how much size should you loose when cutting?

[craig//nicol]

Was wondering how much size should you expect to loose from say your arms nd chest ect while preping for a comp. Im currently 7 weeks into my prep and have 9.5 weeks left.
Iv lost 16lb so far. My strength is pritty much the same as it was when i started the cut but i measured my arms yesterday and they are 0.6 inch down on what they were when i started the cut. Is this just due to depleated glycogen and fat / water loss or do you think it would be sum muscle loss also?? But like i said strength is pritty much the same so im not sure. My arms were 16.5 inch flexed with no pump and are now 16inch.
Any input is much appreciated, cheers

[Whomper107]

It will vary majorly from one person to another. Everyone tends to store fat in different places - for me, it is mostly in the legs, but for others, it may be in the stomach/upper torso. If you have lost .6" off your arms, it is likely you store a fair bit in the upper torso. There is no rule of thumb for expected measurement decreases to different areas, but if your strength has maintained well then it is most likely just fat loss.

[AustrianOakJr]

Fat makes you bigger. Dont measure yourself.....you'll just go crazy. If youre strength is staying the same, and your protein is up, just keep plugging away at a couple lbs a week. You'll be fine.

[FATHER FLEX]

Fat makes you bigger. Dont measure yourself.....you'll just go crazy. If youre strength is staying the same, and your protein is up, just keep plugging away at a couple lbs a week. You'll be fine.

Yawp! Soon as I saw my arms were no longer 17's on some days, I said the crap with this. Its going to drive me CRAZY. :D

[otongki]

If you were above 12% body fat and planning to go down to a stage ready body fat (3-4%), you'd probably lost about 1-2.5 inches of your arms' size.

But, I found out that once you get into the single digit zone and uptake your protein to about 1-1.5 gram per pound lbm, then you can gain muscle while losing fat at the same time. By this way, you can aid the size lost due to the overall weight loss by replacing them with new muscle.

I read an article in this site about gaining muscle and losing weight at the same time, but I didn't find it anymore. I think it's something to do with hormonal stuff which only works when one is lean enough. But I can tell you it works with me.

[otongki]

Yawp! Soon as I saw my arms were no longer 17's on some days, I said the crap with this. Its going to drive me CRAZY. :D

I found it weird too when my arms are getting "smaller", but when the vascularity kicks in... it looks bigger than ever. It's really is a strange thing

[craig//nicol]

thanks for all the input. yea think il stop measuring its just depressing. Cause someone said to me that i was looking bigger (even though im not its just cause im more defined and look more muscular) , so i went to measure arms, chest ect and had lost size i was like wtf

[AustrianOakJr]

But, I found out that once you get into the single digit zone and uptake your protein to about 1-1.5 gram per pound lbm, then you can gain muscle while losing fat at the same time. By this way, you can aid the size lost due to the overall weight loss by replacing them with new muscle.



Huh?

If you have found the secret to adding muscle mass while cutting through the single digits, you should contact Joe Weider immediately b/c he'll make you a rich man. In some cases, you can add some muscle when you first START dieting (maybe for a few weeks), but as a rule of thumb, once you get into single digits is hard to even MAINTAIN what you've got, and just about impossible to add muscle. If you dont have the calories, you cant build muscle. In fact, when bodyfat stores are very low, the body is more likely to tap into muscle due to the calorie deficit.

[otongki]

Huh?

If you have found the secret to adding muscle mass while cutting through the single digits, you should contact Joe Weider immediately b/c he'll make you a rich man. In some cases, you can add some muscle when you first START dieting (maybe for a few weeks), but as a rule of thumb, once you get into single digits is hard to even MAINTAIN what you've got, and just about impossible to add muscle. If you dont have the calories, you cant build muscle. In fact, when bodyfat stores are very low, the body is more likely to tap into muscle due to the calorie deficit.

Hihihi, I'll share you my "fortune".

I found out that when I was at the 6 pack zone (above 12%) and do cutting diet, I lost mostly fat regardless what my training like. But, when I enter the single digit zone and eat 1 gram protein per pound lbm, my statistics works some other way around.

My weight dropped, but my lean body mass increase (this also increase the number of my muscle size). It happens with the notion that I use the same diets and supplements as I were before.

I think this whole process of gaining muscle and cutting has to do with release of some hormones which occur only when the body is on the limit. I know there is a myth about fat change into muscle, but I think this could bend that myth.

I have to say that during all of this, about 6 months, I trained brutally and eat perfectly (I measured everything I put on my mouth).

