O/T This Usain guy really is amazing.

[Chipman]

As a person who once thought of himself as a sprinter all I can say is Damn. I can just see all the running coaches looking at the criteria for what makes a sprinter and tossing it in the trash.


8Fpp6pr0Cps

[Marius_Ursus]

I suspect "enhancements" to his dietary regimen.

[glwanabe]

I was watching some of the track and field last night. I love the camera angle of following the runner from the side. You really get a good shot at the stride of the runners.

[ALBPM]

I suspect "enhancements" to his dietary regimen.


Probably lots of good Jamaican Jerk and Red Stripe Beer...:D :D

[Marius_Ursus]

Probably lots of good Jamaican Jerk and Red Stripe Beer...:D :D

Yeah, every time a Jamaican wins a race, I shout, "Hooray, Olympics!"

[Chipman]

Probably lots of good Jamaican Jerk and Red Stripe Beer...:D :D

Aw sure mon and just a touch of the Ganja for religious purposes

[snoack]

Probably lots of good Jamaican Jerk and Red Stripe Beer...:D :D



...don't forget the flower tops...

[dbx]

I watched this guy in a couple of races, and yeah, he's way ahead of anyone out there. Did you see the look on Michael Johnson's face when he shattered his record? :)

[Chipman]

I watched this guy in a couple of races, and yeah, he's way ahead of anyone out there. Did you see the look on Michael Johnson's face when he shattered his record? :)

mo6pHs0-3bQ

[batteryrequired]

Hey....my daughter is 6'4" tall and smoked everyone in sprints (100 and 200 along with 400m) She was conference champ in every one of those. Tall people can sprint!

[alec_braithwait]

I suspect "enhancements" to his dietary regimen.

Why assume the worst, is it because he's from Jamaica?

Give the guy a break, if he passes all the tests you have to assume innocent and natural, those are the rules.

[Chipman]

Hey....my daughter is 6'4" tall and smoked everyone in sprints (100 and 200 along with 400m) She was conference champ in every one of those. Tall people can sprint!

Before seeing this guy I might have argued but now I got nothin.

[dbx]

mo6pHs0-3bQ

Strange that he even equates Phelps with a runner :confused:

[ALBPM]

Why assume the worst, is it because he's from Jamaica?

Give the guy a break, if he passes all the tests you have to assume innocent and natural, those are the rules.


X2.... Sports is a way to stay away from the drugs and other troubles.

I think it's great to see a new Sprint Prodigy come along like this. The guy runs a 9.69 sec 100 meter race and holds back the last 10 meters. He'll be breaking the 100 meter WR soon. I'm just glad he pushed all the way in the 200 meter race.

Jamaica has a long tradition for turning out great sprinters. There aren't many sports in that little country - Track, Cricket and of course the Jamaican Bob Sled team....:D

[Marius_Ursus]

Why assume the worst, is it because he's from Jamaica?


Now, just why would you assume that? It's because the guy who supplied the US with juice in Athens himself made the statement, "Anything under a 9.8 is suspect," and I happen to agree.


Give the guy a break, if he passes all the tests you have to assume innocent and natural, those are the rules.

Not everyone tests to the same standard. There's no break to be given. It is what it is. I'm not accusing him, just saying that running that fast is suspect.

[Marius_Ursus]

Before seeing this guy I might have argued but now I got nothin.

And this is precisely why I'm so suspicious of science. There are too many instances of proof that something is that way because of all the other stuff around it, but in practice it usually ends up being all based on a false proposition to begin with.

Jesse Owens was 6' 5". It really seems intuitive that someone with longer legs is going to be a good sprinter simply because they don't have to take as many steps. For all the advancements that American athletes have at their disposal, for all the supplemental weightlifting, for all the superior nutrition, we don't come in as #1 nearly as much as we used to.

Look, even if this Usian Bolt dude isn't juicing, he's said publicly what his secret is.

Yams.

Not protein powder, not lifting weights three times a week, nothing like that. Just...

Yams.

Placebo? Maybe...but it's still working better than Crawford's and Dix's regimens.

[BoxingAthlete08]

wouldnt he of been found out by now if he was using performance enhancers

[Marius_Ursus]

wouldnt he of been found out by now if he was using performance enhancers

Absolutely not. Who was that runner that just got caught (I actually think she turned herself in.) just last month? And she ran in Athens.

Any search on Google will turn up loads of cases of people getting caught or turning themselves in years later.

The testing done for the Olympics is ridiculous, and in a lot of cases, isn't complete or too reliant on unchecked, uncontrolled methods, records submitted from athletes' nations, etc.

