Input on Carb Load for competition

[stayfit2008]

Hey All! I am approaching my next comp two weeks from my last one which was on Oct. 3rd. I was thinking about changing things up a bit. I am doing this prep mostly on my owne this time and feel I have made some great gains.

I wanted to get peoples input on carb loading. I know this topic is individual sensative to each persons physique. here is mine. I have 4 shows under my belt,..for the first 2 I folowed the same protocal and waited til; the morning of to carb load. I did very well but was a bit flat.

3rd show I decided to carb up the night before then into sat. I did this same approach for my most recent show,..I didn't really feel much a difference other than it took me out from competing in the light masters and welterweight by 1/2 a pound,..Ha!

Since then I have been eating a bit of carbs along with a cheat meal,..today I feel full and ready to compete. With this experience,..I am considering for my next show on Oct. 17th to start my carb load Thursday eve. then through friday and Sat. morning

Any thoughts? Just wondering how you guys approach your consecutive competiton diet for back to back comps. Thanks!

[Work-Hard]

I hear great things about scoobysnacks protocal. I think he offers a service for peak week which would be worth looking into. His competitors always look great!

[Barn01]

Well I agree that waiting until morning of is too late to load. I started the night before and now I feel even that was on the conservative side so I'll be starting earlier next time ... likely Fri morning and see how that goes. I've talked to some pro's and some of them start on like Wed. Mind you when they're jacked at 220lbs I figure I don't need as much time to load up.

That's my $0.02

[fltallpaul]

Hey All! I am approaching my next comp two weeks from my last one which was on Oct. 3rd. I was thinking about changing things up a bit. I am doing this prep mostly on my owne this time and feel I have made some great gains.

I wanted to get peoples input on carb loading. I know this topic is individual sensative to each persons physique. here is mine. I have 4 shows under my belt,..for the first 2 I folowed the same protocal and waited til; the morning of to carb load. I did very well but was a bit flat.

3rd show I decided to carb up the night before then into sat. I did this same approach for my most recent show,..I didn't really feel much a difference other than it took me out from competing in the light masters and welterweight by 1/2 a pound,..Ha!

Since then I have been eating a bit of carbs along with a cheat meal,..today I feel full and ready to compete. With this experience,..I am considering for my next show on Oct. 17th to start my carb load Thursday eve. then through friday and Sat. morning

Any thoughts? Just wondering how you guys approach your consecutive competiton diet for back to back comps. Thanks!


Fit, I think you will find that carb loads work best when done a few days out...although you need to know how your body handles them before you do this. I do a refeed every week of 350 carbs right now with 210 being my daily usual...I can predict many things after doing this over the last few months. I also listened to a great interview with Dr. Joe regarding peak week strategies and why the depletion\carb up doesn't work if done wrong and often leaves competitors flat on stage and full the day after or two days later...its all about how your body responds to carbs and what you have done.

I work with Layne so I won't be too specific but I did a load early in peak week and tapered down a bit, but not much before the last 24 hours...and just did the same with my girlfriend's first show...worked great. I was as vascular on stage as I had ever been...and this year will be even better now that I know myself a little more.

Here is the interview from Dr. Joe...
http://naturalbodybuildingradio.com/bodybuilding-science/the-diet-doc-dr-joe-klemczewski

[AustrianOakJr]

I think there are lots of different ways to skin a cat. If you know your body, then you know how long it takes for the carbs to seat and how many carbs it takes to spill. I guess thats trial and error. So when you know this time frame, you can start your carb up at the right spot, load and hit the stage ready to go.....this is what I did for my first show and it worked OK and i felt pretty full. Some guys will load early, knowing they will spill, then control the spillage by tapering carbs (as Paul wrote about). Some guys stay conservative, knowing flat and tight is better than spilled and bloated.....they just bump carbs up the night before and keep the load small.......then a big carb blast of simple sugars right before the stage......this is kinda what Layne's contest prep article prescribes in the sticky (however, I know his clients receive a different protocol). This is probably the safest way to go, but you would never know your full potential of stepping out with a full muscle.

