeah his stores are great..vandenberg is like a fking millionaire and just teaches now for the lulz

ah good to know. i was hoping my biochem prof wouldn't be too tough, since its a 8am class.

moosecakes4all
07-13-2010, 02:53 PM
ah GJDM! congrats! i don't think i've ever studied as much as i did for organic 1 and 2. i ended up with an A in orgo 1, but orgo 2 i got a B- :(... the ACS final absolutely wrecked my grade. my prof didn't prepare us for it very well. for instance: the numbers/values for NMR/mass spec/IR spec that he taught us were different from the actual ACS values. the ones we used were rounded. oh well, at least i'm done with that god forsaken class haha

Ive got to take the ACS final too. Im studying for it already with the ACS study guide booklet.

flexbrah
07-13-2010, 03:03 PM
Ive got to take the ACS final too. Im studying for it already with the ACS study guide booklet.

gl brah!

Maestro
07-13-2010, 03:07 PM
We should have a solid thread for all of us Pre meds and current med students to discuss everything from the application process to what classes we are taking to how to study for the MCAT.
Enjoy!
O2_lgu9Ml_M

videos like that are fascinating.

Even after taking anatomy, I never quite understood exactly how you can tell what is where when you're opening say, an abdominal cavity. Sure you can make out organs and whatnot but if you're looking for something obscure that has the same general pinkish red color soaked in blood how do you know you're cutting out the right thing?

I guess thats why i'm sticking to Pharmacy.

r0bo
07-13-2010, 03:08 PM
ah GJDM! congrats! i don't think i've ever studied as much as i did for organic 1 and 2. i ended up with an A in orgo 1, but orgo 2 i got a B- :(... the ACS final absolutely wrecked my grade. my prof didn't prepare us for it very well. for instance: the numbers/values for NMR/mass spec/IR spec that he taught us were different from the actual ACS values. the ones we used were rounded. oh well, at least i'm done with that god forsaken class haha

lulz yeah that test was dumb..i had like 2 questions on nomenclature and spent like half the class on that ****..i do research in fcoe-bitt proteomics lab and gonna be in an epigenetics lab in the fall also, if you want some help getting into a lab or something..premeds tend to not get chosen so if you wanna do research don't tell them you want to go to med school lulz

moosecakes4all
07-13-2010, 03:12 PM
videos like that are fascinating.

Even after taking anatomy, I never quite understood exactly how you can tell what is where when you're opening say, an abdominal cavity. Sure you can make out organs and whatnot but if you're looking for something obscure that has the same general pinkish red color soaked in blood how do you know you're cutting out the right thing?

I guess thats why i'm sticking to Pharmacy.

Lots and lots of training man. It takes a very keen eye and swift hands to be a surgeon. Not to mention the neurosurgery residency is almost 7-10 years, AFTER youve spent 8 years in undergrad and med school.

Emperador
07-13-2010, 03:16 PM
I was thinking about becoming a doctor, I'm really good with dissection and stuff, and I got 100% in anatomy. I'm not sure if I still want to be though. :/

moosecakes4all
07-13-2010, 03:22 PM
I was thinking about becoming a doctor, I'm really good with dissection and stuff, and I got 100% in anatomy. I'm not sure if I still want to be though. :/

Its a lot of work for sure, but if your passionate about it it will pay off huge in the end.

flexbrah
07-13-2010, 03:26 PM
lulz yeah that test was dumb..i had like 2 questions on nomenclature and spent like half the class on that ****..i do research in fcoe-bitt proteomics lab and gonna be in an epigenetics lab in the fall also, if you want some help getting into a lab or something..premeds tend to not get chosen so if you wanna do research don't tell them you want to go to med school lulz

that's awesome man, how are you liking it? and thanks for the tip!! it's appreciated! i'm gonna try to get into the undergraduate research in the fall also. i'll definitely keep that in mind.

Emperador
07-13-2010, 03:34 PM
Its a lot of work for sure, but if your passionate about it it will pay off huge in the end.

Yeah I know, I love helping people and all that good stuff, but I can't really "buckle down" and tell myself it's what I want to do. I mean 12 years of school kinda blows, but the rewards are great. I'm split between being a doctor and being an astronaut.

On top of that, most of the doctors that I've talked to say they really "overqualify" you for the job. Half the stuff they learned in college they've never used.

wildphucker
07-13-2010, 03:36 PM
Yeah I know, I love helping people and all that good stuff, but I can't really "buckle down" and tell myself it's what I want to do. I mean 12 years of school kinda blows, but the rewards are great. I'm split between being a doctor and being an astronaut.

On top of that, most of the doctors that I've talked to say they really "overqualify" you for the job. Half the stuff they learned in college they've never used.

Wouldnt you want that though?


Imagine being faced with some situation you had no idea how to handle as a doctor.....shtd get real son

moosecakes4all
07-13-2010, 03:42 PM
Yeah I know, I love helping people and all that good stuff, but I can't really "buckle down" and tell myself it's what I want to do. I mean 12 years of school kinda blows, but the rewards are great. I'm split between being a doctor and being an astronaut.

On top of that, most of the doctors that I've talked to say they really "overqualify" you for the job. Half the stuff they learned in college they've never used.

They do overqualify you for sure. Its to weed out the weak from the strong willed. They dont want those people who are in it for the money alone, they want to people who really want it. If you think about it, the 8 years of college are not that bad. These days more and more high paying jobs require a masters (6 years of college total), and your last 2 med school years are all on the job training essentially.

rampagefc77
07-13-2010, 04:41 PM
FWIW- I am a current PA (physician assistant) student. I dabbled with the idea of med school for a while but for a number of reasons I chose the PA profession (if you are interested in specifics I can go into it). Feel free to ask me any questions regarding the medical field, PA/med school (I literally take about 25% of my courses with the med students on campus including pharm, some of the systems courses, etc.).

My background- I graduated undergrad with a cumulative 4.0 and had 5 years of work experience in radiology. I started PA school 3 weeks after I graduated from undergrad and I'm almost done with my first block of courses.

My experiences in PA school- **** hits the fan quick. PA school is a 2 year masters and we literally cover 2.5 years of med school in a year. I cover the same anatomy/phys topics in 8 weeks that the med students cover in the better part of their first year. Med students in general have a bit more time and are out of class by 12-1 tops each day, but the amount of detailed information you cover is intense. I'm in class from 8-5 daily and study another 6+ hours each night just to still fall behind... there's literally no way to keep up with everything. There's a lot of pump and dump goin on but exams are fair and most in my class are doing extremely well.

Any specific questions let me know, Ill try to check back here regularly.

Emperador
07-13-2010, 05:06 PM
FWIW- I am a current PA (physician assistant) student. I dabbled with the idea of med school for a while but for a number of reasons I chose the PA profession (if you are interested in specifics I can go into it). Feel free to ask me any questions regarding the medical field, PA/med school (I literally take about 25% of my courses with the med students on campus including pharm, some of the systems courses, etc.).

My background- I graduated undergrad with a cumulative 4.0 and had 5 years of work experience in radiology. I started PA school 3 weeks after I graduated from undergrad and I'm almost done with my first block of courses.

My experiences in PA school- **** hits the fan quick. PA school is a 2 year masters and we literally cover 2.5 years of med school in a year. I cover the same anatomy/phys topics in 8 weeks that the med students cover in the better part of their first year. Med students in general have a bit more time and are out of class by 12-1 tops each day, but the amount of detailed information you cover is intense. I'm in class from 8-5 daily and study another 6+ hours each night just to still fall behind... there's literally no way to keep up with everything. There's a lot of pump and dump goin on but exams are fair and most in my class are doing extremely well.

Any specific questions let me know, Ill try to check back here regularly.

Where are you attending college? I found out two days ago that PSU is charging 6.0% more for NO REASON.

Tuition has more than doubled in the past 10 years....

scam/10

rampagefc77
07-13-2010, 05:14 PM
Where are you attending college? I found out two days ago that PSU is charging 6.0% more for NO REASON.

Tuition has more than doubled in the past 10 years....

scam/10

I go to Des Moines University-- It's a small private Med school that only offers graduate medical degrees. I was accepted at every school I applied to which included more well known schools like university of wisconsin, etc. but DMU blew me away so it was a no brainer.

Piece of advice to those applying to schools, wait to make your decision about where you want to go after checking out multiple schools. You may be surprised which school feels like the best fit for you.

HoldOn
07-13-2010, 05:18 PM
Yeah I know, I love helping people and all that good stuff, but I can't really "buckle down" and tell myself it's what I want to do. I mean 12 years of school kinda blows, but the rewards are great. I'm split between being a doctor and being an astronaut.

On top of that, most of the doctors that I've talked to say they really "overqualify" you for the job. Half the stuff they learned in college they've never used.

you genuis grade? acing a college anatomy course in high school. impressive. took anatomy this year as a senior but it doesnt compare to the legit **** in college/med school from what iv heard.

thinking of going pre-med or research as well. Just signed up/am signing up now for classes actually. any tips on labs/classes to be wary of?

bas0912
07-13-2010, 05:22 PM
not trying to be a doctor but a pharmacist. Taking the PCAT in august hopefully ill do good
classes next semester are

Quant. Analysis
Micro
Cell physiology
history of music

rampagefc77
07-13-2010, 05:33 PM
thinking of going pre-med or research as well. Just signed up/am signing up now for classes actually. any tips on labs/classes to be wary of?

Classes are completely dependent on the professor. Undergrad really isn't too complex and the pace is a slow walk in the park compared to grad school so you should be fine. I found labs to be a waste of life and dreaded the weekly lab reports/quizzes/exams....

Enter undergrad with good study habits form day 1. Take a little time each night to go through everything, and start really studying for an exam 3ish days before the test. My plan in undergrad was to always overstudy for the first exam or 2 until I knew how the professor tested. After that I would slack where I could.

HoldOn
07-13-2010, 05:36 PM
Classes are completely dependent on the professor. Undergrad really isn't too complex and the pace is a slow walk in the park compared to grad school so you should be fine. I found labs to be a waste of life and dreaded the weekly lab reports/quizzes/exams....

Enter undergrad with good study habits form day 1. Take a little time each night to go through everything, and start really studying for an exam 3ish days before the test. My plan in undergrad was to always overstudy for the first exam or 2 until I knew how the professor tested. After that I would slack where I could.

ah thanks. that's actually really helpful. signed up for the right classes it seems though i am worried about the whole professor thing.

how much work do you get on average?

rampagefc77
07-13-2010, 05:40 PM
ah thanks. that's actually really helpful. signed up for the right classes it seems though i am worried about the whole professor thing.

how much work do you get on average?

Again it's completely variable on the class, the professor, your abilities, etc. Some classes are cake and you will cruise through them. Others you will bust your ass because you want the A. It's important to realize that there is tremendous competition for graduate medical degrees. I don't know the numbers for med school but for PA school most schools have 1500+ applicants for 20-50 spots.

Nonopb
07-13-2010, 06:25 PM
Did not take the MCAT
Premed next year (starting in august)
Med in two years

Hell yeah

moosecakes4all
07-13-2010, 08:15 PM
Good posts guys! Im curious as to why you chose PA school, if you dont mind listing a few of the big reasons. I ask because I havent even looked at in the slightest bit. I
m dead set on neursurg. but its really informative to hear where others are coming from.



Did not take the MCAT
Premed next year (starting in august)
Med in two years

Hell yeah
Good luck brah. My only advice is to put for 100% effort at all times. Your going to have to make tough decisions like not going to that party or doing lots of the activities you like to do, at least not nearly as frequent. But in the end it will pay off big time.

lifeguard_man
07-13-2010, 08:22 PM
not trying to be a doctor but a pharmacist. Taking the PCAT in august hopefully ill do good
classes next semester are

Quant. Analysis
Micro
Cell physiology
history of music

Me too, I'm pretty nervous for the PCAT. I think I am going to sign up for the January one soon so I can get in at least 1 semester of organic chemistry before writing it. How is your average?

This semester looks like

Organic Chemistry I
Physical Chemistry I
Food Safety Microbiology
Ecology
Composition (English)

Strive6
07-13-2010, 08:29 PM
I've seen a few of you guys over at SDN

I graduated college in 2008, just finished a Masters in Medical Sciences in May and now I'm applying to med school.... also currently studying to re-take the MCAT July 29th (my score from 2007 expired at some schools). At first I was really pissed I had to re-take, but I'm scoring significantly better than in '07 so I'm happy.

rampagefc77
07-13-2010, 08:35 PM
For med school-- do not overestimate your income and underestimate your expenses to get to that point... Most med students I know come out of school with 250K+ in debt... with an interest rate ranging from 6.8 to 8.0+ percent (you can only get so much stafford, the rest is grad plus at a crazy interest rate and fee on dispersal).
Assuming an average interest rate of 7.0% (low estimate) that means that you will pay over 17K a year in interest alone... or well over 1K a month in interest alone. Typically you get 10 years to pay off loans, which would mean another 2+ grand each month. Many doctors start in the low to mid 100s tops (internal med, family practice, peds, others)... that type of income could barely fend off the debt... If you want to make med school financially worthwhile you will probably need to specialize, which means longer residencies and more competition.

A lot of people say "just wait until the payoff in the end!!" when you dont realize that you are basically giving away the best years of your life to become ridiculously in debt for a salary that isn't what it used to be...

(a lot of this played into my decision to be a PA FYI)

wrestle445
07-13-2010, 08:44 PM
For med school-- do not overestimate your income and underestimate your expenses to get to that point... Most med students I know come out of school with 250K+ in debt... with an interest rate ranging from 6.8 to 8.0+ percent (you can only get so much stafford, the rest is grad plus at a crazy interest rate and fee on dispersal).
Assuming an average interest rate of 7.0% (low estimate) that means that you will pay over 17K a year in interest alone... or well over 1K a month in interest alone. Typically you get 10 years to pay off loans, which would mean another 2+ grand each month. Many doctors start in the low to mid 100s tops (internal med, family practice, peds, others)... that type of income could barely fend off the debt... If you want to make med school financially worthwhile you will probably need to specialize, which means longer residencies and more competition.

A lot of people say "just wait until the payoff in the end!!" when you dont realize that you are basically giving away the best years of your life to become ridiculously in debt for a salary that isn't what it used to be...

(a lot of this played into my decision to be a PA FYI)

DOn't neuro surgeons (in OP) make like a million dollars a year? lol

Maestro
07-13-2010, 08:51 PM
Me too, I'm pretty nervous for the PCAT. I think I am going to sign up for the January one soon so I can get in at least 1 semester of organic chemistry before writing it. How is your average?

This semester looks like

Organic Chemistry I
Physical Chemistry I
Food Safety Microbiology
Ecology
Composition (English)

Just a heads up. If you plan on going to Pharmacy school in the US you may need to take a different microbiology course.

I took a "Allied Health Microbiology" (the micro course required for nursing school) and there were a few schools that didn't accept it. I had to take a General Microbiology course. What pissed me off is the the General micro class wasn't much different from the allied course. We used the same book but we were tested on more of the chemical aspects of microorganisms in the cell.

rampagefc77
07-13-2010, 08:51 PM
DOn't neuro surgeons (in OP) make like a million dollars a year? lol

The higher end of doctor salaries are in the 500K-1 million but that is EXTREMELY rare. Not to mention if you want to be a neuro surgeon expect a ridiculously long residency, followed by fellowships. Some of the longer residencies/fellowships are another 6-9 years AFTER med school. The competition to get into neurosurgery will be tremendous and the stress/hours associated with it would suck imo. If you are the best/brightest and can make it happen, then there could be a payout in the end for sure. Out of school you probably need to put in your time before you become a partner also, so dont expect partner salary when you are the low man on the totem pole.

Maestro
07-13-2010, 08:55 PM
DOn't neuro surgeons (in OP) make like a million dollars a year? lol

not that much, about half that. Unfortunately A lot of it is sapped through malpractice insurance and the raping you'll get in taxes.

lifeguard_man
07-13-2010, 08:55 PM
Just a heads up. If you plan on going to Pharmacy school in the US you may need to take a different microbiology course.



Thanks for the heads up. However that will be my third microbiology course, one of them should be up to standard.

Strive6
07-13-2010, 09:03 PM
A lot of people say "just wait until the payoff in the end!!" when you dont realize that you are basically giving away the best years of your life to become ridiculously in debt for a salary that isn't what it used to be...

Wow, now I see why you didn't go to med school. I'd hope that the majority of people who go to medical school want to be there, and don't regret 'giving away' the best years of their life to become a respected medical professional. Anyone who goes into medicine to become wealthy is going to be miserable.