I don't have any formal education on nutrition or weight training, all I do is just trial and errors. Too bad I haven't found any academic journal that can back my statement about this.

[CommandoSC]

Hihihi, I'll share you my "fortune".

I found out that when I was at the 6 pack zone (above 12%) and do cutting diet, I lost mostly fat regardless what my training like. But, when I enter the single digit zone and eat 1 gram protein per pound lbm, my statistics works some other way around.

My weight dropped, but my lean body mass increase (this also increase the number of my muscle size). It happens with the notion that I use the same diets and supplements as I were before.

I think this whole process of gaining muscle and cutting has to do with release of some hormones which occur only when the body is on the limit. I know there is a myth about fat change into muscle, but I think this could bend that myth.

I have to say that during all of this, about 6 months, I trained brutally and eat perfectly (I measured everything I put on my mouth).

I don't have any formal education on nutrition or weight training, all I do is just trial and errors. Too bad I haven't found any academic journal that can back my statement about this.


you gained lean mass because you weren't in caloric deficit 24/7 whole you diet, although you think you was. It's hard man even to keep size naturally in caloric deficit.

[otongki]

you gained lean mass because you weren't in caloric deficit 24/7 whole you diet, although you think you was. It's hard man even to keep size naturally in caloric deficit.

I forgot to wrote down my numbers. ^^

I was consuming roughly 500 kcal below my maintenance. My BMR at 85 kg with 176 cm is 1948. My maintenance requirements are 2980 kcal. So I ate 2500 kcal a day.

My protein is between 1 to 1.5 gram per pound LBM, my fat intake is between 40-60 gram. The rest I fill in with complex carb. I spread my foods into 6 meals with the 1st meal is the largest of them all, and minimum to none carb at the last meal.

I spend around 45 to 60 minutes a day in the gym lifting weight with additional 30 mins cardio 2-3 days a week. I adopt a DC, Max-OT, and GVT style of training (I had it on my thread).

My supplements are kept to minimum; multi, EFAs, whey, Xtend, creatine/NO. I do drink tea everyday.

At first I thought I was loosing water since my body weight kept decreasing. But when I taped it with caliper, I noticed I gained extra lean body mass. I don't know how to explain how it all happened. But I went from 88 kg to 83 kg in about 2 months while at the same time gain about 2.5 kg in muscle (body fat from 12% to 8.5%).

I read somewhere that it's about hormone manipulation, Layne Norton also mentioned about this in his video series. Is there a scientific explanation of adding muscle while cutting at the same?

[AustrianOakJr]

Is there a scientific explanation of adding muscle while cutting at the same?

Yes, its called defying the laws of physics. So, even though your body doesnt have the energy needed to carry out its basic daily functions, and its tapping into fat reserves to keep running, its spends extra energy it doesnt have to build muscle? And the key is to eat one gram of protein per lb of body mass? Most guys that have cut successfully into lower single digits will tell you that its common knowledge that you need to consume MORE than 1g per lb in order to maintain MOST of your LBM. The body just doesnt work like that. It requires ENERGY to build muscle. When you dont have it, the body will maintain at best.

[Blazed]

While I don't believe this guys voodoo logic for gaining LBM in single digit body fat in a caloric deficit, I definitely know from experience that re comping is definitely possible. Esp when noob gain come into play. If you take the average un athletic 200lb 5' 8" couch potato that has been eating 4500 dirty cals for the past few years of their life. Put them on a 3000 a day calorie diet, get them on a solid weight lifting routine, I bet that they will all gain muscle after lifting for a few months. It happened to me. Just this Oct, I had measurements go up while waist went down and weight went down.

[AustrianOakJr]

Esp when noob gain come into play. If you take the average un athletic 200lb 5' 8" couch potato that has been eating 4500 dirty cals for the past few years of their life. Put them on a 3000 a day calorie diet, get them on a solid weight lifting routine, I bet that they will all gain muscle after lifting for a few months. It happened to me. Just this Oct, I had measurements go up while waist went down and weight went down.

One of the few exceptions that I have personally witnessed as well. I agree that a guy who is 20+ % BF and just starting out can do some recomping. And I also believe its POSSIBLE (but very hard) to do some recomping as a seasoned athlete if you are riding the line of defecit/surplus, and you've got some bodyfat to spare. But we are talking about a bodybuilder cutting for a show into single digits. IMOP, this is a horse of another color. I just dont see that gaining muscle is possible given that the body is basicly in starvation mode.