[stayfit2008]

I hear great things about scoobysnacks protocal. I think he offers a service for peak week which would be worth looking into. His competitors always look great!
pm to ss sent :)

Well I agree that waiting until morning of is too late to load. I started the night before and now I feel even that was on the conservative side so I'll be starting earlier next time ... likely Fri morning and see how that goes. I've talked to some pro's and some of them start on like Wed. Mind you when they're jacked at 220lbs I figure I don't need as much time to load up.

That's my $0.02
Thats a good way to look at it

Fit, I think you will find that carb loads work best when done a few days out...although you need to know how your body handles them before you do this. I do a refeed every week of 350 carbs right now with 210 being my daily usual...I can predict many things after doing this over the last few months. I also listened to a great interview with Dr. Joe regarding peak week strategies and why the depletion\carb up doesn't work if done wrong and often leaves competitors flat on stage and full the day after or two days later...its all about how your body responds to carbs and what you have done.

I work with Layne so I won't be too specific but I did a load early in peak week and tapered down a bit, but not much before the last 24 hours...and just did the same with my girlfriend's first show...worked great. I was as vascular on stage as I had ever been...and this year will be even better now that I know myself a little more.

Here is the interview from Dr. Joe...
http://naturalbodybuildingradio.com/bodybuilding-science/the-diet-doc-dr-joe-klemczewski
I read some stuff on that before,..I may go back and re read it,..Thanks Paul

I think there are lots of different ways to skin a cat. If you know your body, then you know how long it takes for the carbs to seat and how many carbs it takes to spill. I guess thats trial and error. So when you know this time frame, you can start your carb up at the right spot, load and hit the stage ready to go.....this is what I did for my first show and it worked OK and i felt pretty full. Some guys will load early, knowing they will spill, then control the spillage by tapering carbs (as Paul wrote about). Some guys stay conservative, knowing flat and tight is better than spilled and bloated.....they just bump carbs up the night before and keep the load small.......then a big carb blast of simple sugars right before the stage......this is kinda what Layne's contest prep article prescribes in the sticky (however, I know his clients receive a different protocol). This is probably the safest way to go, but you would never know your full potential of stepping out with a full muscle.

even tho I will start loading earlier,..it will most definitely be on the conservative side,..but I'll most likely consume some quick absorbing carbs day of the comp. I'll be watching what you do Sean,..:D

[AustrianOakJr]

even tho I will start loading earlier,..it will most definitely be on the conservative side,..but I'll most likely consume some quick absorbing carbs day of the comp. I'll be watching what you do Sean,..:D

Watching me?? YOU'RE the guy who is supposed to know what he's doing!! All I know is that I want chicken wings post contest. ;)

[stayfit2008]

Watching me?? YOU'RE the guy who is supposed to know what he's doing!! All I know is that I want chicken wings post contest. ;)

Ha! thats what I ate after my show Sat. eve. We went to a local tavern and I ordered 6 caribean style hot wings and apple pie! Yesterday I ate almost a whole box of cocoa shredded Wheat mini cereal. That was my cheat day! now back to grilled chicken and lean beef and rice!

[Ian_B]

Depends on your metabolism... guys that tend to flatten out and respond well to carbs really need to start carbing up several days out IMO.

On the other hand I've seen a few WNBF pros go right into a show without even carbing up and they look great.

Personally I think loading the morning of the show is really too late to make a huge difference.

[AustrianOakJr]

Yesterday I ate almost a whole box of cocoa shredded Wheat mini cereal.

Classic. Nice!

[FATHER FLEX]

I think there are lots of different ways to skin a cat. If you know your body, then you know how long it takes for the carbs to seat and how many carbs it takes to spill. I guess thats trial and error. So when you know this time frame, you can start your carb up at the right spot, load and hit the stage ready to go.....this is what I did for my first show and it worked OK and i felt pretty full. Some guys will load early, knowing they will spill, then control the spillage by tapering carbs (as Paul wrote about). Some guys stay conservative, knowing flat and tight is better than spilled and bloated.....they just bump carbs up the night before and keep the load small.......then a big carb blast of simple sugars right before the stage......this is kinda what Layne's contest prep article prescribes in the sticky (however, I know his clients receive a different protocol). This is probably the safest way to go, but you would never know your full potential of stepping out with a full muscle.

