how much soy would you really have to eat before it raised estrogen levels

[evilone777]

how much soy would you really have to eat before it raised estrogen levels
like if i eat 20 grams of soy protein a day will that affect me

[Naptime]

Until you get a concrete answer I would continue to eat soy. It's more than likely similar to diet drinks cause cancer. The amount of chemicals needed to actually pose a real risk of cancer would be so high that you'd need to consume something like 1-2 2L bottles of diet soda per day for years. 20g of soy is such a small amount that I would worry about it. Compare it to the amount of protein you currently take. An avg person (avg bb.com user lol) will consume close to 1g / lb bodyweight right? You're 105lbs so that's 20g soy out of 105g total protein. You're barely reaching 20% of your total protein in soy form. I'm rambling a bit but hopefully this helped you get a rough idea until someone drops some facts for us :P

[evilone777]

Until you get a concrete answer I would continue to eat soy. It's more than likely similar to diet drinks cause cancer. The amount of chemicals needed to actually pose a real risk of cancer would be so high that you'd need to consume something like 1-2 2L bottles of diet soda per day for years. 20g of soy is such a small amount that I would worry about it. Compare it to the amount of protein you currently take. An avg person (avg bb.com user lol) will consume close to 1g / lb bodyweight right? You're 105lbs so that's 20g soy out of 105g total protein. You're barely reaching 20% of your total protein in soy form. I'm rambling a bit but hopefully this helped you get a rough idea until someone drops some facts for us :P

yeah i figured you would need to get like 80%> of your daily protein intake from soy before it made a difference and thanks for the reps i figure if i start taking care of my body and lifting now i'll be pretty happy later when im not having a heart attack because im obese or some crap.that and i figure by the time im 20 i should be huge :) lol.

[Naptime]

That's something most people don't learn until they're actually obese. I feel obligated to ask if you're making sure you get enough calories. You're still growing and making sure you get enough nutrients is very important. I remember eating massive bowls of cereal for breakfast, 2 hamburgers/2milk/fries/pbsammies for lunch and some massive plate of spaghetti/mb's for dinner when I was your age... I never was overweight. Granted I was very active. What I'm saying is that what people say on these boards is aimed for the avg adult who's metabolism is much much slower than yours so eat eat eat!! :P

[evilone777]

That's something most people don't learn until they're actually obese. I feel obligated to ask if you're making sure you get enough calories. You're still growing and making sure you get enough nutrients is very important. I remember eating massive bowls of cereal for breakfast, 2 hamburgers/2milk/fries/pbsammies for lunch and some massive plate of spaghetti/mb's for dinner when I was your age... I never was overweight. Granted I was very active. What I'm saying is that what people say on these boards is aimed for the avg adult who's metabolism is much much slower than yours so eat eat eat!! :P

yeah i get plenty of food a day but i make sure its all healthy my mom says i eat to much and she can't afford to feed me lol.

[evilone777]

That's something most people don't learn until they're actually obese. I feel obligated to ask if you're making sure you get enough calories. You're still growing and making sure you get enough nutrients is very important. I remember eating massive bowls of cereal for breakfast, 2 hamburgers/2milk/fries/pbsammies for lunch and some massive plate of spaghetti/mb's for dinner when I was your age... I never was overweight. Granted I was very active. What I'm saying is that what people say on these boards is aimed for the avg adult who's metabolism is much much slower than yours so eat eat eat!! :P

about how many calories did you get when you were my age jw.

[bloodsimple1234]

simple,moderation.


it's possible to not do anything to some at all.

[AbAbber2k]

I'm no expert but I'll take a shot in the dark here.

Soy contains phytoestrogens. Consuming soy, as a result, increases the total concentration of estrogenic compounds in your body. Any "significant" serving of soy will raise your levels.

However, phytoestrogens exhibit weaker estrogenic effects compared to the estrogen already in your body when binding to receptors.

So to make a long story short... stop worrying about soy giving you man-tits.

[Insight]

another thought, which is the same question I had about test levels and fat intake, is... don't even steroid users have to pin xxx mg of test before anything happens? isn't there some minimum "threshhold dose" that needs to be reached before the endocrine system changes anything it's doing, even if test levels change?

so do you really think that eating soy is going to tip the scales that far?

this all beyond the point of whether soy raises estrogen levels to begin with.

[Sauce-head]

I'm no expert but I'll take a shot in the dark here.

Soy contains phytoestrogens. Consuming soy, as a result, increases the total concentration of estrogenic compounds in your body. Any "significant" serving of soy will raise your levels.