[otongki]

Esp when noob gain come into play. If you take the average un athletic 200lb 5' 8" couch potato that has been eating 4500 dirty cals for the past few years of their life. Put them on a 3000 a day calorie diet, get them on a solid weight lifting routine, I bet that they will all gain muscle after lifting for a few months.

I do agree to your point about noob gain. However, the progress should be slowing down or even stopped after several weeks/months after it starts.


It happened to me. Just this Oct, I had measurements go up while waist went down and weight went down.
This is what happened with me, and I have been lifting weights and dieting for quite a while now (3 years, no skipping meal and training)


And I also believe its POSSIBLE (but very hard) to do some recomping as a seasoned athlete if you are riding the line of defecit/surplus, and you've got some bodyfat to spare.

From a perspective, seasoned athelete (those who has on and off season) are quite alike with other gym goers. I mean when they getting into on season (by cutting), they will get the similar effect to those who are just start going to the gym and dieting. The transition from bulking to cutting creates a momentum of which slows down once the body adapt to the change. Layne explain about this in his video http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/insidethelife5.htm. Although, his not mentioning exactly about recomping, but the principle of it is track alike.


But we are talking about a bodybuilder cutting for a show into single digits. IMOP, this is a horse of another color. I just dont see that gaining muscle is possible given that the body is basicly in starvation mode.

What about non-bodybuilders who already in the single digit body fat (underwear model, stripper, gogo dancer). I mean these type of field are more demanding than doing bodybuilding show of which is on average 2-3 times a year. They need to be lean year round, and they're body is fully adapt to their lean lifestyle.
Wouldn't it be possible what Blazed said about downing the waist and upping the others at the same time for these people by manipulating the protein intake while keeping the body fat down to the very low?

[AustrianOakJr]

From a perspective, seasoned athelete (those who has on and off season) are quite alike with other gym goers. I mean when they getting into on season (by cutting), they will get the similar effect to those who are just start going to the gym and dieting. The transition from bulking to cutting creates a momentum of which slows down once the body adapt to the change. Layne explain about this in his video http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/insidethelife5.htm. Although, his not mentioning exactly about recomping, but the principle of it is track alike.?

Yes, I believe that there might be some recomp possible as you switch from bulking to cutting, especially if youre bulking diet is pretty dirty. But beyond a small recomp in the first couple weeks, no.




What about non-bodybuilders who already in the single digit body fat (underwear model, stripper, gogo dancer). I mean these type of field are more demanding than doing bodybuilding show of which is on average 2-3 times a year. They need to be lean year round, and they're body is fully adapt to their lean lifestyle.
Wouldn't it be possible what Blazed said about downing the waist and upping the others at the same time for these people by manipulating the protein intake while keeping the body fat down to the very low?

The people you mention above are not bodybuilder lean. The average underwear model would not do very well on a bodybuilding stage.......but that is really irrelevant. If those people are in a caloric deficit, they arent putting on any significant muscle. The ENERGY to do the work you are suggesting is not there. Its like asking me if I can construct a building without bricks. "Well, the foundation is already there and its in a really nice spot.....and the plans are all layed out....." If there are no bricks, you cant build no matter how much you want to and think you can.

What Blazed is referencing is not the underwear model or anyone else who is "in shape". He is talking about the biggest loser type of guy who has never touched a weight in his life and has survived on cheese doodles and snack packs. I think that these types of people can do both......I "believe" (no science to back this) that these bodytypes are shocked in adapting very rapidly and because their bodyfat reserves are so high to begin with the body can use fat as energy to supplement muscle growth for a short time. This is FARRRR different from someone who is 6% bodyfat and all the alarms are going off telling the body its starving to death......there is no way that person is adding muscle. And you can manipulate protein to no end......you can consume 100% percent of your diet in straight whey proten isolate and youre not gonna add muscle.....the protein is going to be used for energy to live first.....not build muscle.

[Blazed]

I have to go with Oak on this one.

[AustrianOakJr]

I have to go with Oak on this one.

"Hear me now.......believe me latuh"

He he he. :)

[otongki]

The people you mention above are not bodybuilder lean. The average underwear model would not do very well on a bodybuilding stage.......but that is really irrelevant. If those people are in a caloric deficit, they arent putting on any significant muscle. The ENERGY to do the work you are suggesting is not there. Its like asking me if I can construct a building without bricks. "Well, the foundation is already there and its in a really nice spot.....and the plans are all layed out....." If there are no bricks, you cant build no matter how much you want to and think you can.