Yup! Many ways.

I favor the front loading because you can fill up, and then focus on cleaning up a bit. Leaving it up to Friday and Saturday, is too risky IMO. Less time to properly fill out, and if ou fill out too well. :D Spillage is something you don't want to deal with that late in the week. Although front loading might not be the best thing to do with some indivduals. Some people you have to remain consitent the whole week, others peak week, has it peaks and valleys when it come to CHO intake.

[stayfit2008]

Well,..I have solicited the skills of ScoobySnacks for this peak week strategy. I liked how his clients looked at my last show and it looks like he does the front loading method. Seeing how I am much fuller and tight a couple days after the show,.. I feel I could benefit from this technique.

[Sporto1633]

I think there are lots of different ways to skin a cat. If you know your body, then you know how long it takes for the carbs to seat and how many carbs it takes to spill. I guess thats trial and error. So when you know this time frame, you can start your carb up at the right spot, load and hit the stage ready to go.....this is what I did for my first show and it worked OK and i felt pretty full. Some guys will load early, knowing they will spill, then control the spillage by tapering carbs (as Paul wrote about). Some guys stay conservative, knowing flat and tight is better than spilled and bloated.....they just bump carbs up the night before and keep the load small.......then a big carb blast of simple sugars right before the stage......this is kinda what Layne's contest prep article prescribes in the sticky (however, I know his clients receive a different protocol). This is probably the safest way to go, but you would never know your full potential of stepping out with a full muscle.

LOL - I went "safe" with you on 900g+ of carbs :)

Sporto

[AustrianOakJr]

LOL - I went "safe" with you on 900g+ of carbs :)

Sporto

Safe so far.....we'll see what tomorrow brings. :)

[scoobysnacks]

LOL - I went "safe" with you on 900g+ of carbs :)

Sporto

You and i must do something similar thats about where Id have Austrian too on wednesday.....

[stayfit2008]

You and i must do something similar thats about where Id have Austrian too on wednesday.....

I'm anxious to see what Jason has in store for my peak!

[AustrianOakJr]

You and i must do something similar thats about where Id have Austrian too on wednesday.....

Good to know Tommy isnt crazy. He he. Honestly, i think we can go more for next week, depending on how well im able to deplete following this first show.


I'm anxious to see what Jason has in store for my peak!

He told me that he'll have you cut water on wednesday, add sodium in on thursday and then start carb loading after the night show at the pig out party. :)

HA!

Nah...I hear Tommy and Jason are pretty similar in their approach to peak week. Theres really nothing magical going on.......flush the system and load the muscle with glycogen. I guess the finer points that require expertise is how much, how long.......and I suppose that changes quite a bit depending on the individual person.

[stayfit2008]

Good to know Tommy isnt crazy. He he. Honestly, i think we can go more for next week, depending on how well im able to deplete following this first show.



He told me that he'll have you cut water on wednesday, add sodium in on thursday and then start carb loading after the night show at the pig out party. :)

HA!

Nah...I hear Tommy and Jason are pretty similar in their approach to peak week. Theres really nothing magical going on.......flush the system and load the muscle with glycogen. I guess the finer points that require expertise is how much, how long.......and I suppose that changes quite a bit depending on the individual person.

yea, but did you get the "Magic Pill",..???

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll247/stayfit2008/magic-pill-large.jpg

[AustrianOakJr]

yea, but did you get the "Magic Pill",..???

]

DAMN. I knew I should have hired Scooby. :)

[BuckSpin]

Safe so far.....we'll see what tomorrow brings. :)

I have to ask:

How deep of an insulin coma did 900g of carbs put you into?????

[stayfit2008]

I have to ask:

How deep of an insulin coma did 900g of carbs put you into?????

Todd,..I got your curiosity up to where you coming over to the Wild Sise! :D

[BuckSpin]

Todd,..I got your curiosity up to where you coming over to the Wild Sise! :D

I am debating starting a Journal here, but still not sure in that I am 2 years out....