TheCurator
07-13-2010, 09:05 PM
Might start med next year, still waiting for interviews to be handed out... did f*ck all to prep for my GAMSAT and still managed to ace it (no e-brag).

moosecakes4all
07-13-2010, 09:09 PM
Neurosurgery is anywhere from 350k to 1.2mil and up.
Academic neursurgery will get you, on average, mid career at 500k per year. going up to maybe 700-750k per year towards the end of the career with more teaching and administrative duties. Im interested in academic neurosurgery. Those guys making 1mil plus are almost always within lucrative private practices, often spending most of the day placing stents in fat old men's heads. Not that its a bad gig (by any stretch), but the academic setting is what really peaks my interest.
The residency is anywhere from 7-10 years. Not toooo bad considering general surg is 5-6 years.

When i say "it will pay off in the end" i dont mean financially. No one should go into medicine for the money, because contrary to popular belief, for most doctors, the money just isnt there. Not in the quanitites that most make it sound like it is anyways. The pay off is a job you love and enjoy.

wildphucker
07-13-2010, 09:10 PM
Might start med next year, still waiting for interviews to be handed out... did f*ck all to prep for my GAMSAT and still managed to ace it (no e-brag).

brah are you a usyder?

you only 20 brah? young med student is young


btw on neurosurgery, yeah neurosurgeons are always gonna ball big time, but you gotta remember its a 7 year residency! You earn a telemarketers wage durin residency.......


But you can always still call yourself Dr and get poon

wildphucker
07-13-2010, 09:12 PM
Wow, now I see why you didn't go to med school. I'd hope that the majority of people who go to medical school want to be there, and don't regret 'giving away' the best years of their life to become a respected medical professional. Anyone who goes into medicine to become wealthy is going to be miserable.

This


what else would you be doing?

If you dont go to med school, youd be workin full time anyway.....cant see how thats better

TheCurator
07-13-2010, 09:13 PM
brah are you a usyder?

you only 20 brah? young med student is young

Yep, 3rd year B.sc at usyd. Might do an honours year, so ill be either 21 or 22 when I start... so not that young :P

which uni are you at?

moosecakes4all
07-13-2010, 09:17 PM
brah are you a usyder?

you only 20 brah? young med student is young


btw on neurosurgery, yeah neurosurgeons are always gonna ball big time, but you gotta remember its a 7 year residency! You earn a telemarketers wage durin residency.......


But you can always still call yourself Dr and get poon

Lol ya, Im not worried about the residency wage in the least bit. 40k will be more then enough for me, considering i will have sold my soul to the hospital. Itll afford me my apartment, internet, food for home, and insurance payments with PLENTY to spare. Food is free at the hospital for residents (theres a limit, but its very generous). Any free day i get ill probably end up spending sleeping or studying for tomorrows cases. Thats ok with me, in fact i prefer that. Its not a specialty fit for everyone, but suits my personality and aspirations beautifully.

wildphucker
07-13-2010, 09:25 PM
Lol ya, Im not worried about the residency wage in the least bit. 40k will be more then enough for me, considering i will have sold my soul to the hospital. Itll afford me my apartment, internet, food for home, and insurance payments with PLENTY to spare. Food is free at the hospital for residents (theres a limit, but its very generous). Any free day i get ill probably end up spending sleeping or studying for tomorrows cases. Thats ok with me, in fact i prefer that. Its not a specialty fit for everyone, but suits my personality and aspirations beautifully.

but bro, you will still need insurance as a resident.

its no prob for a neurosurgeon who earns a small fortune, but as a resident, you dont have the luxury of massive malpractise insurance.

wildphucker
07-13-2010, 09:27 PM
Yep, 3rd year B.sc at usyd. Might do an honours year, so ill be either 21 or 22 when I start... so not that young :P

which uni are you at?

Newcastle, but at newcastle you can go straight to med as an undergrad or just transfer over..... its called B Med here, not MBBS.

You can be in and out in as little as 5 years. Newcastle isnt as prestigious, but your title is still Dr at the end no matter where you went

moosecakes4all
07-13-2010, 09:32 PM
but bro, you will still need insurance as a resident.

its no prob for a neurosurgeon who earns a small fortune, but as a resident, you dont have the luxury of massive malpractise insurance.

Generally in america the malpractice insurance is factored into your salary by the hospital... As a resident it is significantly lower then as an attending since you are so limited as to what you are allowed to do, but an attending neurosurgeon can expect to pay 200k for malpractice insurance alone. That money, in most cases, the surgeon doesnt even touch, it goes directly from each paycheck to the insurance company.

TheCurator
07-13-2010, 09:42 PM
Newcastle, but at newcastle you can go straight to med as an undergrad or just transfer over..... its called B Med here, not MBBS.

You can be in and out in as little as 5 years. Newcastle isnt as prestigious, but your title is still Dr at the end no matter where you went

I was told that most uni's are planning on phasing the undergrad MBBS programs out in favour of post-grad ones, have you heard anything about that?

wildphucker
07-13-2010, 09:45 PM
I was told that most uni's are planning on phasing the undergrad MBBS programs out in favour of post-grad ones, have you heard anything about that?

havent heard but its a good idea.....here you can practise medicine at like 23.....I honestly do not believe in this at all, no way is a person mentally ready to be a doctor at this age

TheCurator
07-13-2010, 09:54 PM
havent heard but its a good idea.....here you can practise medicine at like 23.....I honestly do not believe in this at all, no way is a person mentally ready to be a doctor at this age

Agree 100%

Not to mention getting patient respect at that age would pretty much be impossible. Who's going to listen to a 23 year old?

stevematic
07-13-2010, 10:37 PM
I was told that most uni's are planning on phasing the undergrad MBBS programs out in favour of post-grad ones, have you heard anything about that?

i heard they're going to be phased out in 2013. can't be too sure though.

low blow
07-13-2010, 11:24 PM
This


what else would you be doing?

If you dont go to med school, youd be workin full time anyway.....cant see how thats better


Yep, 3rd year B.sc at usyd. Might do an honours year, so ill be either 21 or 22 when I start... so not that young :P

which uni are you at?

boys

I'm doing a science degree right now

now youve stopped laughing, do you think a mid D (79 avg @ unsw) can cope with the med work load?

its something im thinking about

TheCurator
07-14-2010, 01:14 AM
boys

I'm doing a science degree right now

now youve stopped laughing, do you think a mid D (79 avg @ unsw) can cope with the med work load?

its something im thinking about

What am I laughing about? I'm a science student as well.

79 is a good average though. As for the workload, it's like anything else; you put in the time and effort and you'll get the results.

low blow
07-14-2010, 02:33 AM
What am I laughing about? I'm a science student as well.

79 is a good average though. As for the workload, it's like anything else; you put in the time and effort and you'll get the results.

i thought you were doing med, my bad

med seems ape **** hard, i gave my avg to see if there was a comparability with the workload

rampagefc77
07-14-2010, 05:25 AM
Wow, now I see why you didn't go to med school. I'd hope that the majority of people who go to medical school want to be there, and don't regret 'giving away' the best years of their life to become a respected medical professional. Anyone who goes into medicine to become wealthy is going to be miserable.

Most of the doctors I shadowed were either miserable or would say that if they could do it again, they wouldn't (How do you think I heard about the PA profession in the first place?). Medicine isn't what it used to be and the time and debt load is crazy. Maybe 'giving away the best years' is a bit much, but while everyone else is enjoying their 20s and early 30s, you will be studying and working 80+ hours in a hospital, only to come out with a mountain of debt.

You are correct though, do not go into medicine for the money.

rampagefc77
07-14-2010, 05:32 AM
This


what else would you be doing?

If you dont go to med school, youd be workin full time anyway.....cant see how thats better

You are underestimating the intensity of med school/PA school. Every waking moment is spent in class or studying. Occasionally after an exam I will grab some food/drinks for maybe 2 hours with some friends but then its back to the books.

One of my big deals with choosing PA school was that in med school, I wouldn't have any say about what I did for another 8+ years. Every day would be structured, and filled to the brim. If you work full time, you 1) have money and 2) have free time once you leave work to enjoy yourself. Neither of those happen while in school.

For me, I'll leaving PA school with 45K in debt just before I turn 25 and will probably start (depending on field/state) at 80K+ (I know people that have start from 70-130K depending on field and location). Most PAs I know make 100K+ within a few years out of school, and many make more than family practice/nonspecialty physicians.

Not trying to be negative here with my comments, just realistic about what your lifestyle will be like. I love the material Im learning, but it drains on your after a while.

rampagefc77
07-14-2010, 05:38 AM
Lol ya, Im not worried about the residency wage in the least bit. 40k will be more then enough for me, considering i will have sold my soul to the hospital. Itll afford me my apartment, internet, food for home, and insurance payments with PLENTY to spare. Food is free at the hospital for residents (theres a limit, but its very generous). Any free day i get ill probably end up spending sleeping or studying for tomorrows cases. Thats ok with me, in fact i prefer that. Its not a specialty fit for everyone, but suits my personality and aspirations beautifully.

There are many perks to doing rotations/being a resident, one of them being free food! One thing to consider though is that your loans accumulate interest from day 1 of school, and if you are paying 15K in interest a year, then that 40K salary (after taxes) will not come close to covering that after living expenses. So you can get another 60K in debt from the interest alone while doing a residency.

TheVM
07-14-2010, 06:48 AM
Just don't be a PCP or Internist please

isym
07-14-2010, 06:54 AM
woo emt student here!!! then paramedics!!!


rofl u guys are way above me :P

moosecakes4all
07-14-2010, 07:49 AM
There are many perks to doing rotations/being a resident, one of them being free food! One thing to consider though is that your loans accumulate interest from day 1 of school, and if you are paying 15K in interest a year, then that 40K salary (after taxes) will not come close to covering that after living expenses. So you can get another 60K in debt from the interest alone while doing a residency.

I am EXTREMELY fortunate to have fairly wealthy parents. They never helped me out financially up until this point (I put 50k into a car in 2 years as the manager of jiffy lube while in highschool). They wanted to teach me financial responsibility and it worked excellently. I have run 3 successful small businesses to this point. But now that college has started they are paying my tuition completely, as well as my dorm and caf. fees. Anything extra i want i have to sell and trade car stuff, make some profit and buy it myself. But they have agreed to pay for all the med school. They just want me to concentrate on my grades and not worry about having to work, which i am eternally grateful for. So my situation is certainly an exception. I absolutely hate loans and interest, hence i never barrow any money from anyone, for any reason. The problem with this much schooling is that for 90% of americans its just an unavoidable reality of obtaining a higher education. Its sad because it sends people who would have made an absolutely phenomenal doctor away from the profession. Accumulating 200k of debt, that continues to grow from interest has got to be one of the most depressing feelings ever.

And I dont think anyone is getting upset that your being "negative". We are thankful that you are tossing out options for us. I, for one, had no idea PA made nearly that much money. If I wasnt interested in spending 7 years as a resident and was considering something like peds or family med i would certainly lay my "MD ego" down and go to PA school. It just makes more sense IMO!

Kataz
07-14-2010, 09:12 AM
I'd want to be a doctor but A: I don't like people. and B: ever since my philosophy class I don't feel its right to get rich off others suffering. So I guess If I decide to goto Med school next fall (accepted at my Univs Med school) I guess Ill have to do some non profit stuff.

Though as of last semester (right after being accepted) I found I like microbiology much more than doctor stuff. What a waste of money on the MCAT lol

rampagefc77
07-14-2010, 10:20 AM
I am EXTREMELY fortunate to have fairly wealthy parents. They never helped me out financially up until this point (I put 50k into a car in 2 years as the manager of jiffy lube while in highschool). They wanted to teach me financial responsibility and it worked excellently. I have run 3 successful small businesses to this point. But now that college has started they are paying my tuition completely, as well as my dorm and caf. fees. Anything extra i want i have to sell and trade car stuff, make some profit and buy it myself. But they have agreed to pay for all the med school. They just want me to concentrate on my grades and not worry about having to work, which i am eternally grateful for. So my situation is certainly an exception. I absolutely hate loans and interest, hence i never barrow any money from anyone, for any reason. The problem with this much schooling is that for 90% of americans its just an unavoidable reality of obtaining a higher education. Its sad because it sends people who would have made an absolutely phenomenal doctor away from the profession. Accumulating 200k of debt, that continues to grow from interest has got to be one of the most depressing feelings ever.

And I dont think anyone is getting upset that your being "negative". We are thankful that you are tossing out options for us. I, for one, had no idea PA made nearly that much money. If I wasnt interested in spending 7 years as a resident and was considering something like peds or family med i would certainly lay my "MD ego" down and go to PA school. It just makes more sense IMO!

Sounds like you have a prime situation and med school would be great for you. Many people (including myself at first) have no idea what the role of a PA is. Depending on your experience and the field, you can have tremendous autonomy. It isn't uncommon for rural ERs to only have a PA on staff with a supervising physician 200 miles away available for consult by phone. The name 'assistant' is misleading because you really do not function in an assistant role, but more of a collaboration. I take many of the same courses alongside med students, and some specific to the PA profession. In the end, I don't go into as much depth as med students do on some of the basic sciences (MS I) or pathophys, and dont complete a residency. However, I'll be expected to treat 90% of the ailments that walk through the door without assistance. If I run into something that is beyond my scope, I consult my supervising physician.

When it becomes frustrating is when you have been in a field for say 10 years, know more than the graduating med students, bring in more revenue than these doctors, yet dont make their salary. But the lack of ridiculous debt + enjoying my 20s and 30s is completely worth it for me. Another perk of the PA profession is that you can go from 1 field to the next without completing a residency. If I get bored of ortho surgery, I can go work in ER.

j4ck3d_N_Y
07-14-2010, 10:38 AM
this semester:
Anatomy and Physiology+lab
O chem+lab
Microbiology
Epidemiology
athletic injuries

i plan on applying to both PT and med school. med school being my first choice and hopefully get into ortho-. PT schools are extremely competitive also so its not really a backup or anything just another option. Ive been shadowing doctors/PTs/techs etc this summer and will try to get some research done next summer even tho i probably should have done it this summer.

stephano5
07-14-2010, 01:30 PM
i wanna do medicine, but ive already finished a degree in banking and law so ill try that out and if i hate it im going to start med (srs)

rampagefc77
07-14-2010, 01:52 PM
i wanna do medicine, but ive already finished a degree in banking and law so ill try that out and if i hate it im going to start med (srs)

Average age to start med school in the US is around 27 i believe. I have people in my class that are in their upper 30s, and it isn't uncommon to see people in their 40s or 50s. Never too late to start.

moosecakes4all
07-14-2010, 03:01 PM
Average age to start med school in the US is around 27 i believe. I have people in my class that are in their upper 30s, and it isn't uncommon to see people in their 40s or 50s. Never too late to start.

Yep, last I heard was 27 was the median in US med schools.

wildphucker
07-14-2010, 03:05 PM
Best age to start med school is like 24=25 me thinks.


Already got a bachelors, have some life experience, mature, but not too old where youll have lost your youth by the time you get out.


Of coursse you can practise medicine till your ancient, certianly no time or age limit on med school

T2TL
07-14-2010, 03:14 PM
I have on friend who is in his residency. He works two jobs, like 80 hours a week. On top of that he has all these tests he's studying for pretty much every free minute he gets. How do you guys do this? It's insane lol. Props to whoever is able to, I know I couldn't

moosecakes4all
07-14-2010, 03:16 PM
What is his specialty? Working two jobs while a resident is absolutely insane!!! Unless its some closely related research job.

rampagefc77
07-14-2010, 03:19 PM
I have on friend who is in his residency. He works two jobs, like 80 hours a week. On top of that he has all these tests he's studying for pretty much every free minute he gets. How do you guys do this? It's insane lol. Props to whoever is able to, I know I couldn't

You have to love the material, the challenge of solving complex problems, and the satisfaction of helping another person. I've always been fascinated by medicine and couldn't see myself happy in any other job. Working in radiology for several years didn't even feel like going to a job, I honestly enjoyed being there-- and im sure that will only increase with a 100x greater scope of practice.

To the residency comment- I believe that "law" now states you cannot work more than 80 hours per week in residency, but I knew residents that put in far more. THe PA students going through their surgery rotation said they spent 120 hours a week in the hospital on the clock.

T2TL
07-14-2010, 03:20 PM
What is his specialty? Working two jobs while a resident is absolutely insane!!! Unless its some closely related research job.