What Blazed is referencing is not the underwear model or anyone else who is "in shape". He is talking about the biggest loser type of guy who has never touched a weight in his life and has survived on cheese doodles and snack packs. I think that these types of people can do both......I "believe" (no science to back this) that these bodytypes are shocked in adapting very rapidly and because their bodyfat reserves are so high to begin with the body can use fat as energy to supplement muscle growth for a short time. This is FARRRR different from someone who is 6% bodyfat and all the alarms are going off telling the body its starving to death......there is no way that person is adding muscle. And you can manipulate protein to no end......you can consume 100% percent of your diet in straight whey proten isolate and youre not gonna add muscle.....the protein is going to be used for energy to live first.....not build muscle.


Six pack visibility: 12%
Photo shoot zone: 10-8%
Vein on pelvic: 6%
Stage ready zone: 3-4%

How if we compared 2 individuals, Johnny is 5.9 ft 165 lb with 8% body fat(LBM 152 lb), and Andy is 6.1 ft 189 lb with 15% body fat (LBM 160 lb). They both work at the same department of a consulting company of which they are assigned to the same project for the next quarter. They both also train together on average 1 hours a day, 3 to 4 times a week.

Nutritional wise, they both on maintenance with 3100 to 3200 kcal a day. (Johnny BMR is 1790 and Andy's is 2010 with similar level of activity). They're protein intake are 1.2 gram per pound lean body mass, 15% fat, and the rest comes from simple carbs like sweet potato and brown rice.

Johnny and Andy comes from a sporting background where Johnny was a competitive swimmer while Andy was a seasonal rugby player.

Now, they both decided to lost some fat for this summer. They begin to eat 500 kcal below their maintenance and increase their protein intake to 1.5 gram to keep their lean mass. They increase their cardio session to 3 to 4 times a week averaging 30-45 minutes every time.

My question is that, they both adapt the same principle of diet and training. They both are "retired" athletes (like most people who have career after university). Whatever diet and training, most likely they had been doing it before which makes their body already adapted to that kind of change. Would there be an "X factor" concerning that Johnny body fat is much lower than Andy? Would there be hormones which works only when one is cutting down with a pre-existence low body fat?

I think this X factor, perhaps hormones, is the key in creating the recomp effect in cut diet which only can be occurred under some special case such as low body fat, high protein intake, differentiation in training, etc.

[T3mpest]

Depends how far we take the idea of recomping. Most people even those that are in shape can recomp if they try hard enough. Im a firm believer in this. It requires alot of discipline though. Good insulin management, very good control of macros and overall calories. Basically eat just enough on workout days/recovery days to recover an gain muscle. Then on days in between slightly go below your baseline on cals and keep insulin very stable. LISS cardio works well here too. If you play the numbers right it works and doesn't require you to break the laws of physics. At times when your body is physiologically primed to build muscle you give it just enough input to do it. When your not doing that, you cut back a bit on the cals and do everything possible to make sure your body is just using fat for fuel.

With all that said I do agree with the oaks point as well. Nobody is going to drop to 6% or lower and gain muscle. Even those with great genetics would have issues recomping if they wanted to drop much below 10. At a certain point everyone's body starts to fight back when it comes to fat loss.

Anway last year I was on a recomp program. Workouts on tuesday friday. I ate over maint by about 500 on those days. Wed and saturday were about 300 over baseline. Thursday, Monday and Sundays I ate 500 below. I did LISS cardio 7 days a week for 45 minutes. Protein every day was 1.5x bw in lbs. Only low GI carbs except PWO. BCAA's 3x a day. Following this very strictly I did recomp. I started about 14%bf and ended around 10% 5 months later. Weight went down on the scale, but no by the amount the BF% would indicate. I also gained in all my lifts substancially and gained muscle according to the mirror as well.

[AustrianOakJr]

You can give me whatever scenario you want with Johnny Lightning eating oats and eggs all day and hes an olympic swimmer and John Wayne is eating spinach and chicken and hes a boxer.....it doesnt matter. The body tends to prioritize fat storage over muscle gain when you are at or below your set point (and most people dont have a set point in the single digits)......add a calorie deficit to that equation and you will struggle to MAINTAIN. What hormone allows a starving man to build muscle? At best we can trick the body to burn fat first and spare muscle.

And T3MPEST......thats a good illustration of a re-comp diet; you werent in a defecit.....a smart way to go. However, this is not the CUT diet that Otongki is talking about. And even at that, you were recomping at 10-14% BF......not single digit contest BF levels.