[Sporto1633]

yea, but did you get the "Magic Pill",..???

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll247/stayfit2008/magic-pill-large.jpg

So that's what Slin-Trol looks like? :D


You and i must do something similar thats about where Id have Austrian too on wednesday.....

Our approaches are pretty similar, even though I didn't get the opportunity to get advice from the beloved Tipsta :D

Sporto

[AustrianOakJr]

I have to ask:

How deep of an insulin coma did 900g of carbs put you into?????

Last year, I literally blacked out when I had an ice cream Sunday after my show, so I avoided simple sugars on my carb up and stuck to oats and white potatos.

Even still.....The first day was like I was on drugs. Its really a cool phenomenon......and I dont know if its exaggerated for me and my body or what......but I was walking around on a cloud all day. The second day that feeling tapered a bit, but my wife thought it was a welcome change when I came home singing some weird song (cant remember off the top of my head) and dancing around the kitchen. Today, under 300g, I was pretty much back to normal level-headedness.

[TheStiffmeister]

i think the best thing you can do is get yourself contest ready like 3 weeks before the show then experiment and see what works over that time.

[stayfit2008]

i think the best thing you can do is get yourself contest ready like 3 weeks before the show then experiment and see what works over that time.

This is where I am at now.

[NextProtege]

I'm loading 300g today, 400g thursday, 600g friday, and 300 before saturday morning. Slowly dropping sodium, but not to zero, just adding more potassium rich foods like potatoes as I get closer! Any recommendations?

[AustrianOakJr]

I'm loading 300g today, 400g thursday, 600g friday, and 300 before saturday morning. Slowly dropping sodium, but not to zero, just adding more potassium rich foods like potatoes as I get closer! Any recommendations?

Thats a crap load of carbs for a 190 lb guy!! Wow. You tried that before, I assume?

[stayfit2008]

Oak,..how was your carb load yesterday? did you get everything in?

[BuckSpin]

Oak,..how was your carb load yesterday? did you get everything in?

*watches Det. StayFit interrogate Oak*

[stayfit2008]

*watches Det. StayFit interrogate Oak*

Look at you lurking in the dark corners of the internet,..:D You are really curious arn't you Todd,..hehe

[BuckSpin]

Look at you lurking in the dark corners of the internet,..:D You are really curious arn't you Todd,..hehe

I said I was giving serious thought to starting a prep Journal, but in that my target date is 9/26/11 I wasn't sure how it would be received.

[stayfit2008]

I said I was giving serious thought to starting a prep Journal, but in that my target date is 9/26/11 I wasn't sure how it would be received.

This is where I started. No better forum than the Contest Prep forum!

[AustrianOakJr]

Oak,..how was your carb load yesterday? did you get everything in?

I dont know how the man does it, but Tommy hit my number on the button. Chock freakin' full. Just started to get a TOUCH watery last night, but it was cleared up before I went to bed. Now, depending on how much I flatten will determine carb intake for fri night/sat morn......

[stayfit2008]

I dont know how the man does it, but Tommy hit my number on the button. Chock freakin' full. Just started to get a TOUCH watery last night, but it was cleared up before I went to bed. Now, depending on how much I flatten will determine carb intake for fri night/sat morn......

Scooby gave me an incredibly high number of carbs to consume next Wed. I'm actually very excited about this! so different from what Bill has me do,..But I believe I will be able to get best of both worlds out of this plan! Love the fact i can eat p-butter and sweet potatos ! I loves that shinizzle!

[AustrianOakJr]

Scooby gave me an incredibly high number of carbs to consume next Wed. I'm actually very excited about this! so different from what Bill has me do,..But I believe I will be able to get best of both worlds out of this plan! Love the fact i can eat p-butter and sweet potatos ! I loves that shinizzle!

Oh yea.....finished off last night with PB/Walden farms choc dip.....mixed up and heated in the micro......then spread over the top of two cooked bananas topping off a chocolate protein crepe. THATS a carb meal. :)

[Blazed]

Mmmmmm I had dem same crepes with sf jelly/pb and chocolate sludge last night haha.

[AniMaLizTik]

here's my plan, any input would be greatly appreciated!