Sorry I meant including being a resident. So I guess one job on the side along with his residency which in total was about 80 hours a week. He just finished a big test and pretty much right after that he's off to studying for another. Late 20's so I guess he's almost done

edit - not sure what his specialty is. Just know he works in a few different hospitals, probably doesn't narrow it down at all lol

T2TL
07-14-2010, 03:22 PM
You have to love the material, the challenge of solving complex problems, and the satisfaction of helping another person. I've always been fascinated by medicine and couldn't see myself happy in any other job. Working in radiology for several years didn't even feel like going to a job, I honestly enjoyed being there-- and im sure that will only increase with a 100x greater scope of practice.

Yea everyone I know who is in the medical field except for a few nurses feel the same way. Seems like no matter the workload they don't mind at all. I'm an accounting major, whenever I think anything is the slightest bit difficult I just think of people in the medical field lol

wildphucker
07-14-2010, 03:31 PM
you pretty much gotta live right at the university or hospital too


I live 5 minutes walk from campus, 5 minutes drive from hospital and its still impossible

BigChamp89
07-14-2010, 03:35 PM
chemist > MD :D

future research chemist up in this.. classes next sem are:
Ochem
Calc based physics
Calc II

moosecakes4all
07-14-2010, 04:03 PM
chemist > MD :D

future research chemist up in this.. classes next sem are:
Ochem
Calc based physics
Calc II

Ive always toyed with the idea of become a chemist if for some reason the doctor thing doesnt work out.
Chemistry has been my favorite classes so far, ochem better then g chem ever.

NeoSeminole
07-14-2010, 05:00 PM
I have on friend who is in his residency. He works two jobs, like 80 hours a week. On top of that he has all these tests he's studying for pretty much every free minute he gets. How do you guys do this? It's insane lol. Props to whoever is able to, I know I couldn't

honestly, I don't mind. I love medicine and if all the studying helps me save 1 life, then it was all worth it

flexbrah
07-14-2010, 08:31 PM
Ive always toyed with the idea of become a chemist if for some reason the doctor thing doesnt work out.
Chemistry has been my favorite classes so far, ochem better then g chem ever.

i loved orgo, one of my favorite classes thus far... i despised gen chem though. i never want to take any class like g. chem ever again lol.

moosecakes4all
07-15-2010, 07:10 AM
i loved orgo, one of my favorite classes thus far... i despised gen chem though. i never want to take any class like g. chem ever again lol.

I totally agree. I thoroughly enjoyed G chem since it was my first chemistry class ever and it blew my mind, but i had to work twice as hard to get an A than i did in O chem. O chem is so much more relevant to me too.

MontelWilliams
07-15-2010, 07:42 AM
I'm an MS2 in a few weeks...I can answer any Q's you guys have about the process/school

moosecakes4all
07-15-2010, 04:37 PM
I'm an MS2 in a few weeks...I can answer any Q's you guys have about the process/school

Awesome man! Good to have you aboard!!!
How was first year?

pipiwendeyseeme
07-15-2010, 07:33 PM
Just finished my first year.
Totally ****ed up and got a B and a B- in chem 1 and 2
Took summer classes and got an A in both Orgo 1 and Bio 1
got my **** together
Fall 2nd year:
Bio2+Lab
Orgo2+Lab
Stats
Precalculus
World civilization

Any misc brahS TAKE THE MCAT already? Any insight on difficultY?

F23
07-15-2010, 10:27 PM
4th year med student here. PM me with q's if you want.

Oh, and to (tangentially) respond to the OP: I have yet to meet a neurosurgeon who is not a gigantic douche.

wildphucker
07-16-2010, 04:20 AM
4th year med student here. PM me with q's if you want.

Oh, and to (tangentially) respond to the OP: I have yet to meet a neurosurgeon who is not a gigantic douche.

I could handle my own doucheyness if I earnt 700k

stephano5
07-17-2010, 02:56 AM
Average age to start med school in the US is around 27 i believe. I have people in my class that are in their upper 30s, and it isn't uncommon to see people in their 40s or 50s. Never too late to start.

a lot younger in australia, about 23-24 for us... i have to do another undergrad before med which is a bit of a turn off but i have to at least try banking before i do med or else i look a bit silly

wildphucker
07-17-2010, 03:03 AM
a lot younger in australia, about 23-24 for us... i have to do another undergrad before med which is a bit of a turn off but i have to at least try banking before i do med or else i look a bit silly

why look silly?


working in an office blows balls dude

moosecakes4all
07-20-2010, 06:19 PM
Crazy week brahs! Crazy indeed!!!
Reading "the blind watchmaker" by dawkins now, loving it! Almost done and just got "cosmogenesis" by layzer in the mail today, cant wait to crack it open.

wildphucker
07-20-2010, 06:23 PM
ok brahs



how do you prepare for an MCAT/GAMSAT type exam? Gonna have to take the test to switch to a more prestigious uni methinks

here we got a similar mcat type test

5.5 hour test

physics bio and chem

plus humanities and essay writing


how do you prepare? looked at some cmat sample, the organic chem stuff looekd hectic

moosecakes4all
07-20-2010, 06:50 PM
ok brahs



how do you prepare for an MCAT/GAMSAT type exam? Gonna have to take the test to switch to a more prestigious uni methinks

here we got a similar mcat type test

5.5 hour test

physics bio and chem

plus humanities and essay writing


how do you prepare? looked at some cmat sample, the organic chem stuff looekd hectic
Sounds very similar to our MCAT.
Your going to need anywhere from 3 months or longer to prepare, doesnt need to be all day and night, lets say 3 hours a day for 3 months. Your going to need practice books, for MCAT there are books that have hundreds and hundreds of problems in them that represent:
A) the format of questions that are going to be on the test
B) the concepts that will be tested
C) and they will include what information and knowledge is pertinent to the test and what is superfluous.

Now if your test is ANYTHING like the MCAT, and ive got a hunch it is, then the test is NOT designed to be an aptitude test; it is designed to ascertain how well you reason. All the information you will come across will have been presented to you in your basic undergrad science courses. However, they will attempt to make the information appear VERY daunting, as you noticed with the O chem question. My findings with those O chem questions has always been that they are surprisingly easy. They will throw this giant unheard of molecule at you and tell you to do something with it. You will look and be stumped, but if you look closer it is only concerning a small portion of the molecule, one small functional group, say carboxylic acid. So it is in this way that they test you reasoning and your ability to think under pressure.

Practice, know your material inside and out, give yourself plenty of time before taking the test, and enjoy!

wildphucker
07-20-2010, 06:54 PM
lol yeh


looked at some of the stuff in mcat and it was full of these massive huge molecules.....I know a fair bit bout o chem but never before saw these molecules, completely wtf'ed me.


Test for me will be march 2011....still some time to prepare

moosecakes4all
07-20-2010, 07:19 PM
Thats plenty of time! Just make sure you make a study plan from day one (now) and follow it strictly. Make sure to take into account your regular study habits, ie, if you find that you lose lots of information over only a few months then make sure you set your plan up that you either frequently review older matierial or set your plan to be an intensive 3 month plan!

Oh i forgot in my first post, take practices test, and lots of them.

Mark2K8
07-20-2010, 07:41 PM
In. Want to get into medicine. Starting college this this fall. Will use thread for advice

moosecakes4all
07-20-2010, 07:51 PM
In. Want to get into medicine. Starting college this this fall. Will use thread for advice

Best advice right here:
Put forth 100% effort man. College is not like highschool anymore, do NOT expect to get an A without even opening the text book.
In your bio classes you NEED to do the reading and homework, in your math and chem classes you NEED to do the homework and practice problems. Go further and find more problems in your book and online and practice those. Do not aim for only an A in the class, you can do much much better, aim to literally master the material and the A will follow very closely behind. Enjoy yourself by all means but understand that if you want to go into medicine you must get used to telling your friends no more often than not to going out that night. If you a serious about medicine i suggest getting involved ASAP. Find a internship program at your local hospital and get into it, join clubs you find enjoyable, and get to know your profs. Get started searching for research for next summer and beyond.
Remember this most of all, put forth 100% effort, study for 15 hours a day if you need to, find your strengths and play to them while sharpening your weaknesses. There is no class in college that is unmanageable, and those kids who get 4.0's arent necessarily exceptionally intelligent, they just try very hard and they are rewarded. Theres nothing like the feeling of coming out of a class room after taking your final KNOW you just annihilated it. Good luck! Ask any questions, ill be glad to help answer.

Mark2K8
07-20-2010, 10:18 PM
Best advice right here:
Put forth 100% effort man. College is not like highschool anymore, do NOT expect to get an A without even opening the text book.
In your bio classes you NEED to do the reading and homework, in your math and chem classes you NEED to do the homework and practice problems. Go further and find more problems in your book and online and practice those. Do not aim for only an A in the class, you can do much much better, aim to literally master the material and the A will follow very closely behind. Enjoy yourself by all means but understand that if you want to go into medicine you must get used to telling your friends no more often than not to going out that night. If you a serious about medicine i suggest getting involved ASAP. Find a internship program at your local hospital and get into it, join clubs you find enjoyable, and get to know your profs. Get started searching for research for next summer and beyond.
Remember this most of all, put forth 100% effort, study for 15 hours a day if you need to, find your strengths and play to them while sharpening your weaknesses. There is no class in college that is unmanageable, and those kids who get 4.0's arent necessarily exceptionally intelligent, they just try very hard and they are rewarded. Theres nothing like the feeling of coming out of a class room after taking your final KNOW you just annihilated it. Good luck! Ask any questions, ill be glad to help answer.

damn man. thanks for the advice.

well im picking my classes in 2 days, any suggestions for whats recommended for med school? i was suggested to pick bio or chem as my major, and i picked bio cause i think it'll be easier. less formulas. will rep on recharge appreciate it

F23
07-20-2010, 10:33 PM
damn man. thanks for the advice.

well im picking my classes in 2 days, any suggestions for whats recommended for med school? i was suggested to pick bio or chem as my major, and i picked bio cause i think it'll be easier. less formulas. will rep on recharge appreciate it

Bio will be MUCH better preparation for med school. This is a no-brainer.

Also, go easy your first quarter. Take no more than 15 units, or whatever is the average number at your university - don't feel that you need to show off or anything by maxing out on credits. If you think you're going to do poorly in a class, change your grade status to pass/fail. That way, when you retake the class, your old grade (suppose you would have had a C) won't mess up your GPA when you submit your transcript to AMCAS (even though your college may replace your grade, AMCAS doesn't do this - they have their own way of calculating your GPA).

moosecakes4all
07-20-2010, 10:41 PM
damn man. thanks for the advice.

well im picking my classes in 2 days, any suggestions for whats recommended for med school? i was suggested to pick bio or chem as my major, and i picked bio cause i think it'll be easier. less formulas. will rep on recharge appreciate it

I will solidly second Bio.
Ive enjoyed my chemistry classes much more than my bio classes, mainly because i didnt take chem in highschool and when i got to college i found out about this entirely new world and way of thinking about it. Really neat for me.
Granted I spent MUCH more time studying for chemistry then any other class. You will most certainly end up taking general, organic and biochemistry throughout undergrad, in that order.

wildphucker
07-21-2010, 12:32 AM
Biochem or organic chem are good majors


but organic really prepares you for the mcat better imo.....you need to ready fro crazy molecules and reactions


biochem focuses more on metabolic pathways and enzymes rather than reactions.....

T-Roach
07-21-2010, 06:25 AM
good thread, will read and post more about me later

T-Roach
07-21-2010, 08:01 AM
applying to med school finland isn't a walk in the park either

here we have an entrance exam, which is pretty similiar to the MCATs. a 800 page book of physiology, chemistry, physics, biology, biochem.. the exam is once every year and you can apply to only one university at a time. entrance rates differ from about 10 to 15%
i studied for 5 months. for the first few months I studied 6 hours a day, weekends off. after that, averaging about 10 hours a day ( a little less on sundays)
dental and med school have the same entrance exam.


im a dental student, completed my first year in may.
for us during the first 2 years we have the exact same courses as the med students + we have our dental courses so it's a lot of work.
in 4 years i'll be a dentist and my future plan is to specialize in oral + maxillofacial surgery.
another plan is to also get my MD license. Guess i'll wait and see.. ^^


the idea of becoming a surgeon came from my parents (mom is a microbiologist, MD. and my dad is the chief of surgery here)
good to know that they're watching my back, hehe

HoldOn
07-21-2010, 08:09 AM
Misc I'm going to college in the fall and pretty set on going into medicine in the future. (working in a lab this summer, both parents into it, and i kind of love the lab/biology).

Gonna be a freshman this fall and just finished enrolling in classes. (Going for the Biology/Biochemistry track).

I'm taking:

Comparative Physiology
General Chemistry
Bio-Lab
Korean (6 credits wtf?)
Calc II (got credit for I)

Our school is known for its grade deflation/harsh grading system. From looking and asking around, our Physiology instructor gives ridiculous exams.
Any tips on how to handle and ace courses with difficult professors?
Maybe rent out a book for a head start on some of these courses?

moosecakes4all
07-21-2010, 01:16 PM
Misc I'm going to college in the fall and pretty set on going into medicine in the future. (working in a lab this summer, both parents into it, and i kind of love the lab/biology).

Gonna be a freshman this fall and just finished enrolling in classes. (Going for the Biology/Biochemistry track).

I'm taking:

Comparative Physiology
General Chemistry
Bio-Lab
Korean (6 credits wtf?)
Calc II (got credit for I)

Our school is known for its grade deflation/harsh grading system. From looking and asking around, our Physiology instructor gives ridiculous exams.
Any tips on how to handle and ace courses with difficult professors?
Maybe rent out a book for a head start on some of these courses?
Stay on top of the material. Memorize everything you can, just remember even the HARDEST undergrad bio exam wont compare with anything you will come across in med school. All I've got to say is study your ass off, memorize everything, and you will be set.


applying to med school finland isn't a walk in the park either

here we have an entrance exam, which is pretty similiar to the MCATs. a 800 page book of physiology, chemistry, physics, biology, biochem.. the exam is once every year and you can apply to only one university at a time. entrance rates differ from about 10 to 15%
i studied for 5 months. for the first few months I studied 6 hours a day, weekends off. after that, averaging about 10 hours a day ( a little less on sundays)
dental and med school have the same entrance exam.


im a dental student, completed my first year in may.
for us during the first 2 years we have the exact same courses as the med students + we have our dental courses so it's a lot of work.
in 4 years i'll be a dentist and my future plan is to specialize in oral + maxillofacial surgery.
another plan is to also get my MD license. Guess i'll wait and see.. ^^


the idea of becoming a surgeon came from my parents (mom is a microbiologist, MD. and my dad is the chief of surgery here)
good to know that they're watching my back, hehe

Man your lucky with those parents! That would be sick if my dad was chief! My mom is a dentist, but dentistry never appealed to me much.

rampagefc77
07-21-2010, 03:50 PM
Stay on top of the material. Memorize everything you can, just remember even the HARDEST undergrad bio exam wont compare with anything you will come across in med school. All I've got to say is study your ass off, memorize everything, and you will be set.



Man your lucky with those parents! That would be sick if my dad was chief! My mom is a dentist, but dentistry never appealed to me much.

In terms of majors, I'd recommend human bio if your school offers it. I'd rather learn about how the human body works than about ecology, plants, and random animals, which was the bulk of the organismal bio tract at my college. Take as many courses that you can that are clinically relevent... ie pathophys, pharm, phys, anatomy, etc. Organic chem and some other courses may be interesting to you, but the information really isn't useful for med school. If you can, take a good neuroscience course-- one of the hardest things we've covered so far is all of the sensory/motor tracts, associated nuclei, etc. There's about 1000000000 of them so it's tough to keep them all straight and realize what happens to a patient if a lesion occurs at any given point in there.

In terms of difficulty- the material in med school/PA school really isn't harder conceptually than anything covered in undergrad... there's just 100x the workload and no time to memorize everything.

The first year of undergrad is basically there to gain confidence. I remember my first year I was jacked to get a 4.0... after that I went into each class knowing that I would get an A. I went through a similar transition in grad school. Go in to undergrad with the mindset that you are there to 1) be a student then 2) have a life. There will still be plenty of time to have fun, but you wont have as much free time as your business major roomate..