[Whomper107]

Six pack visibility: 12%
Photo shoot zone: 10-8%
Vein on pelvic: 6%
Stage ready zone: 3-4%

How if we compared 2 individuals, Johnny is 5.9 ft 165 lb with 8% body fat(LBM 152 lb), and Andy is 6.1 ft 189 lb with 15% body fat (LBM 160 lb). They both work at the same department of a consulting company of which they are assigned to the same project for the next quarter. They both also train together on average 1 hours a day, 3 to 4 times a week.

Nutritional wise, they both on maintenance with 3100 to 3200 kcal a day. (Johnny BMR is 1790 and Andy's is 2010 with similar level of activity). They're protein intake are 1.2 gram per pound lean body mass, 15% fat, and the rest comes from simple carbs like sweet potato and brown rice.

Johnny and Andy comes from a sporting background where Johnny was a competitive swimmer while Andy was a seasonal rugby player.

Now, they both decided to lost some fat for this summer. They begin to eat 500 kcal below their maintenance and increase their protein intake to 1.5 gram to keep their lean mass. They increase their cardio session to 3 to 4 times a week averaging 30-45 minutes every time.

My question is that, they both adapt the same principle of diet and training. They both are "retired" athletes (like most people who have career after university). Whatever diet and training, most likely they had been doing it before which makes their body already adapted to that kind of change. Would there be an "X factor" concerning that Johnny body fat is much lower than Andy? Would there be hormones which works only when one is cutting down with a pre-existence low body fat?

I think this X factor, perhaps hormones, is the key in creating the recomp effect in cut diet which only can be occurred under some special case such as low body fat, high protein intake, differentiation in training, etc.

Not sure if you have ever been in the 3-6% bodyfat range - based on what you are claiming, I am guessing you have not. Talk to anyone who has attained that leanness for a show, and they will tell you that putting on muscle was the last thing on their mind. You can manipulate your macros however you want, but regardless of how they are arranged, your total calories will still be at a deficit to maintain that leanness, and it will be impossible to gain muscle. You literally have to bust your ass just to hang onto the majority of the muscle you already have, I can't imagine how anyone would go about putting on any.

[otongki]

You can give me whatever scenario you want with Johnny Lightning eating oats and eggs all day and hes an olympic swimmer and John Wayne is eating spinach and chicken and hes a boxer.....it doesnt matter. The body tends to prioritize fat storage over muscle gain when you are at or below your set point (and most people dont have a set point in the single digits)......add a calorie deficit to that equation and you will struggle to MAINTAIN. What hormone allows a starving man to build muscle? At best we can trick the body to burn fat first and spare muscle.

And T3MPEST......thats a good illustration of a re-comp diet; you werent in a defecit.....a smart way to go. However, this is not the CUT diet that Otongki is talking about. And even at that, you were recomping at 10-14% BF......not single digit contest BF levels.

So it is possible doing re-comp for those who already have a staple diet and training regime? As far as I understood from T3MPEST, by doing caloric cycle, one body can cycle its purpose either to burn fat or build lean muscle. However, one thing that I concern is that this cycle are within days. For example Mon, Tue, Sat are high caloric days (500 above maintenance), and Wed, Thu, Sun are low cal (500 below). Do you think that the body have enough time to coop with this pace of change? It takes only 24 hours before the diet change from gaining to loosing..


Not sure if you have ever been in the 3-6% bodyfat range - based on what you are claiming, I am guessing you have not. Talk to anyone who has attained that leanness for a show, and they will tell you that putting on muscle was the last thing on their mind. You can manipulate your macros however you want, but regardless of how they are arranged, your total calories will still be at a deficit to maintain that leanness, and it will be impossible to gain muscle. You literally have to bust your ass just to hang onto the majority of the muscle you already have, I can't imagine how anyone would go about putting on any.

In fact I did, my lowest body fat was 5.6% and I weighted 70 kg. I know that when preparing for a contest, it is pointless to think about adding muscle. But, this is not what I am saying in here.

I guess you have been doing "diet" for quite a while by now, if you see your progress when you bulk or cut, did you ever come to this readings:

A. March 1st 2008, weight: 90 kg, body fat: 13%, LBM: 78.3 kg
B. May 30th 2008, weight: 84 kg, body fat: 5.3% LBM: 79.5 kg

What I am saying that during this 3 months (more less 90 days), the body weight and body fat decreased, but at the same time there is a gain in lean muscle mass. You may say it is water, but if the subject has incorporated the same diet for more that 6 months, this could be debatable.