BTW, boxing rules all.

[oldcool]

Wow a forum full of haters, it would be nice to just accept a persons accomplishments and be happy for them, if it turns out later that something was amiss then so be it but for now and until further notice, that GUY is the MAN!!!

[jawter]

During this whole "Is he or is he not juicing" kind of discussion we should keep in mind that there are other things to consider.

Companies are now pouring billions of dollars into sports world wide which means that amatures can make a living off of product endoresments if they are good enough. This leads to the development of another sector of the sporting world.....Talent Scouts. Talent scouts are like stock brokers, they are out there scouring elementary level sporting events looking for children that show talent with portential to pay out. Look Phelp's swimming coach who was pushing for the young Phelps to start training for the olympics at the age of 11.


Goverments are worse with the "Puppymill" approach. The former Soviet Union and Hitler were very well known for taking very young children from parents for the sole purpose of training them for the olympics. Hell they even had a full on breeding program. China and other countries appear to be taking a similar approach today.


As professional level training inceases at earlier ages coupled with the better scouting practices its only natural that the previous human limits will be challenged and broken. Now add to that the ability to "juice" for years before entring into competions that test for performance enhancing substances a young athlete can get fantastic gains and still get "Clean" in time to look like they are all-natural.



When money is involved especially in the amounts that it is in todays sporting world I will question everything and believe the worst in high level competition.

[oldcool]

Do you get your hateraid at walmart or do you order online!!!!
There is a new subculture booming in the United States called HaterNation,

Damn how about giving props when props are due, Its funny that this guy wins 2 medals and you get all the racist ganja,rasta jokes and implications that he is juicing, Phelps wins 8 and everyone is riding his jock, the previous poster even mention Phelps but his indictment was at his coach not the athlete. What ever happened to guilty until proven innocent or now just because a guy does something that YOU cannot do HE MUST BE JUICING,

[Trace333]

I think he is awesome and he has a great fun personality!! Go BOLT!!

[Chipman]

Do you get your hateraid at walmart or do you order online!!!!
There is a new subculture booming in the United States called HaterNation,

Damn how about giving props when props are due, Its funny that this guy wins 2 medals and you get all the racist ganja,rasta jokes and implications that he is juicing, Phelps wins 8 and everyone is riding his jock, the previous poster even mention Phelps but his indictment was at his coach not the athlete. What ever happened to guilty until proven innocent or now just because a guy does something that YOU cannot do HE MUST BE JUICING,

I don't know what you guys up in goose creek are smoking that gets you all stirred up but I don't think it gives you the right to call us all a bunch of racist ganja rasta joke makers. ;)

[Jimislash]

Wow a forum full of haters, it would be nice to just accept a persons accomplishments and be happy for them, if it turns out later that something was amiss then so be it but for now and until further notice, that GUY is the MAN!!!

I think you are right, "it would be nice to just accept" it, but I don't think that being suspicious in this day and age makes a person a hater. In fact, in this time of "cheat until you get caught and then deny it" I think it is naive to just accept these performances at face value.

And it has nothing to do with him doing something that we can't do. It is doing something that nobody has ever done, in the history of sports. If you look at the recent records that have been broken in various athletic sports, then you will see that performance enhancers have played a either a proven role or a very likley role. Look no further than Roger Clemens, Barry Bonds, Marion Jones, Mark McGwire, Ben Johnson,and Sammy Sosa. I don't see how it is racist either. When Dara Torres made the Olympics, the first thing everybody was asking was for a drug test. Look at all the enhancement hoopla that Lane Armstrong created on his record breaking rides.

So, it has nothing to do with "hateraid" or "Haternation". It is more about being realistic and, perhaps, a bit calloused in a time where, as sports fans, we have been disappointed repeatedly in our heroes and their accomplishments.

[Marius_Ursus]

I think you are right, "it would be nice to just accept" it, but I don't think that being suspicious in this day and age makes a person a hater. In fact, in this time of "cheat until you get caught and then deny it" I think it is naive to just accept these performances at face value.

And it has nothing to do with him doing something that we can't do. It is doing something that nobody has ever done, in the history of sports. If you look at the recent records that have been broken in various athletic sports, then you will see that performance enhancers have played a either a proven role or a very likley role. Look no further than Roger Clemens, Barry Bonds, Marion Jones, Mark McGwire, Ben Johnson,and Sammy Sosa. I don't see how it is racist either. When Dara Torres made the Olympics, the first thing everybody was asking was for a drug test. Look at all the enhancement hoopla that Lane Armstrong created on his record breaking rides.