FranklinBluth
07-21-2010, 06:26 PM
studentdoctor.net forums, probably the best forum/site for all your doctor needs

Hell no, those people are all psychotic fraudsters. Just get good grades, good letters of recommendation, high MCAT score, participate in some organizations and try and volunteer at a hospital. /premed


4th year med student here. PM me with q's if you want.

Oh, and to (tangentially) respond to the OP: I have yet to meet a neurosurgeon who is not a gigantic douche.

I know plenty of NSG's who aren't douches. Maybe your school just has a grouchy department for some reason?

DoomedByCurry
07-21-2010, 06:27 PM
what majors did you guys take? i am starting college this fall and i need a solid major just in case i dont get into med school to fall back on, i know major does not matter for med school but what is one i should do in the science field that i can fall back on if i am not successful in getting into med school, that was redundant lol

FranklinBluth
07-21-2010, 06:34 PM
what majors did you guys take? i am starting college this fall and i need a solid major just in case i dont get into med school to fall back on, i know major does not matter for med school but what is one i should do in the science field that i can fall back on if i am not successful in getting into med school, that was redundant lol

We can't answer this question. What do you like? What would your fallback career be? I know English majors, middle school teachers, statisticians, computer programmers, and philosophers in med school. One of the reasons they excelled in their undergrad fields (which helped get them into med school) was that they genuinely liked the field they were studying. That's important if you want to shine as an undergrad. Study something you find genuinely interesting and don't worry so much about the future. You can always go to law/business/grad school for backup.

MontelWilliams
07-21-2010, 06:35 PM
what majors did you guys take? i am starting college this fall and i need a solid major just in case i dont get into med school to fall back on, i know major does not matter for med school but what is one i should do in the science field that i can fall back on if i am not successful in getting into med school, that was redundant lol

you can always go in undecided...you'd be amazed by how many people drop pre-med after first semester (and each subsequent semesters). With a bio (chem, psych, etc) degree you can't really do anything right away that would get you a lot of $$$ unless you do grad school, but money is usually not that great

moosecakes4all
07-21-2010, 08:37 PM
We can't answer this question. What do you like? What would your fallback career be? I know English majors, middle school teachers, statisticians, computer programmers, and philosophers in med school. One of the reasons they excelled in their undergrad fields (which helped get them into med school) was that they genuinely liked the field they were studying. That's important if you want to shine as an undergrad. Study something you find genuinely interesting and don't worry so much about the future. You can always go to law/business/grad school for backup.

Exactly this. There is no way for us to know what your fallback career would ideally be! :)

F23
07-21-2010, 08:47 PM
I know plenty of NSG's who aren't douches. Maybe your school just has a grouchy department for some reason?

Actually I would like to amend that. I ran into a very nice (and attractive) neurosurg resident today. I think my perception was skewed by one particular attending and one crazy bitch resident.

rampagefc77
07-21-2010, 09:52 PM
The only neurosurgeon that I knew was psychotic... she had her dad (chief of surgery) first assist all of her cases, was known to have arguments frequently in surgery, would randomly burst into tears, flipped out on all nurses/staff more than once in the neuro unit... anytime she came by people ran. She thought she was god's gift but I wouldn't let her operate on me if she was my last resort. The coolest surgeons I know worked in ortho.

moosecakes4all
07-22-2010, 07:41 AM
The only neurosurgeon that I knew was psychotic... she had her dad (chief of surgery) first assist all of her cases, was known to have arguments frequently in surgery, would randomly burst into tears, flipped out on all nurses/staff more than once in the neuro unit... anytime she came by people ran. She thought she was god's gift but I wouldn't let her operate on me if she was my last resort. The coolest surgeons I know worked in ortho.

Hahaha!
Its a tight line to walk between sanity and the lack thereof for neurosurgery. Theres got to be something wrong with anyone who wants to be learning and putting themselves into deep debt until they are 33 or more years old!!!

At my hospital, Ive heard mainly the ortho and anesthesiology folks are the most fun.

rampagefc77
07-22-2010, 10:23 AM
Hahaha!
Its a tight line to walk between sanity and the lack thereof for neurosurgery. Theres got to be something wrong with anyone who wants to be learning and putting themselves into deep debt until they are 33 or more years old!!!

At my hospital, Ive heard mainly the ortho and anesthesiology folks are the most fun.

There's money in anesthesia... but god would i be bored. Putting people to sleep each day then basically sitting around in surgery. I want to diagnse and treat conscious patients.

G-mane12
07-22-2010, 10:26 AM
Anyone here planning on going to a osteopathic med school?

G-mane12
07-22-2010, 10:30 AM
I'd want to be a doctor but A: I don't like people. l

pathology might be the specialty for you then lol

G-mane12
07-22-2010, 10:39 AM
http://www.aamc.org/data/facts/applicantmatriculant/table24-mcatgpagridall2007-09.pdf

http://www.aamc.org/data/facts/applicantmatriculant/table25-mcatgpa-grid-hbn-morerace.pdf

moosecakes4all
07-22-2010, 04:01 PM
Hell ya brahs, hell ya!!!!!!!!!
Just got my Organic Chem semester 1 grades back, I got an A in the class! So much for o chem being my hardest course of undergrad career! :D

DoomedByCurry
07-22-2010, 09:33 PM
so if i didnt take ap chem in high school, how hard is it in college?

moosecakes4all
07-22-2010, 10:34 PM
so if i didnt take ap chem in high school, how hard is it in college?

I took advanced physics instead of any chem in hs and college is easy as ****, as long as you have a good work ethic.

solidsnake88
07-23-2010, 12:05 PM
oh hai current med student checking in. 1.5 years till i have my MD!

moosecakes4all
07-23-2010, 12:16 PM
oh hai current med student checking in. 1.5 years till i have my MD!

Nice brah! Id ask what school you are going to and how you like it, but we all know this is the misc...

Any advice for me as a premed?

solidsnake88
07-23-2010, 12:21 PM
Nice brah! Id ask what school you are going to and how you like it, but we all know this is the misc...

Any advice for me as a premed?

just what everyone else says, volunteer at hospitals, shadow docs, RESEARCH, do well on MCATs. it also helps if you have connections

moosecakes4all
07-23-2010, 01:49 PM
Well perfect, ive been on a good path since first year then!

Mark2K8
07-24-2010, 09:44 PM
Came back from college orientation. picked my classes

bio as major, and taking chem I and calc I for first semester along with some other classes to fulfill credit requirements

Like 80% of the other preview/orientation kids also want pre-health lol

@ ppl in med school: how much is it costing you for tuition per year? I know someone that came out of dental school with 250k in student loans...

flexbrah
07-24-2010, 10:57 PM
so if i didnt take ap chem in high school, how hard is it in college?

i didn't take ap chem in HS either and i did fine. you'll be fine too.

rampagefc77
07-25-2010, 07:42 AM
i didn't take ap chem in HS either and i did fine. you'll be fine too.

I was lazy in high school and didn't really take any AP courses except for bio... Didn't make any difference going into college FWIW

T-Roach
07-25-2010, 08:12 AM
school starts in 2 weeks.. started reading on periodontology today

TypicalGamer
07-25-2010, 08:47 AM
Anyone did VCE here? I hear med courses are considerably easier to do lol

T-Roach
07-26-2010, 06:28 AM
just talked to my aunt today (who is a ophthalmologist)
she talked to piet haers a few months back and it's very possible that I could go to guildford clinic as an observer + even an assistant in the near future. boom money shot

Piet Haers is a very famous oral + maxillofacial surgeon. He also is the editor in chief of International Journal of Oral and Maxillofacial Surgery. Guess contacts mean everything in this world

moosecakes4all
07-26-2010, 07:46 AM
just talked to my aunt today (who is a ophthalmologist)
she talked to piet haers a few months back and it's very possible that I could go to guildford clinic as an observer + even an assistant in the near future. boom money shot

Piet Haers is a very famous oral + maxillofacial surgeon. He also is the editor in chief of International Journal of Oral and Maxillofacial Surgery. Guess contacts mean everything in this world

Hell ya man! Thats what this game is all about!

wildphucker
07-26-2010, 08:01 AM
can any o chem brahs give some advice on how to study org chem?


Never needed to take a class during undergrad so I'm not too familiar with it but could easily learn it. Already looked at sn2 and nucleophilic substitutions today wiht haloalkanes can be done but its a bit tricky. I see why its called the weed out class.


Do you think just studying the reactions of the main functional groups will suffice? e.g alkanes enes ynes phenols ketones alcohols aldehydes and all the stereochemistry etc.....

T-Roach
07-26-2010, 08:29 AM
Hell ya man! Thats what this game is all about!

thanks man

where do you study or what are you med plans? =)

moosecakes4all
07-26-2010, 12:24 PM
can any o chem brahs give some advice on how to study org chem?


Never needed to take a class during undergrad so I'm not too familiar with it but could easily learn it. Already looked at sn2 and nucleophilic substitutions today wiht haloalkanes can be done but its a bit tricky. I see why its called the weed out class.


Do you think just studying the reactions of the main functional groups will suffice? e.g alkanes enes ynes phenols ketones alcohols aldehydes and all the stereochemistry etc.....
You need to study it in order, thats why SN2 probably looked hard. The way i study is just the practice problems at the back of the book.
I would find a used, older edition organic chem text book, along with a solutions manual and work your way across each chapter from beginning to end. The class REALLY is not that bad, people like to make it seem worse than it is to justify their own poor grades. Its no different from any other class; put the work in and you'll learn the material.

rampagefc77
07-26-2010, 02:18 PM
You need to study it in order, thats why SN2 probably looked hard. The way i study is just the practice problems at the back of the book.
I would find a used, older edition organic chem text book, along with a solutions manual and work your way across each chapter from beginning to end. The class REALLY is not that bad, people like to make it seem worse than it is to justify their own poor grades. Its no different from any other class; put the work in and you'll learn the material.

O chem is a weed out class in the sense that it separates students that can apply material from those that simply memorize facts and are used to being spoon fed. O chem is just a puzzle-- you start with this molecule, you want to get to this other molecule... how do you get there? You need to not only know the mechanisms, reagents, etc... but you needs to apply it. I enjoyed the class, it really isn't too bad.

None of the material is really applicable... but pretend molecule 1 is a sick patient and the molecule you are trying to turn it into is where you want your patient to be (healthwise)... now how do you get there? This is why colleges look highly on the class.

moosecakes4all
07-26-2010, 03:14 PM
O chem is a weed out class in the sense that it separates students that can apply material from those that simply memorize facts and are used to being spoon fed. O chem is just a puzzle-- you start with this molecule, you want to get to this other molecule... how do you get there? You need to not only know the mechanisms, reagents, etc... but you needs to apply it. I enjoyed the class, it really isn't too bad.

None of the material is really applicable... but pretend molecule 1 is a sick patient and the molecule you are trying to turn it into is where you want your patient to be (healthwise)... now how do you get there? This is why colleges look highly on the class.

Thats a neat way to think about it man.
Ive so far only been applying it in the most literal pharmacology sort of sense, where i tell myself "If I can understand why this function group makes this drug act the way it does then I will have a head up on the other students and researchers". Of course, in O chem 2 its still only baby steps compared to the depth of chemistry knowledge one needs to have to theorize by which pathways a certain drug can affect the body and further how to synthesize it, but I firmly believe that a strong foundation will get me prepared for my future in neuroscience research and neurosurgery.
I think it makes it easier for me to get good grades because of my attitude toward the class, half the students beat themselves up and tell themselves they hate the material and can't learn it no matter how hard they try. Thats the wrong way for any student to go about this class, or any class for that matter. For the poster with the ochem question, just enjoy the material and you'll learn it quickly and effectively. Be excited about it.

rampagefc77
07-26-2010, 04:01 PM
Thats a neat way to think about it man.
Ive so far only been applying it in the most literal pharmacology sort of sense, where i tell myself "If I can understand why this function group makes this drug act the way it does then I will have a head up on the other students and researchers". Of course, in O chem 2 its still only baby steps compared to the depth of chemistry knowledge one needs to have to theorize by which pathways a certain drug can affect the body and further how to synthesize it, but I firmly believe that a strong foundation will get me prepared for my future in neuroscience research and neurosurgery.
I think it makes it easier for me to get good grades because of my attitude toward the class, half the students beat themselves up and tell themselves they hate the material and can't learn it no matter how hard they try. Thats the wrong way for any student to go about this class, or any class for that matter. For the poster with the ochem question, just enjoy the material and you'll learn it quickly and effectively. Be excited about it.

med school skims the surface of pharmacology... its more about these receptors are located here, and have this effect on different tissues. We spend 3-4 months in a class that some spend several years working on in research or as a profession (pharmacologist). Definitely right about having a positive attitude about it though, makes a huge difference.

F23
07-26-2010, 04:04 PM
You are underestimating the intensity of med school/PA school. Every waking moment is spent in class or studying. Occasionally after an exam I will grab some food/drinks for maybe 2 hours with some friends but then its back to the books.

One of my big deals with choosing PA school was that in med school, I wouldn't have any say about what I did for another 8+ years. Every day would be structured, and filled to the brim. If you work full time, you 1) have money and 2) have free time once you leave work to enjoy yourself. Neither of those happen while in school.

For me, I'll leaving PA school with 45K in debt just before I turn 25 and will probably start (depending on field/state) at 80K+ (I know people that have start from 70-130K depending on field and location). Most PAs I know make 100K+ within a few years out of school, and many make more than family practice/nonspecialty physicians.

Not trying to be negative here with my comments, just realistic about what your lifestyle will be like. I love the material Im learning, but it drains on your after a while.

Wait.... you're in PA school?

rampagefc77
07-26-2010, 04:08 PM
Wait.... you're in PA school?

Yes, I made that pretty obvious in my first several posts. FWIW I take several courses with the med students at my school, and the undergrad process for PA school is basically identical to med school minus the MCAT (take the GRE... would rather take the MCAT to be honest), so I figured my opinion/experiences could be useful.

F23
07-26-2010, 04:14 PM
Yes, I made that pretty obvious in my first several posts. FWIW I take several courses with the med students at my school, and the undergrad process for PA school is basically identical to med school minus the MCAT (take the GRE... would rather take the MCAT to be honest), so I figured my opinion/experiences could be useful.

MCAT's way harder than the GRE - I doubt you would want to take it.

Basically the same as medical school? Allright...

At least take the part about being pre-med out of your sig.

NeoSeminole
07-26-2010, 04:23 PM
Basically the same as medical school? Allright...

At least take the part about being pre-med out of your sig.

oh lawd...

rampagefc77
07-26-2010, 04:31 PM
MCAT's way harder than the GRE - I doubt you would want to take it.

Basically the same as medical school? Allright...

At least take the part about being pre-med out of your sig.

Lulz, I figured it was only a matter of time before someone decided to flame the PA student. I put the thing in my sig back when I was a freshman in college and debating between the 2 options, I dont even know how to take it out (but if you tell me I'd be glad to).

MCAT is practical, it is testing you on what you learned in undergrad. The GRE math is cake, it's easy to get a near perfect score, the verbal is what rocks most people.

1) The pre-reqs for PA school and med school are basically identical, except PA school requires so many hours of actually working with patients. As I mentioned, I spent 5 years in radiology. Also not all PA schools require physics, though there are a few med schools that don't either. If you wanna get into whose dick is bigger, I graduated first in my class with a 4.0, I could have gone to med school but chose this route for a variety of reasons. It is more competitive currently to get into PA school than med school... Just a few things to think about kiddo.

2) You need to look past the number of years in school and look at the curriculum between med school and PA school. I'm in class from 8-5 daily, the med students are out at 12 except for the occasional lab. We covered the same gross anatomy topics in 8 weeks as opposed to the better part of a year, taught by the same professor (most of my professors are the same for classes taught to the med students, and the objectives from the lectures are the same). In my next block I literally take the same pharm, PD, and some of the same systems courses as the med students, we'll be sitting in the same classroom.

Med students do go into greater detail in the basic sciences (much of their first year) and some of the patho. I'm not discrediting their work by any means, moreso enlightening you on the differences and similarities between the 2.

People hear the word "assistant" and immediately think about PAs are a subordinate to the physicians, which is not the case. The original name was actually physician associate (still used at some programs like yale) but since we are accredited by the same medical body, this didn't sit well with them-- hence the name change. PAs function with a great amount of autonomy- most that I have shadowed say they see the physician they work with a couple times a month and handle their own patient load.

Anyway, let's not derail this thread.

MontelWilliams
07-26-2010, 04:41 PM
Lulz, I figured it was only a matter of time before someone decided to flame the PA student. I put the thing in my sig back when I was a freshman in college and debating between the 2 options, I dont even know how to take it out (but if you tell me I'd be glad to).