Sun, Mon, Tuesday: <75 carbs, 4-5k sodium
Wednesday: 400-500g carbs, 2k sodium 1st thing in the morning
Thursday: 400-500g carbs, 1k sodium 1st thing in the morning
Friday: 175g carbs, no extra sodium
Saturday: munch on this n that to maintain, no water, high sodium

*slamming water the entire time, cutting it Friday night at 5pm


The idea is to be COMPLETELY full Thursday night, then just tighten up, get rid of extra water Friday and saturday

what you guys think?

[AustrianOakJr]

I wouldnt cut the water. You want to keep it cranking to flush.

[scoobysnacks]

here's my plan, any input would be greatly appreciated!

Sun, Mon, Tuesday: <75 carbs, 4-5k sodium
Wednesday: 400-500g carbs, 2k sodium 1st thing in the morning
Thursday: 400-500g carbs, 1k sodium 1st thing in the morning
Friday: 175g carbs, no extra sodium
Saturday: munch on this n that to maintain, no water, high sodium

*slamming water the entire time, cutting it Friday night at 5pm


The idea is to be COMPLETELY full Thursday night, then just tighten up, get rid of extra water Friday and saturday

what you guys think?

Few thoughts here.

1) I dont know where carbs were during diet, but going to below 75 grams to deplete I guess, I think is to much (but that depends on where they were leading in). I like to drop 50-65 grams tops and just train on into Weds. The body should be pretty depleted already and that drop usually does the trick, if you do an old school depletion I dont thikn you can get it back in time. Just my opinion and what Ive seen.

2)I think Weds load assuming you spread it out well could be higher.

3) Im not a fan of adding the sodium that day other than what is in food. Sodium controls extracellular water balance which during the load could put water under the skin. I would have dropped any extra sodium a couple days before the load. Then just use what is in foods, it should be enough to load. The foods should be higher in potassium and that will pull water into the muscle as potassium moves a bit higher than sodium.

4) I think Friday could be a bit higher and Id add a fat load to it or you will burn through your glycogen stores by stage time and I think end up flat again.

5) what does slamming water mean? I like to get it high ealry in the week then taper it as you are tryin to dry out. You can stop drinking, and just do sips say around 9pm, but 5pm is a bit early.

Just a few thoughts to ponder.

[AniMaLizTik]

Thanks, Ss, makes perfect sense....

[AniMaLizTik]

Oak, is that what you do?

[AustrianOakJr]

Oak, is that what you do?

Similar, but not exactly. For this comp I am loading earlier and trying to maintain most of that storage/clear out the water (really isnt any water though), then a small deplete and then a small load on friday/sat.

Now coming off the first show and going right back to back with another, my load will most likely be shifted later in the week, especially considering the knowledge ive gained this first round.......I know what I can soak up and dont have to have as much of a buffer to control spillage.

[NextProtege]

That protocol worked for me in the past but I dropped water last time. This time I'm keeping it in and adding fat friday.

[stayfit2008]

That protocol worked for me in the past but I dropped water last time. This time I'm keeping it in and adding fat friday.

I think the addition of fat Friday is vital.

[AniMaLizTik]

Similar, but not exactly. For this comp I am loading earlier and trying to maintain most of that storage/clear out the water (really isnt any water though), then a small deplete and then a small load on friday/sat.

Now coming off the first show and going right back to back with another, my load will most likely be shifted later in the week, especially considering the knowledge ive gained this first round.......I know what I can soak up and dont have to have as much of a buffer to control spillage.

I wish i had that luxery of mulitiple shows, I JUST got back from Afghanistan and this is the last show in my area except for one when I'll be on a cruise....I have ONE shot lol

[AustrianOakJr]

I wish i had that luxery of mulitiple shows, I JUST got back from Afghanistan and this is the last show in my area except for one when I'll be on a cruise....I have ONE shot lol

Just err on the side of conservative and give it the best you got.

Thanks for your service......that is great work.

[desmondpsmith1]

That protocol worked for me in the past but I dropped water last time. This time I'm keeping it in and adding fat friday.

How much fat do you add??