So, it has nothing to do with "hateraid" or "Haternation". It is more about being realistic and, perhaps, a bit calloused in a time where, as sports fans, we have been disappointed repeatedly in our heroes and their accomplishments.

Too true that in this day and age it seems we're all so jaded by the corruption we've seen in sports that we (meaning I) can't accept a win of that magnitude at face value. During lunch I read a NY Times article lamenting the same fact. I had the same feeling the writer had. I wanted to believe every second of it when he broke the world record in the 100m on Saturday in the prelims, then when he won the 200m for the gold medal...I wanted to believe. I just couldn't. There's have just been too many scandals.

By the way, thanks for straightening me out about Jesse Owens' height. I read he was 6' 5". I guess you really can't believe everything you read.

[jawter]

Do you get your hateraid at walmart or do you order online!!!!
There is a new subculture booming in the United States called HaterNation,

Damn how about giving props when props are due, Its funny that this guy wins 2 medals and you get all the racist ganja,rasta jokes and implications that he is juicing, Phelps wins 8 and everyone is riding his jock, the previous poster even mention Phelps but his indictment was at his coach not the athlete. What ever happened to guilty until proven innocent or now just because a guy does something that YOU cannot do HE MUST BE JUICING,


First don't take what I said as "Hating" because I never said anything hatefull. My comments are about "WHY" we are seeing records for speed and strength set so often.

I first hand experience and knowledge that at least one young girls parents were approched more than once by "recruiters" starting at the old age of twelve during summer swim meets. By the time this young lady reached the age of fourteen and starting highschool she made the varsity swim team as a freshman. At his point the swim coach and others where pushing, not recommending but pushing her parents to get a doctor to perscribe birth control pills and other hormones plus a variety of supplements.


Back to Phelps, do you think he would have been at his current level if he had started training at the age of 15 instead of 11? I'm not even talking about juicing just the time available for training. Between 11 and 15 males are going through some massive changes with hormones flooding the body to drive changes, it makes sense to take advantage of this time to use all those growth hormones.


Juicing, doping or whatever term one wants to use is known to occurr at all levels of competition, don't put your head in the sand and say that it doesn't after so many have been caught and or admitted to doing it. This isn't hating its called being a realist.

[dbx]

Back to Phelps, do you think he would have been at his current level if he had started training at the age of 15 instead of 11? I'm not even talking about juicing just the time available for training. Between 11 and 15 males are going through some massive changes with hormones flooding the body to drive changes, it makes sense to take advantage of this time to use all those growth hormones.

Hell, Phelps is very unique though. He has double jointed ankles, which helps him rotate/kick, he has a wing span a few inches longer than his height (which is tall as hell), and he has much less lactic acid build-up than a "normal" person does. Yeah, add those things together with a youngster who had ADD and needed to divert his energy elsewhere (in a pool), and you've got one hell of a start. Throw in a good coach and you're on your way.



Juicing, doping or whatever term one wants to use is known to occurr at all levels of competition, don't put your head in the sand and say that it doesn't after so many have been caught and or admitted to doing it. This isn't hating its called being a realist.

Nobody can argue that it happens, and I don't think most would argue that it happens and we never find out about it. Nevertheless, until discovered otherwise, we should reserve negative commentary/theories ...and just give him an "attaboy" :)

[Marius_Ursus]

Hell, Phelps is very unique though. He has double jointed ankles, which helps him rotate/kick, he has a wing span a few inches longer than his height (which is tall as hell), and he has much less lactic acid build-up than a "normal" person does. Yeah, add those things together with a youngster who had ADD and needed to divert his energy elsewhere (in a pool), and you've got one hell of a start. Throw in a good coach and you're on your way.




Nobody can argue that it happens, and I don't think most would argue that it happens and we never find out about it. Nevertheless, until discovered otherwise, we should reserve negative commentary/theories ...and just give him an "attaboy" :)

Sorry, brother. The lenses in my rose-colored glasses are cracked. ;)

[EcksOa]

Track & Field, just like many sports like cycling and football, have a long history of rampant drug use where the elite of the elite have been caught for performance enhancing drug usage. It's only natural to suspect what seemed to be unbreakable boundaries in such a context. Worse yet, the argument that extensive testing without any positive test results no longer hold much water after Marion Jones finally admitted to career long usage.

As tests improve, so will the ways to avoid detection. And with the Olympic standard, there is a forgiving margin of error for testosterone levels in the first place.