MCAT is practical, it is testing you on what you learned in undergrad. The GRE math is cake, it's easy to get a near perfect score, the verbal is what rocks most people.

1) The pre-reqs for PA school and med school are basically identical, except PA school requires so many hours of actually working with patients. As I mentioned, I spent 5 years in radiology. Also not all PA schools require physics, though there are a few med schools that don't either. If you wanna get into whose dick is bigger, I graduated first in my class with a 4.0, I could have gone to med school but chose this route for a variety of reasons. It is more competitive currently to get into PA school than med school... Just a few things to think about kiddo.


MCAT is not really practical. Sure you use the knowledge you learned in undergrad, but most of the sciences is passage-based and deals with subjects you probably have never heard of before.

And sorry, but a 4.0/"#1 in my class (never heard of an undergrad doing that)" doesn't guarantee you anything and to say you would get into med school makes you look like an ass. There are people who have 4.0 and >90th percentile that don't get in.


Did you know that Vet school is probably the hardest program of any to get into? Just because the program has the smallest % accepted does not mean it is the hardest to get into. Vet school has lower median GPA all around, smaller number of applicants, and a very limited number of schools/spots.

NeoSeminole
07-26-2010, 04:55 PM
for the record, I'm also a PA student about to enter clinical rotations


And sorry, but a 4.0/"#1 in my class (never heard of an undergrad doing that)" doesn't guarantee you anything and to say you would get into med school makes you look like an ass. There are people who have 4.0 and >90th percentile that don't get in.

I don't think his intentions were to e-brag. Rather, the point he was trying to make is that his decision to enter a PA program wasn't due to any intellectual shortcomings which is the perception that many have of physician assistants - "oh, he wasn't smart enough to get into med school. So he became a PA instead." This is simply not true


Did you know that Vet school is probably the hardest program of any to get into? Just because the program has the smallest % accepted does not mean it is the hardest to get into. Vet school has lower median GPA all around, smaller number of applicants, and a very limited number of schools/spots.

I believe the poster was merely showing that acceptance into PA school is very competitive. A comparison can be made to medical school b/c both are graduate level medical degrees. However, Vet school is not

rampagefc77
07-26-2010, 04:57 PM
MCAT is not really practical. Sure you use the knowledge you learned in undergrad, but most of the sciences is passage-based and deals with subjects you probably have never heard of before.

And sorry, but a 4.0/"#1 in my class (never heard of an undergrad doing that)" doesn't guarantee you anything and to say you would get into med school makes you look like an ass. There are people who have 4.0 and >90th percentile that don't get in.


Did you know that Vet school is probably the hardest program of any to get into? Just because the program has the smallest % accepted does not mean it is the hardest to get into. Vet school has lower median GPA all around, smaller number of applicants, and a very limited number of schools/spots.

I helped several friends study for the MCAT- similar study habits/grades, all scored in the low to mid 30s (the highest was a 36). I'm a good test taker so I'm sure I would have scored in the 30s like they did-- not trying to sound arrogant, I've just always scored well on standardized tests. Obviosuly nothing is guarenteed with acceptance into med school, but I know several who applied this last year with mediocre stats that got into decent schools. I even know someone that applied to PA and med school who got into med school but rejected from all the PA schools.

There may be the occassional person who got a 4.0/>90th percentile who got rejected their first time around, but the vast majority of these end up in ivy league schools (check medapps.com).

Anyway, this is turning into me trying to prove myself worthy of med school when it is a moot point. I'll still give advice in this thread because 1) I did a typical pre-med track in undergrad 2) I'm in a professional medical program 3) I take classes with the med students and can give advice regarding these (if the rest of my program is considered garbage so be it).

rampagefc77
07-26-2010, 05:00 PM
for the record, I'm also a PA student about to enter clinical rotations



I don't think his intentions were to e-brag. Rather, the point he was trying to make is that his decision to enter a PA program wasn't due to any intellectual shortcomings which is the perception that many have of physician assistants - "oh, he wasn't smart enough to get into med school. So he became a PA instead." This is simply not true



I believe the poster was merely showing that acceptance into PA school is very competitive. A comparison can be made to medical school b/c both are graduate level medical degrees. However, Vet school is not

My points exactly, just trying to clear up a few common misconceptions regarding the PA profession.

Good luck with clinicals brah.

anthonyabruzzi1
07-26-2010, 07:03 PM
Question I posted in a different thread:

I have 2 years left at my university and was wondering if that was enough time to complete the basic med schools requirements, or even complete a bio major. I have not started any sciences yet, I am picking my classes for this fall this week.

I hear mixed opinions on the requirements for med school. Many say you don't need any sciences, some say you do, some say you can get in with any bs degree, some say you need a bio chem degree.

I need to pick my major for the next 2 years. Should I just get my basic sciences done: 2 years of bio/chem/phys? Or pick a science major? Or just stick with the major I have now? My major right now is Russian, I am fluent. Pretty easy degree, but I am debating on whether I should switch to Bio-chem major (pre-med program).

I have a 3.5 GPA and have been a local EMT for 2 years, if that matters. I am in the Naval reserves and after college I am going active duty into Naval Special Warfare. I figure that is the best way to pay for med school, and avoid going into det. I figure this would also be a damn good resume for med school.

Thanks for any help.

TheVM
07-26-2010, 07:09 PM
Question I posted in a different thread:

I have 2 years left at my university and was wondering if that was enough time to complete the basic med schools requirements, or even complete a bio major. I have not started any sciences yet, I am picking my classes for this fall this week.

I hear mixed opinions on the requirements for med school. Many say you don't need any sciences, some say you do, some say you can get in with any bs degree, some say you need a bio chem degree.

I need to pick my major for the next 2 years. Should I just get my basic sciences done: 2 years of bio/chem/phys? Or pick a science major? Or just stick with the major I have now? My major right now is Russian, I am fluent. Pretty easy degree, but I am debating on whether I should switch to Bio-chem major (pre-med program).

I have a 3.5 GPA and have been a local EMT for 2 years, if that matters. I am in the Naval reserves and after college I am going active duty into Naval Special Warfare. I figure that is the best way to pay for med school, and avoid going into det. I figure this would also be a damn good resume for med school.

Thanks for any help.

Major doesn't matter, can be any major.
Furthermore, the classes you need vary from state to state and school to school. But really the basic 4 you need:
1. 1 year of bio classes + labs(sometimes)
2. 1 years of gen chem + labs
3. 1 year ochem +labs
4. 1 year physics + labs(maybe)

But you also need some math classes and english classes, but you probably have that locked up as most people have to take these to graduate.
You can do pre-med in two years. I doubt it would be possible to do bio major in 2 years because of the order you have to take classes.

My advice to you is go email the premedical office in your school asap and she/he will help you reach your goals.

btw your EC look very solid, EMT and reserve are awesome things to have on your application. Despite what people tell you, you don't need research! Don't do it unless you actually have some time because your app. looks good so far.

rampagefc77
07-26-2010, 07:13 PM
Question I posted in a different thread:

I have 2 years left at my university and was wondering if that was enough time to complete the basic med schools requirements, or even complete a bio major. I have not started any sciences yet, I am picking my classes for this fall this week.

I hear mixed opinions on the requirements for med school. Many say you don't need any sciences, some say you do, some say you can get in with any bs degree, some say you need a bio chem degree.

I need to pick my major for the next 2 years. Should I just get my basic sciences done: 2 years of bio/chem/phys? Or pick a science major? Or just stick with the major I have now? My major right now is Russian, I am fluent. Pretty easy degree, but I am debating on whether I should switch to Bio-chem major (pre-med program).

I have a 3.5 GPA and have been a local EMT for 2 years, if that matters. I am in the Naval reserves and after college I am going active duty into Naval Special Warfare. I figure that is the best way to pay for med school, and avoid going into det. I figure this would also be a damn good resume for med school.

Thanks for any help.

While you can major in anything, you need to complete the pre-reqs required for any given program, which typically includes: 1 year gen bio, 1 year gen chem, 1 semester o-chem, 1 semester biochem (some schools require 2 semesters of these last 2), calc, 1 year phys, etc. There will be some variability between schools so look into schools you are interested in and make sure that you have the required pre-reqs.

Most people major in a science because you can complete the degree while completing your pre-reqs at the same time. One thing to consider is that some of the pre-reqs courses may have a pre-req course to even get into it, so it may not be as simple as it seems. It is also beneficial to have taken upper level science courses and prove that you can handle a rigorous workload.

Hope this helps guide your decision making process.

anthonyabruzzi1
07-26-2010, 07:20 PM
While you can major in anything, you need to complete the pre-reqs required for any given program, which typically includes: 1 year gen bio, 1 year gen chem, 1 semester o-chem, 1 semester biochem (some schools require 2 semesters of these last 2), calc, 1 year phys, etc. There will be some variability between schools so look into schools you are interested in and make sure that you have the required pre-reqs.

Most people major in a science because you can complete the degree while completing your pre-reqs at the same time. One thing to consider is that some of the pre-reqs courses may have a pre-req course to even get into it, so it may not be as simple as it seems. It is also beneficial to have taken upper level science courses and prove that you can handle a rigorous workload.

Hope this helps guide your decision making process.

Thanks. So 2 years is more than enough to get done the med school reqs it looks like. I doubt I would be able to finish a science major in 2 years... it would probably take 3 with all the scattered pre reqs. I will just finish my B.A degree in Russian most likely, I am minoring in Mandarin Chinese as well.

rampagefc77
07-26-2010, 07:23 PM
Thanks. So 2 years is more than enough to get done the med school reqs it looks like. I doubt I would be able to finish a science major in 2 years... it would probably take 3 with all the scattered pre reqs. I will just finish my B.A degree in Russian most likely, I am minoring in Mandarin Chinese as well.

definitely possible in 2 years. All of the labs may suck... but you can handle it.

anthonyabruzzi1
07-26-2010, 07:25 PM
Major doesn't matter, can be any major.
Furthermore, the classes you need vary from state to state and school to school. But really the basic 4 you need:
1. 1 year of bio classes + labs(sometimes)
2. 1 years of gen chem + labs
3. 1 year ochem +labs
4. 1 year physics + labs(maybe)

But you also need some math classes and english classes, but you probably have that locked up as most people have to take these to graduate.
You can do pre-med in two years. I doubt it would be possible to do bio major in 2 years because of the order you have to take classes.

My advice to you is go email the premedical office in your school asap and she/he will help you reach your goals.

btw your EC look very solid, EMT and reserve are awesome things to have on your application. Despite what people tell you, you don't need research! Don't do it unless you actually have some time because your app. looks good so far.

Thanks man. I will be going into BUD/S (SEAL selection) after I graduate and hope to God I make it through. If I did make it in I could have the option of attending Special Forces medical school and be medically rated for the 8 years I am serving. I figure that would be one hell of a resume for med school, I could have dozens of surgeries and some pretty solid medical experience under my belt.

It may seem far fetched, but that has been my plan for a while. Well see what happens.

MissJuly
07-26-2010, 07:33 PM
Another PA student here, I just finished my first year. I see the pros of med school, but I can't tell you how many doctor friends have told me they wished they did PA instead.


just what everyone else says, volunteer at hospitals, shadow docs, RESEARCH, do well on MCATs. it also helps if you have connections

Good advice. Also be persistent. A lot of my friends in PA & med school didn't get in on the first try. If you have to apply again make sure you've done something to improve your application. And those MCAT/GRE prep classes really are worth the money.


@ ppl in med school: how much is it costing you for tuition per year? I know someone that came out of dental school with 250k in student loans...

Depends on the school. Mine's ridiculous for PA school at $40k per year. But I'll make at least $90k when I'm out, based on where I live. Pick up a med school guide like US News' for more info (http://www.alibris.com/search/books/invid/10253933590?cm_mmc=shopcompare-_-base-_-aisbn2-_-na).

Horns3
07-26-2010, 07:42 PM
nursing student here :( lol

rampagefc77
07-26-2010, 07:50 PM
nursing student here :( lol

Nursing is a great career man. Look into the ER- much more autonomy and fun **** going on in there for nurses compared to some of the other units.

Plus- there is plenty of room for advancement if you chose to do so i.e. NP, CRNA, etc.

NeoSeminole
07-26-2010, 08:01 PM
nursing student here :( lol

not sure if you're aware, but I believe they are changing the standards of the nursing profession to require a PhD if you decide to become an NP

rampagefc77
07-26-2010, 08:07 PM
not sure if you're aware, but I believe they are changing the standards of the nursing profession to require a PhD if you decide to become an NP

Indeed. Lots of politics behind the move and some say that they are even pushing to be called "doctor" in a clinical setting...

I'm obviously biased towards the PA profession, but several nurses I knew were in the process of becoming an NP and worked full time, took online courses at night/on the weekends, accumulated 500 hours of clinical hours, and BOOM! Medical practitioner.

moosecakes4all
07-26-2010, 08:32 PM
nursing student here :( lol

Nice man!

TheVM
07-26-2010, 09:01 PM
Thanks man. I will be going into BUD/S (SEAL selection) after I graduate and hope to God I make it through. If I did make it in I could have the option of attending Special Forces medical school and be medically rated for the 8 years I am serving. I figure that would be one hell of a resume for med school, I could have dozens of surgeries and some pretty solid medical experience under my belt.

It may seem far fetched, but that has been my plan for a while. Well see what happens.

nothing far fetched about it brah. sounds like a solid plan. medical school LOVE unique applications.

Only obstacle you might have to play around with is the MCAT. You really want to take the MCAT as soon as you are done with the classes required, but you also have to keep in mind that the MCAT scores are only valid for 3 years. So you might have to take it a few years out of school. That being said MCAT isn't too specific, its mostly general stuff that you will probably have no problem relearning again.

G-mane12
07-26-2010, 09:16 PM
How did you guys get to do research? Should I just ask one of my bio/chem professors?

rampagefc77
07-26-2010, 09:21 PM
How did you guys get to do research? Should I just ask one of my bio/chem professors?

Some schools include it in their curriculum-- I had to complete a 1.5 year capstone project to graduate. There are summer research programs at certain facilities but they are competitive. Finding a job in research post graduation is near impossible (several friends decided to wait on med school, have found nothing since graduation despite awesome resumes and countless applications). If you have a research oriented class in undergrad that lets you design.run an experiment take it.

In general though I hated research and found it to be tedious and a waste of life. Getting your hands dirty in a hospital as a CNA/EMT is far more benficial imo.

moosecakes4all
07-26-2010, 09:27 PM
How did you guys get to do research? Should I just ask one of my bio/chem professors?

Yep, just talk to your professors! I just talked to my ochem prof about it today, she agreed to let me research with her starting this fall!!! I <3 research.

rampagefc77
07-26-2010, 09:34 PM
I <3 research.

People like you make me sick ;) I did all of my research using a mutant strain of chlamydomonas and it was a pain in the ass... Spent nearly 8 months trying to determine the optical density vs. cell density relationship between wildtype and mutant -- about 15 hours each week -- and the data turned out to be useless and irrelevent to my final figures...

I wanted to slit my wrists, hopefully your experience goes better.

moosecakes4all
07-26-2010, 09:55 PM
Lol, dang dude that sucks bad! I can understand how one can get jaded after an experience like that! I am really interested in her projects and the topics and I've helped out in the lab and done my own project for the past 6-8 months so I'm excited to finally have an "official" research experience starting.

wildphucker
07-27-2010, 03:36 AM
Yep, just talk to your professors! I just talked to my ochem prof about it today, she agreed to let me research with her starting this fall!!! I <3 research.

thanks for the help brah



it seems like alot of o chem is 'heres a starting product, heres the end product, how do you get from a to b?' and asks you for a reagent. I think if I could learn all these reactions for all the functional groups, I could master organic chem within 2 months(I have to study on the side because i have a whole other semester of stuff)

I think because of this it kind of forces you to internalise the concepts ratehr than just vomit back up a textbook in an exam, which is why people might fail it because other courses allow you to do that.







http://rgr-static1.tangentlabs.co.uk/images/bau/97804714/9780471444510/0/0/plain/introduction-to-organic-chemistry.jpg


textbook im using


p.s does anyone actually do organic chem to pursue it as a career? Or do people only suffer thru it to get to med school?

T-Roach
07-27-2010, 05:25 AM
for all you MCATers..