However, phytoestrogens exhibit weaker estrogenic effects compared to the estrogen already in your body when binding to receptors.

So to make a long story short... stop worrying about soy giving you man-tits.


Good post.... but couple more points on soy.


First off soy is not a health food; it sucks in my opinion and all the research I've done on the subject.

But for your question, the big thing with soy is whether its fermented or not. Most soy that you get (milk, Kashi etc) is heavily processed and not fermented = bad news. Things like miso or fermented soy beans are where the benefits are in soy.

Its funny how there was such a big soy push about 10 years ago, but what they didn't tell us is Asian cultures only eat fermented soy and its they defintiely do not eat as much soy as makers of Silk and Kashi want you to believe.

Stick to the true staples of protein; beef, chicken, eggs and fish.





SH

[doctapeppadoc]

honestly they dont even know if soy really does effect estrogen. it's possible that you could get all your calories frmo soy without any effect, or on the contrary, you could eat a negligible amout and have a small increase. it's probably not going to make a big differene though, i wouldnt worry. just dno't eat to much of it.

[IanGeda1]

Just stay away from it if your worried and just stick with whey protein....its the whey to go lol

[stevenjcampbell]

Personally I always had the opinion that only pro bodybuilders would need to worry so much about that.

My other take on it is simple:

You should be getting most of your protein from real food, not shakes. IMHO many people forget that protein is a SUPPLIMENT and not a meal.
I add protein to oatmeal but that is still adding it to food.

Protein is shoved in our faces at every single chance everywhere you look.

As if it's the end all and only way to get quality protein.

[MajorTwang]

.. don't even steroid users have to pin xxx mg of test before anything happens? isn't there some minimum "threshhold dose" that needs to be reached before the endocrine system changes anything it's doing, even if test levels change?

Testosterone is naturally converted to estrogen by the body. The Hypothalmic/Pituitary axis actually uses the levels of estrogen in a man's blood to regulate his testosterone levels - which is why the most effective way to regain test production after a course of steroids is to take an estrogen blocker.

The conversion tends to be a certain percentage rather than dependant on some threshold. The confounding factor with steroids is that different compounds have different conversion rates, and some compounds convert to different forms of estrogen which have greater or lesser activity. This is why some compounds are notorious for converting to estrogen and some are not.

[Buffbus]

Some anecdotal evidence here:

I have been taking 50g/day(effective dose) of soy protein isolate for the 3 months I have been cutting at 2-3 pounds a week. My moobs have actually gone away, not grown, in that time. For what it's worth I also consume whey, casein, and whole food sources along with that.

[ebbers91]

You can eat all you want and it will never increase estrogen levels, estrogen is a hormone and is therefore dependent on cholesterol, soy has no cholesterol and therefore it's impossible for it to affect hormone production

Whoever first started telling people soy will turn men into women wins biggest troll award.

Its like if everyone ears something enough it becomes fact but its simply not true

[ebbers91]

Personally I always had the opinion that only pro bodybuilders would need to worry so much about that.

My other take on it is simple:

You should be getting most of your protein from real food, not shakes. IMHO many people forget that protein is a SUPPLIMENT and not a meal.
I add protein to oatmeal but that is still adding it to food.

single chance everywhere you

As if it's the end all and only way to get quality protein. ummm, soy IS a real food buddy, ever hear of a soybean?

[stancel]

I am a former vegan. I would eat lots of soy. I even bought a big tub of soy protein. Never had man boobs.

I would imagine that maybe if you ate a huge amount of soy you might get problems. I read about a guy who had man boobs and they said it was because he drank a gallon of soy milk a day.

[Hahnda]

They consume lots of soy related foods in Japan, the incidence of breast cancer for Japanese women is very very low. like 1/9th the rate here in USA. When Japanese women come to USA and eat the Standard American Diet (SAD), their risk of breast cancer rise to the levels of American women within a generation.
Cholesterol is the precursor to the androgens like estrogen and testosterone. Aromatase is the enzyme that converts testosterone to the estrogen compounds (estradiol).
The concern is that phytoestrogens will compete for the estrogen receptor sites. But I don't know that this is actually happening.
Unless you have a family history of estrogen receptor positive cancer, I'd not worry about too much soy.
However, in Japanese history, I have heard some second hand stories that women would feed their husbands lots of soy foods to reduce their libido. I think that less animal proteins in favor of vegetable proteins would have this effect possibly due to less cholesterol available to make testosterone. More research is needed (as usual).

[Naturalham4]

The jury is certainly still out on this issue, and all the people preaching that soy increases estrogen really ought to step back. Soy isoflavones actually act in part as an anti-estrogen.