I tend to assume usage is rampant in elite levels of certain sports because history has proven it so, and because many governing bodies of certain sports have done little to send a real no-tolerance message. I think cycling is the only exception to change that recently where we saw a whole generation of the biggest names essentially banned for the rest of their careers. The semi-finals of the women's 200m saw one competitor who made the Olympics after a nice 2 year ban for usage. Not a very tough message when an athlete can be caught and still make the next Olympics.

None of that diminishes what Usain Bolt has done and will likely do in the future. There are a lot of sprinters that have used and do use. I don't think that's a secret amongst those who have competed on the elite level and still called Michael Johnson's 200m record unbreakable. So it's still amazing that anyone broke that record. Bolt is the only guy that can truly say whether he's used or not, and if he never has used, it only makes an amazing performance that much more mind-boggling.

Usage or not, it still takes great genetics, good coaching and hard work. If steroids were all it takes, a lot more athletes would have broken those records already.

[anton54]

I've got to agree with MU
Just because you test clean, doesn't mean you are clean.
As long as they know what benchmarks are used for testing they can get around them.

Even with toughened testing protocols athletes are caught all the time, meaning that they must be trying to bend/get around/or for whatever reason believe that they have the magic pill/syringe.

[crupiea]

I agree with M U!! Somethings up here. I say the same thing about Phelps too.

[alec_braithwait]

I couldn't post anything other than my first comment yesterday, I was otherwise engaged.

I am amazed at how negative and generally suspicious everyone is of any winner.

What's happened to the world today that we cannot accept things at face value?

I say give a winner the congratulations for their accomplishments and if they fail any tests later, make em pay.

If everyone is so jaded about winners, why did any of you even bother to watch the events, all the winners must be cheating one way or another. I'll cheer for the guy or gal that comes in 6th, at least we are sure they are clean. They lost.

[Marius_Ursus]

I didn't know just how ramapant the drug use was until this games. Two days ago I read about the North Korean pistol champ's use of anticonvulsives to keep his hands steady.

I may never watch the Olympics again.

[JonnyStead]

I suspect "enhancements" to his dietary regimen.

Yeah me too


Hey....my daughter is 6'4" tall and smoked everyone in sprints (100 and 200 along with 400m) She was conference champ in every one of those. Tall people can sprint!

No doubt, but whenever someone comes along and starts smashing long standing records all over the place I find myself saying :cough: Norbolethone :cough:


Why assume the worst, is it because he's from Jamaica?

Give the guy a break, if he passes all the tests you have to assume innocent and natural, those are the rules.

We do have to assume that if he passes the current tests, but his performances are insane - I'll be stunned if it doesnt turn out in the end that he isnt enhanced.

[oldcool]

First don't take what I said as "Hating" because I never said anything hatefull. My comments are about "WHY" we are seeing records for speed and strength set so often.

I first hand experience and knowledge that at least one young girls parents were approched more than once by "recruiters" starting at the old age of twelve during summer swim meets. By the time this young lady reached the age of fourteen and starting highschool she made the varsity swim team as a freshman. At his point the swim coach and others where pushing, not recommending but pushing her parents to get a doctor to perscribe birth control pills and other hormones plus a variety of supplements.


Back to Phelps, do you think he would have been at his current level if he had started training at the age of 15 instead of 11? I'm not even talking about juicing just the time available for training. Between 11 and 15 males are going through some massive changes with hormones flooding the body to drive changes, it makes sense to take advantage of this time to use all those growth hormones.


Juicing, doping or whatever term one wants to use is known to occurr at all levels of competition, don't put your head in the sand and say that it doesn't after so many have been caught and or admitted to doing it. This isn't hating its called being a realist.

Athletes today are much more advanced than years ago, some of the things and grace that Jordan displayed on the court were not even in the imaginations of the players of that age. Players made 35k per year and had full time jobs in the off season, todays athlete makes millions and does not have to worry about anything other than next season, I played Basketball and was told to NEVER NEVER lift weights during the season, and only do so very little during the off season, today players lift before and after games, things are happening faster because todays player is better human beings are continuing to evolve, when I was in school little girls did not get breast or periods in third grade, whether it is the milk or the food that we are eating we are getting stronger and living longer, . You can be cynical but I prefer to give an indivdual the benefit and honor their accomplishments rather than be a HATER. Most of us here cannot imagine the sacrifices that these individuals endure to achieve their goal, IF and WHEN it is determined that a person has beyond a shadow of a doubt taken ILLEGAL drugs THEN I will throw him under the bus along with everyone else, this is not burying my head in the sand this is understanding that because I cannot hit 70 home, or run a 4.25 I do believe it is possible for someone to do it.