MCAT Study Guides and Practice Tests 5 Subjects

http://i28.tinypic.com/25qb415.jpg
Biology

http://hotfile.com/dl/12626946/5f571fe/MCAT_Biology.rar.html
Organic Chemistry

http://hotfile.com/dl/12628338/820904a/MCAT_Organic_Chemistry.rar.html
Physics

http://hotfile.com/dl/12628384/82c3d52/MCAT_General_Physics.rar.html
General Chemistry

http://hotfile.com/dl/12628057/f137cfd/MCAT_General_Chemistry.rar.html
Verbal Reasoning and Mathematical Techniques

http://hotfile.com/dl/12631326/1dddbb0/MCAT_Verbal_and_Math.rar.html

T-Roach
07-27-2010, 05:27 AM
--taking them off just in case --

TallDH
07-27-2010, 05:57 AM
Most of the doctors I shadowed were either miserable or would say that if they could do it again, they wouldn't (How do you think I heard about the PA profession in the first place?). Medicine isn't what it used to be and the time and debt load is crazy. Maybe 'giving away the best years' is a bit much, but while everyone else is enjoying their 20s and early 30s, you will be studying and working 80+ hours in a hospital, only to come out with a mountain of debt.

You are correct though, do not go into medicine for the money.


That much is obvious. With the average citizen in the US thinking you make gobs of money, the taxes, and malpractice, alone you pay will be outrageous. I'm pursuing it right now and taking gen ed classes at a community college and then transferring to a 4 year for my sciences. Save a little bit of money in the long run. Yes, the future money once I'm out of debt is a big motivating factor. I'm not some hypocrite who is going to say I'm doing it primarily to help people. No, that's incorrect and a damn lie for anyone. The lure of big money and success is what partially attracts the majority of people to the medical field.

I'm 23, I've done the clubbing, drinking, partying, ect... I've run a business even. It is time to focus and get on track. I plan to get into med school by the time I'm 27-28. Looking into EM.

wildphucker
07-27-2010, 06:20 AM
That much is obvious. With the average citizen in the US thinking you make gobs of money, the taxes, and malpractice, alone you pay will be outrageous. I'm pursuing it right now and taking gen ed classes at a community college and then transferring to a 4 year for my sciences. Save a little bit of money in the long run. Yes, the future money once I'm out of debt is a big motivating factor. I'm not some hypocrite who is going to say I'm doing it primarily to help people. No, that's incorrect and a damn lie for anyone. The lure of big money and success is what partially attracts the majority of people to the medical field.

I'm 23, I've done the clubbing, drinking, partying, ect... I've run a business even. It is time to focus and get on track. I plan to get into med school by the time I'm 27-28. Looking into EM.

is 28 cutting it a bit late for med school? I realise theres no age limit for college technically, but during med school your life will pretty much be, med school.


I'm a bit worried i started at 23 since i wont have time for a long term relationship, saving up for a house, advancing career etc.....ill be a living breathing textbook for the next two years.




a comment on the 'dont go to med for the money' idea, well theres technically no profession at all which anyone would go into just for the money. There isnt a single profession I could single out which pays light years ahead of others which attracts everyone just because it pays so well/

rampagefc77
07-27-2010, 06:28 AM
is 28 cutting it a bit late for med school? I realise theres no age limit for college technically, but during med school your life will pretty much be, med school.


I'm a bit worried i started at 23 since i wont have time for a long term relationship, saving up for a house, advancing career etc.....ill be a living breathing textbook for the next two years.

No age is too late for med school depending on your life goals. I think the average age upon admittance is like 27yo currently. For some like myself the debt/time would be a factor, but for others with different goals/priorities... not a big deal at all. It isn't unheard of to have many people in their 30s, 40s, and even 50s in med school.

wildphucker
07-27-2010, 06:35 AM
What about being a bit 'behind' in life?


I'm loving it so far but alot of my friends are working and have money(they work crappiest unqualifed jobs like retail assistants, lawnmowers, labouring etc) but theyre still in the game of life while I'm sort of still in the womb.

TallDH
07-27-2010, 07:17 AM
is 28 cutting it a bit late for med school? I realise theres no age limit for college technically, but during med school your life will pretty much be, med school.


I'm a bit worried i started at 23 since i wont have time for a long term relationship, saving up for a house, advancing career etc.....ill be a living breathing textbook for the next two years.




a comment on the 'dont go to med for the money' idea, well theres technically no profession at all which anyone would go into just for the money. There isnt a single profession I could single out which pays light years ahead of others which attracts everyone just because it pays so well/


I'm glad I'm entering it around that age. I'm much more mature now than I was when I tried college at 18. Bombed my first year in college and I'm working my way back up from that. I had no real goal at 18 aside from herp derp I wanna own a business. I've accomplished that successfully and now it's time to be a grown up and do something that I can be a leader in.



What about being a bit 'behind' in life?


I'm loving it so far but alot of my friends are working and have money(they work crappiest unqualifed jobs like retail assistants, lawnmowers, labouring etc) but theyre still in the game of life while I'm sort of still in the womb.


I work in a damn office right now and am paying for my gen ed classes out of my pocket. I'm honestly thinking of quitting once I get my car payed off and applying for grants, scholarships, ect. Hopefully in a years time.

moosecakes4all
07-27-2010, 07:44 AM
thanks for the help brah



it seems like alot of o chem is 'heres a starting product, heres the end product, how do you get from a to b?' and asks you for a reagent. I think if I could learn all these reactions for all the functional groups, I could master organic chem within 2 months(I have to study on the side because i have a whole other semester of stuff)

I think because of this it kind of forces you to internalise the concepts ratehr than just vomit back up a textbook in an exam, which is why people might fail it because other courses allow you to do that.







http://rgr-static1.tangentlabs.co.uk/images/bau/97804714/9780471444510/0/0/plain/introduction-to-organic-chemistry.jpg


textbook im using


p.s does anyone actually do organic chem to pursue it as a career? Or do people only suffer thru it to get to med school?

Ya dude, its actually pretty big down here. You can go into synthetic organic chem or just about anything out of a TON of fields. One of my classmates is a chem major who plans on doing something like that. I would consider it if I wasnt going to med school.

MissJuly
07-27-2010, 09:55 AM
p.s does anyone actually do organic chem to pursue it as a career? Or do people only suffer thru it to get to med school?
Pharmacists do.


is 28 cutting it a bit late for med school? I realise theres no age limit for college technically, but during med school your life will pretty much be, med school.
Not at all. Schools love it when you have real life experience and you're not just another cookie cutter application.


What about being a bit 'behind' in life?

I'm loving it so far but alot of my friends are working and have money(they work crappiest unqualifed jobs like retail assistants, lawnmowers, labouring etc) but theyre still in the game of life while I'm sort of still in the womb.
That's why I chose PA. I didn't want to spend 4 years in school and then a couple more years in residency and specializing, and forgetting about a personal life. Now I'll be done in 3 years and be able to work in any field. Plus we know how to party way better than the med students :) Don't get me wrong though, that first year was the hardest I've ever worked at anything.

NeoSeminole
07-27-2010, 10:58 AM
That's why I chose PA. I didn't want to spend 4 years in school and then a couple more years in residency and specializing, and forgetting about a personal life. Now I'll be done in 3 years and be able to work in any field. Plus we know how to party way better than the med students Don't get me wrong though, that first year was the hardest I've ever worked at anything.

don't know how many credits it is for you but our semesters are each 20+. First one was 22 credits. If you can balance school with having a life, then I tip my hat to you. Some of my classmates have let themselves go over the course of the year, lol

TallDH
07-27-2010, 11:10 AM
don't know how many credits it is for you but our semesters are each 20+. First one was 22 credits. If you can balance school with having a life, then I tip my hat to you. Some of my classmates have let themselves go over the course of the year, lol

I would still think you can have time to go out every once in a while. Working out and lifting would be essential to keeping ones sanity in my opinion. I don't see why someone would not be able to lift for 45-60 minutes at least 3 days a week.

zpaintballer
07-27-2010, 11:25 AM
Future PA checking in.

Currently in my 3rd year of undergraduate work. Three more science classes and my prerequisites are complete!

I just finished up an EMT class and will be taking the Ntl Reg soon so I can work as an EMT and get some experience. I also volunteer at a hospital and have a close connection with one of the top PA's in California. I really hope this journey is a smooth one! My goal is to be enrolled in USC's PA program in 2013.

Mark2K8
07-27-2010, 11:30 AM
Anyone a member @ studentdoctor.net? Joined that site/forum couple minutes ago. They have a lot of members/discussions and just checking it out/using it for help/info when needed.

DeepnDirty8
07-27-2010, 12:46 PM
actually, not sure if those are the newest ones..

sooo here

MCAT Study Guides and Practice Tests

Includes:
http://i40.tinypic.com/116ujcm.jpg
Examkrackers MCAT Biology, 7e | J. Orsay | 2007 | ISBN: 1893858448 | 296 pp
Biology: Text reviews all the biology concepts tested by the MCAT. Provides nine30-minute topical exams in exact MCAT format with explanations. Alsocontains more than 400 MCAT questions with rationales.


http://rapidshare.com/files/230266599/MCAT_Biology.rar


http://i41.tinypic.com/x6g8ip.jpg
Examkrackers MCAT Organic Chemistry, 7e | J. Orsay | 2007 | ISBN: 1893858464 | 166 pp
Organic Chemistry: Text is designed to review for the organic chemistry portion of theMCAT exam. Provides four 30-minute topical exams in an exact MCATformat with explanations, and more than 150 MCAT questions withrationales.


http://rapidshare.com/files/230269917/MCAT_Organic_Chemistry.rar


http://i44.tinypic.com/t7mt13.jpg
Examkrackers MCAT Chemistry, 7e | J. Orsay | 2007 | ISBN: 1893858472 | 215 pp
Chemistry: Provides extensive explanations of all inorganic chemistry concepts forthose preparing for the MCAT exam. Offers tips and test-takingstrategies and features seven 30-minute topical exams in exact MCATformat for self-evaluation.


http://rapidshare.com/files/230268242/MCAT_General_Chemistry.rar


http://i42.tinypic.com/qx8eqa.jpg
Examkrackers MCAT Physics, 7e | J. Orsay | 2007 | ISBN: 1893858456 | 265 pp
Physics: Designed for those preparing for the physics portion of the MCAT exam.Offers insights into the concepts behind the terms and equations,supported by extensive explanations. Also provides eight 30-minutetopical exams in exact MCAT format for self-evaluation.


http://rapidshare.com/files/230269063/MCAT_General_Physics.rar


http://i44.tinypic.com/24cy4o8.jpg
Examkrackers MCAT Verbal Reasoning, 7e | J. Orsay | 2007 | ISBN: 1893858480 | 114 pp
Verbal Reasoning: Designed to review for the reasoning portion of the MCAT exam. Providesa common-sense approach to the verbal section of the exam. Includes areview of scientific notations, proportions, and graphs and offerstime-saving techniques. Features 30-minute in-class exams with answers.


http://rapidshare.com/files/230270405/MCAT_Verbal_and_Math.rar

Hey bro do you have any of those for the PCAT? Would be extremely helpful.. thanks

MissJuly
07-27-2010, 01:07 PM
don't know how many credits it is for you but our semesters are each 20+. First one was 22 credits. If you can balance school with having a life, then I tip my hat to you. Some of my classmates have let themselves go over the course of the year, lol
No doubt, I found myself in lecture about 40 hours a week and studying another 20-30 hours a week, every week of the semester. After that much work you need to have some fun! Parties are rare but when we do we make up for missing out :)


Future PA checking in.

Currently in my 3rd year of undergraduate work. Three more science classes and my prerequisites are complete!

I just finished up an EMT class and will be taking the Ntl Reg soon so I can work as an EMT and get some experience. I also volunteer at a hospital and have a close connection with one of the top PA's in California. I really hope this journey is a smooth one! My goal is to be enrolled in USC's PA program in 2013.

Good luck, I can tell you it's a GREAT program :) They value clinical experience & dedication to underserved populations a lot. PM me know if you have any questions.

oigion2
07-27-2010, 01:32 PM
I want to become a doctor but I dont really know what to do
I asked a guy in my BJJ whos a doctor at yale hospital and he told me not to stress it too much and just get my credits. (Im going to Community College and he went to CC too)

TallDH
07-27-2010, 02:16 PM
I want to become a doctor but I dont really know what to do
I asked a guy in my BJJ whos a doctor at yale hospital and he told me not to stress it too much and just get my credits. (Im going to Community College and he went to CC too)

Yeah man, don't stress it. Just concentrate on the here and now. Take one thing at a time.

rampagefc77
07-27-2010, 03:53 PM
I would still think you can have time to go out every once in a while. Working out and lifting would be essential to keeping ones sanity in my opinion. I don't see why someone would not be able to lift for 45-60 minutes at least 3 days a week.

You really don't understand the workload until you are in the program. Imagine 8 hours of grueling lectures each day, followed by another 6+ hours of studying each night. You have little time to review old lectures and you never feel that you know all of the material. many people refer to it as "trying to take a drink from a firehose," and it's a pretty accurate analogy. Taking a whole night off isn't really an option, but going out for a few hours occassionally isn't too bad.

DeepnDirty8
07-27-2010, 04:09 PM
actually, not sure if those are the newest ones..

sooo here

MCAT Study Guides and Practice Tests

Includes:
http://i40.tinypic.com/116ujcm.jpg
Examkrackers MCAT Biology, 7e | J. Orsay | 2007 | ISBN: 1893858448 | 296 pp
Biology: Text reviews all the biology concepts tested by the MCAT. Provides nine30-minute topical exams in exact MCAT format with explanations. Alsocontains more than 400 MCAT questions with rationales.


http://rapidshare.com/files/230266599/MCAT_Biology.rar


http://i41.tinypic.com/x6g8ip.jpg
Examkrackers MCAT Organic Chemistry, 7e | J. Orsay | 2007 | ISBN: 1893858464 | 166 pp
Organic Chemistry: Text is designed to review for the organic chemistry portion of theMCAT exam. Provides four 30-minute topical exams in an exact MCATformat with explanations, and more than 150 MCAT questions withrationales.


http://rapidshare.com/files/230269917/MCAT_Organic_Chemistry.rar


http://i44.tinypic.com/t7mt13.jpg
Examkrackers MCAT Chemistry, 7e | J. Orsay | 2007 | ISBN: 1893858472 | 215 pp
Chemistry: Provides extensive explanations of all inorganic chemistry concepts forthose preparing for the MCAT exam. Offers tips and test-takingstrategies and features seven 30-minute topical exams in exact MCATformat for self-evaluation.


http://rapidshare.com/files/230268242/MCAT_General_Chemistry.rar


http://i42.tinypic.com/qx8eqa.jpg
Examkrackers MCAT Physics, 7e | J. Orsay | 2007 | ISBN: 1893858456 | 265 pp
Physics: Designed for those preparing for the physics portion of the MCAT exam.Offers insights into the concepts behind the terms and equations,supported by extensive explanations. Also provides eight 30-minutetopical exams in exact MCAT format for self-evaluation.


http://rapidshare.com/files/230269063/MCAT_General_Physics.rar


http://i44.tinypic.com/24cy4o8.jpg
Examkrackers MCAT Verbal Reasoning, 7e | J. Orsay | 2007 | ISBN: 1893858480 | 114 pp
Verbal Reasoning: Designed to review for the reasoning portion of the MCAT exam. Providesa common-sense approach to the verbal section of the exam. Includes areview of scientific notations, proportions, and graphs and offerstime-saving techniques. Features 30-minute in-class exams with answers.


http://rapidshare.com/files/230270405/MCAT_Verbal_and_Math.rar
this **** gave me a ****ing virus, which proceeded to bluescreen my comp and everything. **** you!!! DO NOT DL THIS ****!

moosecakes4all
07-27-2010, 04:15 PM
this **** gave me a ****ing virus, which proceeded to bluescreen my comp and everything. **** you!!! DO NOT DL THIS ****!

SRS? I was halfway through my dl.

NeoSeminole
07-27-2010, 04:16 PM
You really don't understand the workload until you are in the program. Imagine 8 hours of grueling lectures each day, followed by another 6+ hours of studying each night. You have little time to review old lectures and you never feel that you know all of the material. many people refer to it as "trying to take a drink from a firehose," and it's a pretty accurate analogy. Taking a whole night off isn't really an option, but going out for a few hours occassionally isn't too bad.

this. Now imagine balancing school with getting enough sleep, working out, chilling with friends, and having a relationship

F23
07-27-2010, 04:18 PM
I would still think you can have time to go out every once in a while. Working out and lifting would be essential to keeping ones sanity in my opinion. I don't see why someone would not be able to lift for 45-60 minutes at least 3 days a week.