My point is if this muscle gain (1 kilo), can be maximized by manipulating the caloric and micro intake during a caloric deficit period of diet, wouldn't be the best way of cutting?

This is where I suspect it has something to do with hormonal stuffs although I have not find any scientific explanation for this occurence. The readings above had appears several times during my cutting period, and I never know what happened behind it.

[AustrianOakJr]

So it is possible doing re-comp for those who already have a staple diet and training regime? As far as I understood from T3MPEST, by doing caloric cycle, one body can cycle its purpose either to burn fat or build lean muscle. However, one thing that I concern is that this cycle are within days. For example Mon, Tue, Sat are high caloric days (500 above maintenance), and Wed, Thu, Sun are low cal (500 below). Do you think that the body have enough time to coop with this pace of change? It takes only 24 hours before the diet change from gaining to loosing...

I never said a recomp is impossible. I only said that gaining muscle while at very low bodyfat percentages and in a caloric deficit is impossible. A recomp is very hard to do as well. And if you look at T3MPESTS' diet, he is not in a caloric deficit, he is in a slight surplus (although he might be in a deficit on certain days, he is in an overall surplus). This would explain the slow steady muscle gain.




In fact I did, my lowest body fat was 5.6% and I weighted 70 kg. I know that when preparing for a contest, it is pointless to think about adding muscle. But, this is not what I am saying in here.
.

Why is it pointless to think about adding muscle? If what you say is true, all we need to do it manipulate our protein intake and we can gain muscle while losing fat.

All I can say about your measurements is that they are probably in error. ANy BF % measurement can go a lb one way or the other depending on situational factors. I keep track of my LBM on an electrical impedence scale and my LBM swings by a few lbs depending on the day.

[otongki]

I never said a recomp is impossible. I only said that gaining muscle while at very low bodyfat percentages and in a caloric deficit is impossible. A recomp is very hard to do as well. And if you look at T3MPESTS' diet, he is not in a caloric deficit, he is in a slight surplus (although he might be in a deficit on certain days, he is in an overall surplus). This would explain the slow steady muscle gain.


Anway last year I was on a recomp program. Workouts on tuesday friday. I ate over maint by about 500 on those days. Wed and saturday were about 300 over baseline. Thursday, Monday and Sundays I ate 500 below.

T3MPEST re-comp diet:

X = maintenance kcal

Tuesday and Friday: 2 x (X + 500)
Wednesday and Saturday: 2 x (X + 300)
Monday, Thursday, and Sunday: 3 x (X - 500)

Total: 2(X+500)+2(X+300)+3(X-500) = X-100 or deficit 100 kcal below maintenance per week

General rule: 3500 kcal equals to 1 lb of mass

So, if all variable were constant (extremely discipline), weight loose weight at the rate of 1 lb per 35 weeks.

If this theory was correct, T3MPEST should be loosing weight slower than T3MPEST was (5 months is 40 weeks). And he should be just loosing weight, but then, how would you explain this claim:


I started about 14%bf and ended around 10% 5 months later. Weight went down on the scale, but no by the amount the BF% would indicate. I also gained in all my lifts substancially and gained muscle according to the mirror as well.

This claim stated that in that period of time, T3MPEST lost body fat and body weight, nonetheless gain strength and also muscle mass. How could this happens when T3MPEST is on caloric deficit diet?

And is the cycle that T3MPEST did, by allowing 2 days of caloric deficit days in a week, is enough to stimulate the body from burning fat, into building muscle?

As far as I know, like most people do, usually there is a period of bulking (excess caloric intake) and then a period of cutting (caloric deficit) of which each can last for about 2 to 12 weeks depending how much a person need it.


Why is it pointless to think about adding muscle? If what you say is true, all we need to do it manipulate our protein intake and we can gain muscle while losing fat.

When one is on a contest prep diet (12 w/o or less), with limited carb intake. It is almost useless to think about adding muscle mass, especially when it started from an off season chart. He/she should be concentrate on bringing the best conditioning to the stage, that means to come out shredded.

When it is entering a 8 or 6 weeks out it is already too late to pack more muscle on the shoulder or gain size on the biceps, since with such low body fat, it is more prone to injury by training with heavy weights than when one is doing it off season or when their body fat is relatively high.

[AustrianOakJr]

Still trying to figure out how they do math in the Netherlands.