There's time to go out sometimes, but you really have to study every day to stay afloat. Most parties are right after exams.

Getting to the gym is a struggle. Pretty much everyone in my class who lifted lost size since the beginning of med school. There's time during the clinical years to make it to the gym though, depending on the rotation.

rampagefc77
07-27-2010, 04:23 PM
this. Now imagine balancing school with getting enough sleep, working out, chilling with friends, and having a relationship

Speakng of relationships, my gf is coming to visit for a week... which just so happens to be a week that we transition into a new block. So I'm going to be taking finals in anatomy, phys, pathophys, etc. while starting pharm, physical diagnosis, immunology, micro, and our systems (womens health first)....

But F23 is right, most of the time going out is after the last exam that week, and its generally to grab some food/a drink for a couple hours.

NeoSeminole
07-27-2010, 04:28 PM
Speakng of relationships, my gf is coming to visit for a week... which just so happens to be a week that we transition into a new block. So I'm going to be taking finals in anatomy, phys, pathophys, etc. while starting pharm, physical diagnosis, immunology, micro, and our systems (womens health first)...

my gf is in Detroit while I'm taking finals this week. So I don't have her around to distract me, lol

rampagefc77
07-27-2010, 05:14 PM
my gf is in Detroit while I'm taking finals this week. So I don't have her around to distract me, lol

As bad as it sounds I wish i could say the same.

B.O.L.A.
07-27-2010, 05:52 PM
You really don't understand the workload until you are in the program. Imagine 8 hours of grueling lectures each day, followed by another 6+ hours of studying each night.

You still go to lecture? lol

Bababooey100
07-27-2010, 05:59 PM
sup brahs with brains. Got a question for you guise. What does it take to be a physicians assistant or some other lower end medical field?

Long story short, I've got one bad shoulder and got into a car accident a few months ago and tore the other one in half. I run a pretty big tinting business and don't know how much longer I'll be able to do it with my shoulders in about 10 years. I've always wanted to be a Dr. but realize it's a bit late in my life to be a full fledged Dr. If there's a field I could get into with 5yrs or so I'd definitely look into it.

rampagefc77
07-27-2010, 06:03 PM
You still go to lecture? lol

Required for PA school (I attend PA school incase you haven't read the rest of the thread).

rampagefc77
07-27-2010, 06:14 PM
sup brahs with brains. Got a question for you guise. What does it take to be a physicians assistant or some other lower end medical field?

Long story short, I've got one bad shoulder and got into a car accident a few months ago and tore the other one in half. I run a pretty big tinting business and don't know how much longer I'll be able to do it with my shoulders in about 10 years. I've always wanted to be a Dr. but realize it's a bit late in my life to be a full fledged Dr. If there's a field I could get into with 5yrs or so I'd definitely look into it.

You can read my posts about my experiences in PA school. Here's a quick summary.

1) Undergrad: basically same classes as pre-med (i.e. basic sciences). Most schools will also require anatomy, physiology, micro, and some other clinically relevent courses (varies between schools, do some research). You also have to take the GRE before applying. PA schools want to take in students that have extensive work experience working with patients, and it isn't uncommon for the average accepted applicant for a program to have 2500+ hours of experience, if not more.

2) Application process: It's very competitive. Most schools accept between 20-50 students, and applicant numbers are in the 1500-2500 range for most schools (at least where I applied). They look at a combination of GPA, work experience, and GRE (among others-- letters of req, personal statement, interview, etc.).

3) PA school: Most of the professors refer to it as "med school on crack" on my campus. You'll be sitting through 8 hours of lecture each day for the first year, then a year of clinicals. (Programs may vary from 24-36 months). PA school lacks the in depth approach to biochem, and other basic sciences that med students spend much of their first year on. Instead, you get a couple months of cadaver anatomy, phys, patho, basic sciences, and then jump into the systems courses and other clinically relevent coursework (hence why many PA students take courses with the 2nd year med students if both are on the same campus).

If you have any specific questions let me know. FWIW the medical field certainly isn't any easy one to enter with bad shoulders.

moosecakes4all
07-27-2010, 06:21 PM
sup brahs with brains. Got a question for you guise. What does it take to be a physicians assistant or some other lower end medical field?

Long story short, I've got one bad shoulder and got into a car accident a few months ago and tore the other one in half. I run a pretty big tinting business and don't know how much longer I'll be able to do it with my shoulders in about 10 years. I've always wanted to be a Dr. but realize it's a bit late in my life to be a full fledged Dr. If there's a field I could get into with 5yrs or so I'd definitely look into it.
In before **** storm lulz.

But in all seriousness, 31 is not too late at all, unless you feel like it is for you personally. The median ago for med school first year is 27, so your not far off. If youve already got you college degree youll only need a year or two max of pre med pre reqs.

rampagefc77
07-27-2010, 06:36 PM
In before **** storm lulz.


haha it was poorly worded... a PA doesn't provide an inferior service compared to a physician, our scope of practice is just less expansive. As a PA you are expected to handle any patient as your MD/DO colleagues would... if the patient is beyond your scope of practice then you seek consultation.

In other specialties, you are an extension of the physician. Take surgery for instance, in the operating room you function as a first assistant, and you likely handle most of the pre/post-op care which allows the physician to dedicate more time to the OR where they are most useful. In this circumstance, you have not completed a surgical residency so you will not perform surgeries solo, but you are expected to manage every other aspect of their care just as the physician would.

Bababooey100
07-27-2010, 06:36 PM
I guess the I meant the lower end of the upper end. I'm not going to be an ass wiper. :) What really sucks is I've got one year left for a 4yr business deg. which means 2 years for an MBA, but both are virtually worthless in this job market. I know a bunch of Dr's and I'm around even more with my shoulder so I'll start asking them questions. Right now I'm just going to explore my options. If I was 18 again I would have gone straight for med school instead of screwing around with criminal justice, taking a year of computer programming, switching to business, and then dropping out after my 3rd year to work for myself. I might just wind up figuring out another business to open up.

NeoSeminole
07-27-2010, 08:10 PM
sup brahs with brains. Got a question for you guise. What does it take to be a physicians assistant or some other lower end medical field?

basically, you have three options: 1) Nurse Practitioner 2) Physician Assistant 3) Physician

NP - you would have to go through a nursing program and work for a couple years. Then you will become eligible to enter an NP program but they are changing the standards of the profession so that you are now required to get your doctorate

PA - ranked 2nd best job in the US and #1 master's degree (can you tell I'm a little bias? lol). Basically the same requirements as med school minus 1 or 2 classes and no MCAT. You have to take the GRE and it's highly recommended that you have over 2,000 hrs of clinical medical experience. PA school is also very competitive to get into b/c there are fewer PA schools than med schools

Physician - you can either become an MD or DO. The pre-reqs are the most demanding of the different options. This usually means an extra semester or two of college b/c some of the classes can only be taken in sequential order. You also have to take the MCAT, which is harder than the GRE. From what I've heard, med schools prefer applicants that stand out from the bunch. So you want to be involved in extra-curricular activities and research projects that will look impressive on your resume

MissJuly
07-27-2010, 09:31 PM
^^ Also, NPs are limited to the field in which they specialized in in school. PAs can work in any field upon graduation. Doctors have to do additional work to specialize, and are somewhat limited to their specific field.

MasonSS
07-27-2010, 11:02 PM
lol @ thread, the guy says "doctor" and the first video is something a surgeon would do, and not a doctor.



BTW, I am a surgical technologist if you are studying to be either you will know what I am.

I can help you surgeons perform surgery

MasonSS
07-27-2010, 11:04 PM
basically, you have three options: 1) Nurse Practitioner 2) Physician Assistant 3) Physician

NP - you would have to go through a nursing program and work for a couple years. Then you will become eligible to enter an NP program but they are changing the standards of the profession so that you are now required to get your doctorate

PA - ranked 2nd best job in the US and #1 master's degree (can you tell I'm a little bias? lol). Basically the same requirements as med school minus 1 or 2 classes and no MCAT. You have to take the GRE and it's highly recommended that you have over 2,000 hrs of clinical medical experience. PA school is also very competitive to get into b/c there are fewer PA schools than med schools

Physician - you can either become an MD or DO. The pre-reqs are the most demanding of the different options. This usually means an extra semester or two of college b/c some of the classes can only be taken in sequential order. You also have to take the MCAT, which is harder than the GRE. From what I've heard, med schools prefer applicants that stand out from the bunch. So you want to be involved in extra-curricular activities and research projects that will look impressive on your resume



Wow, are you a surg tech like me??


Judging from your avi. ive never met another surgical technologist outside of school for it.


That mayo stand your standing over, and the instruments your using i specialize in

F23
07-28-2010, 12:12 AM
lol @ thread, the guy says "doctor" and the first video is something a surgeon would do, and not a doctor.



BTW, I am a surgical technologist if you are studying to be either you will know what I am.

I can help you surgeons perform surgery

Surgeons ARE doctors, smarty pants.

MrAWatts
07-28-2010, 12:56 AM
Surgeons ARE doctors, smarty pants.


This.

wildphucker
07-28-2010, 01:27 AM
There's time to go out sometimes, but you really have to study every day to stay afloat. Most parties are right after exams.

Getting to the gym is a struggle. Pretty much everyone in my class who lifted lost size since the beginning of med school. There's time during the clinical years to make it to the gym though, depending on the rotation.

what about right at sunrise?


if you woke up at 5-6am, theres an hour for a workout there. Assuming each class begins at 8am.


Might have to live very close to university tho

B.O.L.A.
07-28-2010, 05:43 AM
what about right at sunrise?

if you woke up at 5-6am, theres an hour for a workout there. Assuming each class begins at 8am.

Might have to live very close to university tho

For me that lucid-minded morning period would be wasted if it's not spent studying or sleeping, so I usually study at the library, watch lecture vids, then just stop by the gym on my way home and bang out maybe 10-12 of the most intense sets possible, only takes 15-20 mins and I just keep my street clothes on. I blame my size losses on diet which has been much more difficult to maintain than workouts, especially on a budget.

TallDH
07-28-2010, 06:50 AM
For me that lucid-minded morning period would be wasted if it's not spent studying or sleeping, so I usually study at the library, watch lecture vids, then just stop by the gym on my way home and bang out maybe 10-12 of the most intense sets possible, only takes 15-20 mins and I just keep my street clothes on. I blame my size losses on diet which has been much more difficult to maintain than workouts, especially on a budget.

Yeah, I'm not talking about body building while getting through school. I'm talking about maintaining what you have.

Diet would probably be the hardest to maintain. Pizza every night, WHOO HOO!!

TheVM
07-28-2010, 07:17 AM
Anyone a member @ studentdoctor.net? Joined that site/forum couple minutes ago. They have a lot of members/discussions and just checking it out/using it for help/info when needed.
When I was doing clinical research I would spend hours upon hours on that site, lots of goof info learned, but I decided to leave that site behind. I think I gathered more than I need to know, spend too much time there and you get too neurotic.

@MissJuly hello heavenly blessed beauty

TheVM
07-28-2010, 07:25 AM
basically, you have three options: 1) Nurse Practitioner 2) Physician Assistant 3) Physician

NP - you would have to go through a nursing program and work for a couple years. Then you will become eligible to enter an NP program but they are changing the standards of the profession so that you are now required to get your doctorate

PA - ranked 2nd best job in the US and #1 master's degree (can you tell I'm a little bias? lol). Basically the same requirements as med school minus 1 or 2 classes and no MCAT. You have to take the GRE and it's highly recommended that you have over 2,000 hrs of clinical medical experience. PA school is also very competitive to get into b/c there are fewer PA schools than med schools

Physician - you can either become an MD or DO. The pre-reqs are the most demanding of the different options. This usually means an extra semester or two of college b/c some of the classes can only be taken in sequential order. You also have to take the MCAT, which is harder than the GRE. From what I've heard, med schools prefer applicants that stand out from the bunch. So you want to be involved in extra-curricular activities and research projects that will look impressive on your resume

Anesthesiology Assistant Brah!!! how can you forget that.
- Same prereqs as med school (maybe, or very similar I think there is an extra course they require)
- need to take the MCAT, but obviously the score required is lower
- 2.5 years in school (no summers off): 2 regular school years (4 semesters) + 3 summer semesters
- 100k+ salary and good hours
- the job is very similar to CRNA, you pretty much are an anesthesiologist but you work under an doctor. you do everything a regular anesthesiologist does except the hard cases you consult with the doc.
- draw backs is its still a new profession. only certain states allow you to practice, but its definitely growing.

moosecakes4all
07-28-2010, 07:48 AM
Surgeons ARE doctors, smarty pants.

LMFAO!!!!
I was like, lolwut???

NeoSeminole
07-28-2010, 08:08 AM
Wow, are you a surg tech like me??

Judging from your avi. ive never met another surgical technologist outside of school for it.

That mayo stand your standing over, and the instruments your using i specialize in

nah, I'm a PA student. The pic in my avi is from our surgical gloving and gowning lab. A surgical PA came in and showed us all the instruments they use

longshankman
07-28-2010, 08:20 AM
http://home.flash.net/~rayearle/Hfiles/HeroQust.png

sorry had to do

NeoSeminole
07-28-2010, 08:30 AM
^^^ sn made me think of this

http://theland.antgear.com/patrick_mcgoohan.jpg

longshankman
07-28-2010, 08:32 AM
yes but we will kill theirs aswell

T-Roach
07-28-2010, 08:43 AM
this **** gave me a ****ing virus, which proceeded to bluescreen my comp and everything. **** you!!! DO NOT DL THIS ****!

serious? had no problems with this..

will take off just in case

T-Roach
07-28-2010, 08:45 AM
Hey bro do you have any of those for the PCAT? Would be extremely helpful.. thanks

could only find this

http://rapidshare.com/files/369210253/Pharmacy_College_Admission_Test_PCAT.pdf.html

will try to find more later

buddhapalm
07-28-2010, 07:16 PM
What are my chances at med school?

I have not taken the MCATs yet, but I will be taking them this fall. Assuming I do well in them, here is the rest of my information.

I have taken these classes at my small local university:

Gen Bio I/II
Physics I/II
Gen Chem I/II
O Chem I/II
Precalc/Calc
Statistics I

I graduated with a 3.8 GPA and a B.A degree (foreign language).

The only extra curricular clubs I was a part of in college was the International Business Association and the Taekwondo team.

I am in the Air National Guard and have been in Pararescue (106th) for two years. I have also been a paramedic at my local hospital for 2 years. I am certified with the national registry as a PM and EMT.

I am interested in PENN Medicine, although that could be a long shot. PENN is local to me and has always been my life goal. How realistic is this goal?

Thanks for any help.

moosecakes4all
07-28-2010, 08:21 PM
What are my chances at med school?

I have not taken the MCATs yet, but I will be taking them this fall. Assuming I do well in them, here is the rest of my information.

I have taken these classes at my small local university:

Gen Bio I/II
Physics I/II
Gen Chem I/II
O Chem I/II
Precalc/Calc
Statistics I

I graduated with a 3.8 GPA and a B.A degree (foreign language).

The only extra curricular clubs I was a part of in college was the International Business Association and the Taekwondo team.

I am in the Air National Guard and have been in Pararescue (106th) for two years. I have also been a paramedic at my local hospital for 2 years. I am certified with the national registry as a PM and EMT.

I am interested in PENN Medicine, although that could be a long shot. PENN is local to me and has always been my life goal. How realistic is this goal?

Thanks for any help.

As long as you get a 30 or higher on your MCAT you will have NO issues getting in! You stats are very impressive, your working experience will be very beneficial and your non standard premed type major is a huge plus. Just study like mad for the MCAT, get you 30+, and try to impress during your interviews. Im saying you will do just fine. :)

F23
07-28-2010, 08:42 PM
What are my chances at med school?

I have not taken the MCATs yet, but I will be taking them this fall. Assuming I do well in them, here is the rest of my information.

I have taken these classes at my small local university:

Gen Bio I/II
Physics I/II
Gen Chem I/II
O Chem I/II
Precalc/Calc
Statistics I

I graduated with a 3.8 GPA and a B.A degree (foreign language).

The only extra curricular clubs I was a part of in college was the International Business Association and the Taekwondo team.

I am in the Air National Guard and have been in Pararescue (106th) for two years. I have also been a paramedic at my local hospital for 2 years. I am certified with the national registry as a PM and EMT.

I am interested in PENN Medicine, although that could be a long shot. PENN is local to me and has always been my life goal. How realistic is this goal?

Thanks for any help.


As long as you get a 30 or higher on your MCAT you will have NO issues getting in! You stats are very impressive, your working experience will be very beneficial and your non standard premed type major is a huge plus. Just study like mad for the MCAT, get you 30+, and try to impress during your interviews. Im saying you will do just fine. :)

Not so fast. The GPA is good, and working as a pararescue/paramedic is excellent, but it's by no means a guarantee. I know somebody with a 34 on his MCAT and a 3.75+ GPA (from Stanford) and was rejected from all schools during his first application cycle. Penn is a VERY competitive school to get into for anyone; you'll need an MCAT in the mid 30's to have a shot. Also, as most schools have acceptance rates in the 5-8% range, it's very hard to get into any one medical school unless you have inside connections.

I don't see any research experience on the list - research is a must these days. Also, if all the science classes were taken at a community college or something, they may be frowned upon even though they technically satisfy the requirements. The lack of significant extracurricular activities is meaningless because of the excellent work experience.

Edit: Where did you go for undergrad? This actually matters in terms of how seriously an admissions committee will take you.

G-mane12
07-28-2010, 08:48 PM
Not so fast. The GPA is good, and working as a pararescue/paramedic is excellent, but it's by no means a guarantee. I know somebody with a 34 on his MCAT and a 3.75+ GPA (from Stanford) and was rejected from all schools during his first application cycle.

did he apply late? what were his EC's?

F23
07-28-2010, 08:51 PM
did he apply late? what were his EC's?

Nope. Applied on time. Primary was in by first-second week of July.

Had some (but little) research, 1.5 years of volunteering for 3 hrs/week, started a health class at a local elementary school and accompanying student group, he had a few other things, too, but I don't remember exactly what they were. Basically average extracurriculars.

Edit: No, he didn't mess up his interviews. He's a very nice guy who can hold a conversation like everyone else.

He got in his second cycle, btw.

moosecakes4all
07-28-2010, 09:04 PM
Not so fast. The GPA is good, and working as a pararescue/paramedic is excellent, but it's by no means a guarantee. I know somebody with a 34 on his MCAT and a 3.75+ GPA (from Stanford) and was rejected from all schools during his first application cycle. Penn is a VERY competitive school to get into for anyone; you'll need an MCAT in the mid 30's to have a shot. Also, as most schools have acceptance rates in the 5-8% range, it's very hard to get into any one medical school unless you have inside connections.

I don't see any research experience on the list - research is a must these days. Also, if all the science classes were taken at a community college or something, they may be frowned upon even though they technically satisfy the requirements. The lack of significant extracurricular activities is meaningless because of the excellent work experience.

Edit: Where did you go for undergrad? This actually matters in terms of how seriously an admissions committee will take you.

You got to agree that a 34 and 3.75 with everything else in line is a good applicant. Of course, I didn't mean to come across as if hes guaranteed a spot; no one is. But all hes really missing from being an competitive candidate is research and MCAT score.

F23
07-28-2010, 09:26 PM
You got to agree that a 34 and 3.75 with everything else in line is a good applicant. Of course, I didn't mean to come across as if hes guaranteed a spot; no one is. But all hes really missing from being an competitive candidate is research and MCAT score.

MCAT score is almost half the application. All bets are off until the score comes back. Also, as I said, his undergrad university matters. If he went to some unranked state school, that 3.8 becomes a lot less impressive.

G-mane12
07-28-2010, 09:28 PM
What are my chances at med school?

I have not taken the MCATs yet, but I will be taking them this fall. Assuming I do well in them, here is the rest of my information.

I have taken these classes at my small local university:

Gen Bio I/II
Physics I/II
Gen Chem I/II
O Chem I/II
Precalc/Calc
Statistics I

I graduated with a 3.8 GPA and a B.A degree (foreign language).

The only extra curricular clubs I was a part of in college was the International Business Association and the Taekwondo team.

I am in the Air National Guard and have been in Pararescue (106th) for two years. I have also been a paramedic at my local hospital for 2 years. I am certified with the national registry as a PM and EMT.

I am interested in PENN Medicine, although that could be a long shot. PENN is local to me and has always been my life goal. How realistic is this goal?

Thanks for any help.

try and shadow some MD's bro.. Ask them for a letter of recommendation, it should help your application a little

F23
07-28-2010, 09:29 PM
try and shadow some MD's bro.. Ask them for a letter of recommendation, it should help your application a little

Eh... letters of rec don't mean much if you just shadowed somebody. Shadow, and then do a research project. THEN the letter will actually mean something.

crunchymilk
07-28-2010, 09:31 PM
2nd year med here, happy to answer any questions. Better chance by PM'ing

crunchymilk
07-28-2010, 09:32 PM
What are my chances at med school?

I have not taken the MCATs yet, but I will be taking them this fall. Assuming I do well in them, here is the rest of my information.

I have taken these classes at my small local university:

Gen Bio I/II
Physics I/II
Gen Chem I/II
O Chem I/II
Precalc/Calc
Statistics I

I graduated with a 3.8 GPA and a B.A degree (foreign language).

The only extra curricular clubs I was a part of in college was the International Business Association and the Taekwondo team.

I am in the Air National Guard and have been in Pararescue (106th) for two years. I have also been a paramedic at my local hospital for 2 years. I am certified with the national registry as a PM and EMT.

I am interested in PENN Medicine, although that could be a long shot. PENN is local to me and has always been my life goal. How realistic is this goal?

Thanks for any help.

with a GOOD interview and a GOOD MCAt you should be fine.

G-mane12
07-28-2010, 09:35 PM
Eh... letters of rec don't mean much if you just shadowed somebody. Shadow, and then do a research project. THEN the letter will actually mean something.

well the med schools i've been looking at require a letter of rec from a doctor. they don't care if you got it shadowing or doing research... they just want a letter of rec from a MD/DO

F23
07-28-2010, 09:38 PM
well the med schools i've been looking at require a letter of rec from a doctor. they don't care if you got it shadowing or doing research... they just want a letter of rec from a MD/DO

Really? Are you applying to US schools? I've never heard of that.

crunchymilk
07-28-2010, 09:40 PM
I'm gonna go ahead and post a quick story for some of you guys with not so perfect grades. I had a 1.6gpa at a major school after my freshmen year. I was lazy, and "studying" for me meant reading the material and learning for recognition, aka, I could recognize relationships etc on a test, but I couldn't recall anything. This works great in high school but not great in college. All my advisors told me to look into another career field. I said **** that. The next two years I got 4.0 after 4.0. I actually studied the right way, slow and steady always wins when it comes to studying. I pre-read and kept up with the material. I learned for recall and studied my ass off. It was worth it. Med schools loved my "story" and they loved the trend my grades were on. I got into every school I applied to (6 in Texas) except 1, the lowest ranked school in the state. I assume that was because they didn't think I would actually go there. Regardless, my point is this, if you really want this, you have to be able to work for it. Don't be a pussy and make excuses. Whatever grade you get on a test is what you deserve. No professor is out to get you, your grades are no one's responsibility but your own. Do your work and do it well, and you will get in.

moosecakes4all
07-28-2010, 09:42 PM
MCAT score is almost half the application. All bets are off until the score comes back. Also, as I said, his undergrad university matters. If he went to some unranked state school, that 3.8 becomes a lot less impressive.

Sorry, but I have to disagree with the way you are stating that. You're essentially saying that people from "ranked" universities are taken before any other students? The GPA scale is supposed to be a completely objective method of ranking students, as is the MCAT. Of course I'm not implying that every 4.0 is created completely equal, but it seems ridiculous to say that a student will have a much harder time getting into med school unless they are from a "ranked" university. How much do you reckon the difficulty varies? I've always like your posts and taken alot of your advice, but that one just seems silly.

G-mane12
07-28-2010, 09:44 PM
Really? Are you applying to US schools? I've never heard of that.

Mostly osteopathic schools. Some schools require a letter from a DO and some just want a letter from either a MD or a DO.

F23
07-28-2010, 09:46 PM
Sorry, but I have to disagree with the way you are stating that. You're essentially saying that people from "ranked" universities are taken before any other students? The GPA scale is supposed to be a completely objective method of ranking students, as is the MCAT. Of course I'm not implying that every 4.0 is created completely equal, but it seems ridiculous to say that a student will have a much harder time getting into med school unless they are from a "ranked" university. I've always like your posts and taken alot of your advice, but that one just seems silly.

Yes, the better your undergrad school -all else held equal- the more likely you are to be accepted to med school.

A guy with a 3.7 from U Penn will be perceived as having better grades than a guy with a 3.85 from Penn State and better than a guy with a 4.0 from neverheardofit U.

F23
07-28-2010, 09:46 PM
Mostly osteopathic schools. Some schools require a letter from a DO and some just want a letter from either a MD or a DO.

Oh allright. I only applied MD.

crunchymilk
07-28-2010, 09:48 PM
Sorry, but I have to disagree with the way you are stating that. You're essentially saying that people from "ranked" universities are taken before any other students? The GPA scale is supposed to be a completely objective method of ranking students, as is the MCAT. Of course I'm not implying that every 4.0 is created completely equal, but it seems ridiculous to say that a student will have a much harder time getting into med school unless they are from a "ranked" university. How much do you reckon the difficulty varies? I've always like your posts and taken alot of your advice, but that one just seems silly.

I disagree. A 4.0 is from Harvard is not the same as a 4.0 from Texas State. It just isn't. It is not an objective scale and was never meant to be. It isn't standardized in any sense of the word. The MCAT is objective because everyone on that day takes the same test on that day and the scores are standardized to give a national average. That just isn't possible with GPA. Every school is different, every professor is different, every class is diff etc. In truth, I would rather have a 3.5 at a high ranked school than a 3.9 from a state school if I was applying again.

G-mane12
07-28-2010, 09:52 PM
I'm gonna go ahead and post a quick story for some of you guys with not so perfect grades. I had a 1.6gpa at a major school after my freshmen year. I was lazy, and "studying" for me meant reading the material and learning for recognition, aka, I could recognize relationships etc on a test, but I couldn't recall anything. This works great in high school but not great in college. All my advisors told me to look into another career field. I said **** that. The next two years I got 4.0 after 4.0. I actually studied the right way, slow and steady always wins when it comes to studying. I pre-read and kept up with the material. I learned for recall and studied my ass off. It was worth it. Med schools loved my "story" and they loved the trend my grades were on. I got into every school I applied to (6 in Texas) except 1, the lowest ranked school in the state. I assume that was because they didn't think I would actually go there. Regardless, my point is this, if you really want this, you have to be able to work for it. Don't be a pussy and make excuses. Whatever grade you get on a test is what you deserve. No professor is out to get you, your grades are no one's responsibility but your own. Do your work and do it well, and you will get in.

What was your gpa and mcat when you applied?

crunchymilk
07-28-2010, 09:58 PM
What was your gpa and mcat when you applied?

Well I'm not 100% on the gpa. I was able to exclude freshmen D's and F's via my schools program, but when applying to medical school, they calculate your GPA as a whole, from every class you've ever taken.

I think it was like a 3.5 or 3.6 when I applied (without excluding), really hurt by that first semester. My MCAT was good, I got a 15 on the biology section and ended with a 35 (higher than any practice test I took)

My advice for doing well on the MCAT, Take biochem 1 and 2 and do well in them. Take harder classes. They aren't fooled by elective "A"s in history or art. They want biochems, physical chemistry etc. Upper bio and chem electives.

G-mane12
07-28-2010, 10:04 PM
My MCAT was good, I got a 15 on the biology section and ended with a 35 (higher than any practice test I took)



strong perfect score on the bio section

crunchymilk
07-28-2010, 10:07 PM
strong perfect score on the bio section

I hadn't scored above a 13 on any practice tests. I got lucky with a very difficult test. For those who don't know, you want a harder test because you can miss more and still score higher. If it's easy the curve is shifted left.

wildphucker
07-28-2010, 10:55 PM
dunno bout you guys but here our universities pretty much cover the same material.



i.e biochem courses here all use the same textbook, ask the same questions in exams etc.....it isnt like going to a more prestigious university makes your course harder than a less known one.

wildphucker
07-28-2010, 11:03 PM
also what are med schools like about any encounters with the law? Does this hurt your chances?


I realise things like assaults would weld the med school door shut permanently but what about very very minor things?

F23
07-28-2010, 11:21 PM
also what are med schools like about any encounters with the law? Does this hurt your chances?


I realise things like assaults would weld the med school door shut permanently but what about very very minor things?

Define minor.

MissJuly
07-28-2010, 11:24 PM
also what are med schools like about any encounters with the law? Does this hurt your chances?


I realise things like assaults would weld the med school door shut permanently but what about very very minor things?

Is it drugs or alcohol? I know that I can't get my board certification if I have any kind of drug or alcohol charge in the past. Not sure if that includes minor in possession or things before you were 18. I know the school I'm in still hasn't run our background checks yet even though they were supposed to before admission, but they told us to not even bother with school if you have a DUI or the like because it's just a waste of money since you'll never get your license.

wildphucker
07-28-2010, 11:53 PM
Define minor.

Fines for not having a train ticket

and one fine for car registration

these didnt go to court though and i wasnt convicted of anything, only given small fines. As far as i understand fines only go to a deb recovery office not on any records?

F23
07-28-2010, 11:56 PM
Fines for not having a train ticket

and one fine for car registration

these didnt go to court though and i wasnt convicted of anything, only given small fines. As far as i understand fines only go to a deb recovery office not on any records?

You've got nothing to worry about.

You list your location as Australia, so I don't really know the laws there. I would check with your local medical school admissions body to see if these need to be reported.

Tim035
07-29-2010, 12:17 AM
boys

I'm doing a science degree right now

now youve stopped laughing, do you think a mid D (79 avg @ unsw) can cope with the med work load?

its something im thinking about

I'm at UNSW right now (literally on a computer in wallace wurth) doing honours. I did Med Sci as an undergrad, with an overall WAM of 83.76 + GAMSAT 71 percentile, got knocked back from Usyd. Hoping to get HONS I to boost my WAM up in to HD territory + get a bit of a better mark in GAMSAT.

wildphucker
07-29-2010, 12:47 AM
I'm at UNSW right now (literally on a computer in wallace wurth) doing honours. I did Med Sci as an undergrad, with an overall WAM of 83.76 + GAMSAT 71 percentile, got knocked back from Usyd. Hoping to get HONS I to boost my WAM up in to HD territory + get a bit of a better mark in GAMSAT.

what percentile range do you need to hit to get to usyd for med school?


do you need to try again for next year?

Purepwnage
07-29-2010, 03:18 AM
im in ireland majoring mechanical engineering, doing an entry test for medicine soon (its called GAMSAT, australian and UK brahs are probably familiar with it, its similar to MCAT), hopefully after graduating i'll move to america for residency (anesthesia, neruology or internal med)

actually scores needed on GAMSAT in ireland arent as bad as australia, about 61 gets you into UCD 62 gets you into royal college and you can get into UCC/UL on 56-58s so should be okay about 70 percentile-ish

TheCurator
07-29-2010, 04:40 AM
I'm at UNSW right now (literally on a computer in wallace wurth) doing honours. I did Med Sci as an undergrad, with an overall WAM of 83.76 + GAMSAT 71 percentile, got knocked back from Usyd. Hoping to get HONS I to boost my WAM up in to HD territory + get a bit of a better mark in GAMSAT.

Your WAM (GPA) doesn't matter, as long as you have a 5.5 GPA (~credit). It's only used as a cutoff, it doesn't have any weighting in acceptance at usyd. It's all about your GAMSAT + interview marks.



what percentile range do you need to hit to get to usyd for med school?


do you need to try again for next year?

~60-62 is generally the interview offer cutoff for GAMSAT marks at usyd. I think thats about 80th percentile, not too sure though. I got 69 for my GAMSAT, which was 95th/96th percentile.

EDIT: checked, 60-62 would indeed be ~78-80th percentile

TheVM
07-29-2010, 07:10 AM
Eh... letters of rec don't mean much if you just shadowed somebody. Shadow, and then do a research project. THEN the letter will actually mean something.

you don't need to do research, such a common misconception. As long as you do something else that is productive and interesting during the summers research is irrelevant. That being said there are research universities, but even they like to take diverse students.

You do have to shadow.